Dynamic Gameplay Discussed

[Akujima]

I've been up late, because my creative mind is in top gear and came up with this example of extreme dynamics. How I think future HNM or "Uber" boss battles should be. I'd like to know what you think of this type of gameplay, if it catches your interest or not.

The first little quote was taken from Natenn's "Pro-HNM" thread which was popular, but hasn't gotten much new posts. So I decided to cater to the idea of making an HNM fight more difficult regarding battle tactics, so that if claimed, there would need to be constant focus by the alliance, or risk losing their claim.

Anyhow, here goes.

There are only three possibilities for HNM "challenge"

A. A 100% win strategy is figured out, and it becomes easy.

B. It's impossible to kill (e.g. oldschool Absolute Virtue)

C. Whether you win or loose is a lottery based on what it does. Either you get lucky and win or you are unlucky and it does something and destroys you.

SOLUTION.

Alter Point C. so that it does a devastating effect when it reaches 50% HP (ensuring that all tanks, healers, mages and DD need to be topped off with near full HP to survive), instead of having it "luckily destroy you".

Mix Point A. with C. so that the win strategy changes on the fly, depending on what "Phase" the NM is in. This would force players to be on their toes all the time, raising the difficulty significantly. Have AT LEAST 3 or more of these "Phases" that would play out in a random order (very important).

The "Phase" shifting would occur at randomly timed intervals, to ensure that nobody loses focus, or that it feels too robotic. These timed intervals would also be a random amount, (such as 1, 3 and 5 minutes) and that order would never be repeated in a single fight.

EXAMPLE: Dragon Type~ NM

Phase 1: On the ground.
- The Dragon is highly susceptible to Melee Damage, but is Resistant to Magic and Ranged Attacks.
- The Dragon dishes out high Melee Damage and Enfeebles to the Front Line Jobs.
- The Melee and Tank have their work cut out for them in this stage. Melee needs to do damage quick, but not pull hate off the Tank and die. The Tank needs keep hate from the Melee so that they don't pull hate and get KO'd.

Phase 2: Standing on Hind Legs, Wings Glowing.
- The Dragon is highly resistant to Ranged Attacks and Melee Attacks, but Magic cures the Dragon or is reflected back to the caster.
- The Dragon deals incredible high AoE damage that targets a single person (hopefully the tank)
- The Melee have to get out of range quick, to avoid being KO'd by it's heavy AoE.
- The Healers have their work cut out for them in this phase. They have to make sure the Tank stays alive and is topped off to survive his massive beatings.
- The Mages need to HOLD nukes, so that the Dragon won't get healed/reflect damage to them. And possibly help out with cures and removing status effects~

Phase 3: Flying in the Air
- The Dragon is highly susceptible to Ranged Attacks and Magic Damage
- The Dragon dishes out Ranged AoE Attacks on random targets with no enmity table.
- The Entire Alliance would have to spread out, in order for their to be less damage taken as a whole. But not too far from the healers, so that they can still heal you.
- The Ranged Attackers and Mages get to work and blast him hard in this Phase.
- The Tanks and Melee position themselves so that if they get hit with an AoE blast from above, its not near other BUSY members.

Random Time rotation of Phases.

Phase 1: lasts 3 minutes
Phase 3: lasts 5 minutes ======= Section 1
Phase 2: lasts 1 minute

Phase 3: lasts 1 minute
Phase 2: lasts 3 minutes ======= Section 2
Phase 1: lasts 1 minute

Phase 2: lasts 5 minutes
Phase 3: lasts 3 minutes ======= Section 3
Phase 1: lasts 5 minutes

You can mix and match each section, and there would be countless possibilities for the Phases to be random each and every battle.

Adding this sort of extreme dynamics, would crank up the difficulty and make the fight rely heavily on focus, teamwork and coordination. Rather than it being just solely based on gear/stats/equipment.

And...

Point B. is irrelevant. Absolute Virtue was not impossible to defeat, just extremely difficult +3.

[Ravenmore]

AV little trick of locking the two hours was tryed over and over by the player base, just if you wait till it shows in the log that it 2houred it was to late to lock it. Foe something like this even for the so called "hardcore player" would have to drop something really good and not just a sidegrade.

[Akujima]

AV little trick of locking the two hours was tryed over and over by the player base, just if you wait till it shows in the log that it 2houred it was to late to lock it. Foe something like this even for the so called "hardcore player" would have to drop something really good and not just a sidegrade.

Well I've seen people around who currently have the rings that drop from AV. So unless you can obtain those rings from somewhere else, then I'm pretty sure there have been some people that have defeated AV. Granted this was post 75, but still doesn't make AV impossible.

And the example battle given above, applied to all bosses each having their own unique dynamic way to be defeated. Then I doubt people would complain. The only complaint would be of course what it dropped and how much of it. You could make it have a big drop table of various gear for mages, tanks, melee, healers and ranged attackers. Let it drop at least 1 piece for each job type, and let there be at least 2~3 different pieces for each job type.

