Development Team Downsizing and Justification Makes no Sense

[Uriah]

Uh huh. Here's your humble pie.

[Pixela]

Making the PS2 dev environment run on a PC doesn't address the issues of continuing to devleop a game in 2023 using tools designed in 2003 or earlier.

It's nowhere near as complicated to make new dev tools as you think it is, your viewpoint is skewed by Unreal Engine 3 and this is nothing like that.

They just need to make standalone programs on the PC (players have been doing this since 2004 on a smaller scale) that have a user interface to allow devs to make content and spit out files XI understands, it's really not anywhere near as hard as you think it is.

They don't need to replicate ps2 devkits.

[DoctooOkay]

They just need to make standalone programs on the PC (players have been doing this since 2004 on a smaller scale) that have a user interface to allow devs to make content and spit out files XI understands, it's really not anywhere near as hard as you think it is.

I've worked in software long enough to know that the gap between what needs to be done and actually having the team, tools, and budget in place to execute is large. I expect that Fujito is making decisions based on the budget he's been given and what he feels are the best steps to ensure FFXI stays online. Whether or not you or I agree with that is a different matter all together (and frankly is kind of moot)

[Tarmarkvar]

I'm lost. Didn't they completely stop using the PS2 dev kits in 2016 when they stopped supporting console versions of this game?

[Alhanelem]

It's nowhere near as complicated to make new dev tools as you think it is, your viewpoint is skewed by Unreal Engine 3 and this is nothing like that.

It is absolutely a lot like that. Tools are tools. UE3 is an engine with tools. The devs built their own game engine and used tools designed to build PS2 era games. It's exactly the same thing. The fact that the community has made various tools is irrelevant. Those tools weren't used to develop the game, they were used to develop things that can interact with it. They were also made by people in their spare time, not as a career, so while many of the people involved in various community tools and such probably are professional developers, they developed these tools you refer to with far less time and resources, and the standards of professional development demand more than that.

And the other issue is one that the devs explained- By keeping their developers on the project full time, they are limiting their growth as developers by forcing them to keep working with old technology. Now, this isn't always bad, if you know how to program in FORTRAN you're probably making a lot of money working on antiquated computer equipment still being used by the federal government. But game development tends to stay on the bleeding edge of technology, so it generally isn't great for career prospects to be a master at working with a 20 year old game engine.

I'm lost. Didn't they completely stop using the PS2 dev kits in 2016 when they stopped supporting console versions of this game?

No. The game was originally developed on and for the PS2. To make the game work on PC they basically used a wrapper to translate PS2 stuff to PC. They still need tools designed for the original game unless they rebuild the entire thing essentially from the ground up. So while not being on console means they can exceed certain limitations (especially memory and disk space), it does not mean they aren't still bound by antiquated development systems, tools and processes.

[Pixela]

Which is why they don't state they are doing it even if they are.

[Alhanelem]

But you can't simply assume they are doing this or that without them saying so, and why you really need to stop just assuming the worst every time some sort of development related news breaks.

[Sp1cyryan]

But you can't simply assume they are doing this or that without them saying so, and why you really need to stop just assuming the worst every time some sort of development related news breaks.

Most of what they do is assume.

[Voidstorm]

Which is why they don't state they are doing it even if they are.

then they never should have mentioned that they were moving staff off FFXI.

[Pixela]

then they never should have mentioned that they were moving staff off FFXI.

True, nothing they are doing makes sense at face value.

I think they are upto something, we will see though.