Common Courtesy

[Linh]

Imo it can't just be written off as a lack of common courtesy, because it would be a significant loss on their part. As I said, this is a quite commonplace deal, trade the chance at some items for a chance at others, regardless of the outcome, and imo it's perfectly fair like that.

It is a lack of courtesy cuz they preyed on my naivety by pulling this Confidence Man tactic.

And this was a "YOYD" run. How is it a significant loss for them? It would've been a enormous loss for me whose only reason for going there was the the Behemoth Tongue. If the tongue had not dropped on my orb, I would've had to given my Shank to them and receive nothing from a "YOYD" run.

"Nothing from a YOYD run."

Cuz the only worthwhile drops from Horns of War is either Tongue, or Shank for another chance at Tongue.

[Meyi]

What server calls it shank? We call it loot.

Anyway, sounds kind of greedy to me. I can understand where you're coming from, but from a third person's point of view, it does seem greedy. Wanting BB item plus all of your items.

[Linh]

I don't think your following me here. The shout was YOYD, you asked for something that went against that, and he said yes (this is a concession as it broke the pre-established rule, the very same rule you are arguing that would've prevented you from making the deal in the first place).

He offered it in the first place by sending me a tell.

Again, all of that is kaput cuz isn't this going against the nature of common courtesy towards even your fellow man? They were trying to take something from me and in return I received nothing.

I don't know how else to describe it. A Capitalist Way of Thinking? A Republican Way of Thinking? A Confidence Man tactic?

I wanted to believe in the good-natured will of people. Not to have words be thrown about and twisted like he did.

[Linh]

What server calls it shank? We call it loot.

Anyway, sounds kind of greedy to me. I can understand where you're coming from, but from a third person's point of view, it does seem greedy. Wanting BB item plus all of your items.

no no no, it is an actual item "Beastly Shank", used to force spawn Behemoth.

If my orb had dropped a BB item, I would've gladly given them my "Beastly Shank" since I don't care for D. Ring at this point.

But if the BB item DIDN'T drop, I would've wanted to keep "Beastly Shank" to force spawn Behemoth, get his "Savory Shank" and force spawn "King Behemoth" for a chance at Tongue again.

SE: "You didn't get a Behemoth Tongue from this BCNM? Here take this Beastly Shank and kill 2 more NMs for another chance at it!"

[Zyeriis]

He offered it in the first place by sending me a tell.

Again, all of that is kaput cuz isn't this going against the nature of common courtesy towards even your fellow man? They were trying to take something from me and in return I received nothing.

I don't know how else to describe it. A Capitalist Way of Thinking? A Republican Way of Thinking? A Confidence Man tactic?

I wanted to believe in the good-natured will of people. Not to have words be thrown about and twisted like he did.

Only need to change "you asked for" to "he asked if you wanted " and "he said yes" to "you said yes" in the second sentence I made. Refer to the edit on my previous post at the bottom. He increased your chances at getting the Tongue with this deal while increasing his chances at getting the Shank. Where's the fault exactly? Other than you trying to back out because it was your turn and it hadn't dropped yet?

[Linh]

Only need to change "you asked for" to "he asked if you wanted " and "he said yes" to "you said yes" in the second sentence I made. Refer to the edit on my previous post at the bottom. He increased your chances at getting the Tongue with this deal while increasing his chances at getting the Shank. Where's the fault exactly? Other than you trying to back out because it was your turn and it hadn't dropped yet?

Because he wanted to take my Shank under a common tactic to trick naive people leaving me with nothing.

And of course I'm naive. I'm human just like anyone else with feelings. I don't WANT to believe that someone would take away my second chance at getting a BB item and leave me with no tongue.

[Zyeriis]

He's not even listening is he?

[Runespider]

Isnt this a game built around common courtesy though?

You try to do an NM, others are already there. Both groups take turns.

People generally take turns cause they fear if they don't they will get outclaimed out the wazoo, if they had a tool to insta claim and only they had it they wouldn't take turns at all, ever. I've been in positions where I asked to take turns when I arrive, they ignore or say no and I outclaim them for 4-5 in a row, then they get talkative. So no.

To OP, if you don't like it make your own group. He made the group, he makes the rules, if you don't like them don't join it.

[Arcon]

All I'm saying is I doubt he used you. If I made that kinda deal with you, I would expect the same thing as he did. It's not taking advantage of you, there's no naivety involved. As was stated before, you agreed to a certain rule, but then expected an exception to the rule.

"I lot this, you lot that."

That's all that has been said. There's no "unless" clause. There's no "but I didn't get anything so far, why shouldn't I lot now?", that's no argument at all. That would actually be unfair to him, because you had your fair chance. Sometimes you just lose, that's all there is to it. I don't believe you got tricked, it's simply a deal you agreed to (a very fair one, that is commonplace in FFXI), and as such I don't think it violates common courtesy.

[Linh]

All I'm saying is I doubt he used you. If I made that kinda deal with you, I would expect the same thing as he did. It's not taking advantage of you, there's no naivety involved. As was stated before, you agreed to a certain rule, but then expected an exception to the rule.

"I lot this, you lot that."

That's all that has been said. There's no "unless" clause. There's no "but I didn't get anything so far, why shouldn't I lot now?", that's no argument at all. That would actually be unfair to him, because you had your fair chance. Sometimes you just lose, that's all there is to it. I don't believe you got tricked, it's simply a deal you agreed to (a very fair one, that is commonplace in FFXI), and as such I don't think it violates common courtesy.

How do I lose everything in a YOYD run ;;

It's not like I live in a perpetual state of some movie where I'm expecting this type of action to be used. It's in retrospect that I see it. Like "hey, doesnt this sound familiar? Like those lawsuits of this or that which you see in random news articles?"