I'm merely talking about difficulty of battle regarding dynamics. Because it seems like nowadays, if you have all the best gear then most bosses are cakewalk. It should be both: Having good/decent gear AND being skilled at battle tactics.

Obtaining better gear shouldn't make bosses easier, it should make them actually defeat-able.

[Greatguardian]

Well I've seen people around who currently have the rings that drop from AV. So unless you can obtain those rings from somewhere else, then I'm pretty sure there have been some people that have defeated AV. Granted this was post 75, but still doesn't make AV impossible.

And the example battle given above, applied to all bosses each having their own unique dynamic way to be defeated. Then I doubt people would complain. The only complaint would be of course what it dropped and how much of it. You could make it have a big drop table of various gear for mages, tanks, melee, healers and ranged attackers. Let it drop at least 1 piece for each job type, and let there be at least 2~3 different pieces for each job type.

I'm merely talking about difficulty of battle regarding dynamics. Because it seems like nowadays, if you have all the best gear then most bosses are cakewalk. It should be both: Having good/decent gear AND being skilled at battle tactics.

Obtaining better gear shouldn't make bosses easier, it should make them actually defeat-able.

I have a Minerva's and a Bellona's, AV is easy as pie. But I don't think you'd like the way AV is being killed now anyways.


(hint: It's zerged with Perfect Defense and dies in 30 seconds. Not really "Dynamic")

[Akujima]

I have a Minerva's and a Bellona's, AV is easy as pie. But I don't think you'd like the way AV is being killed now anyways.


(hint: It's zerged with Perfect Defense and dies in 30 seconds. Not really "Dynamic")

I would appreciate it, if people would stop bypassing every other point in my post and just refer to something trivial that's said which makes up 1% of the discussion.

You seem to just want to bash peoples good ideas, because you're not talking about anything positive towards how to create more dynamic boss battles. Instead you imply that I'm a "Noob" because I don't Zerg everything like you do. Same sort of stuff that happened in the "A Ninja without Throwing" thread. Try something new and different, please.

And if you didn't already realize, the point of this thread is how to take "Zerging" out of the game.

[Bulrogg]

What if a mob had multiple points of attack, similar to the way a Fortification has four sides you can attack, and you have to attack those first to weakening the main point of attack. Probably not do-able but I recall a few battles like that in other FF series.

[Leonlionheart]

the point of this thread is how to take "Zerging" out of the game.

I like zerging :[ it makes my e-peen hard

[Greatguardian]

I would appreciate it, if people would stop bypassing every other point in my post and just refer to something trivial that's said which makes up 1% of the discussion.

You seem to just want to bash peoples good ideas, because you're not talking about anything positive towards how to create more dynamic boss battles. Instead you imply that I'm a "Noob" because I don't Zerg everything like you do. Same sort of stuff that happened in the "A Ninja without Throwing" thread. Try something new and different, please.

And if you didn't already realize, the point of this thread is how to take "Zerging" out of the game.

I thought my point was very relevant. You said that AV was not impossible (it was), it was just incredibly difficult (it's not when it's zerged). It was implied that you believed players were able to kill AV without zerging, and they're not. You cited the fact that people have AV items as proof, and I'm telling you that even I have AV items and my shell most definitely does not kill AV without zerging. Heck, most of the time we kill it with 10~ or so.

All of this goes back to your post a few lines up, wherein you said that "Point B is irrelevant". It is not, and that is why. AV was most certainly impossible, and most certainly still is impossible to kill in the "Normal", "Dynamic" way.

Also, saying that I bash people's good ideas implies that the ideas I "bash" are good. When you present a case, you leave yourself open to criticism. I have not launched any personal attacks against you. I am simply saying that certain points you present are patently incorrect. It is then your responsibility as the presenter of the idea to either dispute my claim, or accept my claim and change your presentation in such a way that it would no longer be incorrect.

[Akujima]

It is then your responsibility as the presenter of the idea to either dispute my claim, or accept my claim and change your presentation in such a way that it would no longer be incorrect.

Even if AV was "Impossible" because of an obvious Flaw in Dynamics from the developers, doesn't mean that the solution should be to just get rid of dynamics entirely and result to the "Zerg Method".

If a fight becomes literally IMPOSSIBLE, then the dynamics are obviously flawed somehow and need to be adjusted.

Point proved.

[Greatguardian]

Even if AV was "Impossible" because of an obvious Flaw in Dynamics from the developers, doesn't mean that the solution should be to just get rid of dynamics entirely and result to the "Zerg Method".

If a fight becomes literally IMPOSSIBLE, then the dynamics are obviously flawed somehow and need to be adjusted.

Point proved.

Oh. I didn't know we were discussing tautologies. If that's the case, I should probably contribute something meaningful to the discussion.

Water is wet.