Ranged Trust clips through ceiling of Toraimarai Canal causing issues

[Elliander]

Operating System:
Windows 10

ISP:
Charter

Type of Internet Connection:
Cable

Internet Connection Speed:
335.3 Mbit/s Download, 4.27 Mbit/s Upload

Date & Time:
March 22bd, 2023
9:35 PM CST

Frequency:
Almost Always

Character Name:
Elliander

Race:
Race of your character when the issue occurred.
TarutaruM

World:
Siren

Main Job:
WHM, Level 96

Support Job:
Black Mage

Area and Coordinates:
Toraimarai Canal, Map 2, (E-9)

Party or Solo:
Solo

NPC Name:
None

Monster Name:
Blackwater Pugil

Steps:
Detailed steps on how the issue occurred.

1.) Go into the Canals solo.
2.) Summon trusts to fight with, including Trust: Semih Lafihna
3.) Enter the parts with low ceilings (i.e. in the waterway tunnels, but it also happened in other parts of this zone)
4.) Begin auto attack of any monster.
5.) During combat Semih Lafihna will try to stay at a distance during the mob and during this time appears to have a chance of clipping through the ceiling. It doesn't happen all the time, but it happens fairly often. I don't know if it's related to what may be above the ceiling or some other factor. It never seems to occur while close to the player and seems to happen more frequently when I am running through the tunnels attacking one mob after another in a sequence so the player moving farther from her when combat starts might or might not be a factor.
6.) While Semih Lafihna is in the ceiling she cannot be targeted with spells. I tried casting Haste on her and the error I received was "Elliander cannot perform that action." however no such error occurs when she is not in the ceiling. More critically, I also got that error when trying to cast a cure on her. Being in the ceiling doesn't appear to prevent her from attacking enemies or being attacked by them, but it does prevent me from interacting with her.
7.) After the battle is concluded she immediately returns from the ceiling.

What you were doing when the issue occurred.
Battle

[Afin]

this issue is also in garliage citadel too, trust terrain issues, either the trusts getting stuck on pathing or dropping down holes and then getting stuck. I did ask about this issue years ago and the only reply i recieved was to re-summon trusts, a bit annoying if you do not have many trusts with a 3 minute cooldown in the middle of aggro monsters. https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/t...Terrain-issues

[Elliander]

this issue is also in garliage citadel too, trust terrain issues, either the trusts getting stuck on pathing or dropping down holes and then getting stuck. I did ask about this issue years ago and the only reply i recieved was to re-summon trusts, a bit annoying if you do not have many trusts with a 3 minute cooldown in the middle of aggro monsters. https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/t...Terrain-issues

They told you to re-summon trusts? lol... Since clipping through the ceiling only happens during combat, and since you can't summon trusts at all while in combat, that wouldn't be a viable workaround. Even if I could summon during combat I can't summon a trust that's already out and I can't dismiss a trust if I cannot interact with them. For the issue you encountered are you able to dismiss and resummon a trust that's fallen down a hole?

Maybe if they made the following changes it would be a viable workaround:

- Get rid of the 4 minute recast timer
- Allow you to summon a Trust even if it's currently out (replacing the one you have)
- Allow you to summon during combat, but maybe with a 100% spell interruption rate such that if you get hit at all during combat you can't summon them so you still have to get away.

If they made those changes then I'd be able to resummon them when they end up in the ceiling or if they fell down a hole.

[Afin]

For a trust that fell down a hole i would either of had to wait for it to maybe run around and if it didn't, to drop down to have it behind me again, very annoying as it was unable to reach to dismiss it to re-summon, the only work around as far as getting stuck on the floors between the holes was to bring the monster back to the trusts, but that risks other aggro and links, i mean these days your trusts can handle it, but back then it proved annoying. Either way, to be told you need to re-summon with a 3 minute cooldown was enough to deter me from going to those areas

[Elliander]

For a trust that fell down a hole i would either of had to wait for it to maybe run around and if it didn't, to drop down to have it behind me again, very annoying as it was unable to reach to dismiss it to re-summon, the only work around as far as getting stuck on the floors between the holes was to bring the monster back to the trusts, but that risks other aggro and links, i mean these days your trusts can handle it, but back then it proved annoying. Either way, to be told you need to re-summon with a 3 minute cooldown was enough to deter me from going to those areas

I was curious about your experience so I went into Garlaige Citadel with 4 trusts out. Running through I noticed that they likewise got stuck behind broken floor segments. They'd fall in, but then they'd immediately after pop back up where they left so I guess they partially fixed that problem. The problem was that only the one in front would even try to move even if there were two ways around the hole and the one that would move would make the same movements repeatedly. I then continued on, curious about what would happen if I got very far away from them and sure enough I got far enough away that they were not even targetable anymore. However, when I got really far away they'd suddenly appear near me so it seems that you can get them back simply by outrunning them.

Of course, that's still a bad pathing problem. It would probably be easier for them to pre-define what paths they should take when trying to cross those spots (i.e. when the player is on the other side from them) as opposed to what to do if the player intentionally drops in. I imagine that another possible solution could be a Trust command to call them all to your location.

Something else I noticed, which was particularly annoying, was a tendency for all of them to stand at the exact same coordinates as me after leaving certain areas. Happens often after burning gates, for example, and after a number of cut scenes. I then have to fight my way out of them. I actually can't unsummon a trust that is in range either unless I am directly facing them which is problematic in this cases, but thankfully they don't permanently trap the player.

Although speaking of which, it's weirdly annoying when I sit to rest and a Trust starts pacing in a circle right in front of me or worse when they do that right after defeating a monster when there is a link from other monsters I am trying to target. They won't even cast spells to heal themselves until I start combat, but I can't start combat while trying to click through the crowd of them.

Overall I like the Trust system better than not. It's at least a viable bandaid for the problem of not being able to get good parties going anymore. However, I think I'd like Trusts much more if their AI made them act like a real party. Like if I could make a camp, tell them to wait, and bring a mob to them as an example. That way I don't have to worry about their pathing or clipping through the ceiling. Maybe they can introduce a "Flag" I can put down which keeps the trusts from moving too far away from the flag. (Maybe the range could be larger for long distance fighters like archers and mages, but the close range fighters would stay in the area and only provoke enemies back to it who go after the longer range fighters) I think it's fair that they make us engage the enemy before they'd fight since you'd have more botting in the game if it was all automatic, but I'd at least like to have additional ways of getting them to start combat such as casting an offensive spell. As a caster it's happened far too often where I turn on auto attack, start casting a spell, then the spell lands, and when the mob gets close I'm not attacking anymore because while I was casting the mob got far enough away to turn off auto attack but not far enough away to interrupt the casting. That's always bad.

I think it would also be nice if the game somehow encouraged players to play together with trusts, but once the Trusts are out I can't invite anyone to the party at all. I have to dismiss them all first, then invite the person, then wait a few minutes, then I can resume. It's weird to have a 5+ minute wait trying to form a party mixed with trusts and that just further discourages pick up parties from ever happening. I've lost track of how many times I've seen someone else exp grinding the same area, likewise solo, with their own trusts. Imagine if there was SOME benefit to be had by working together to form a single shared party? But taking the time to do that would literally cost upwards of 20,000 exp in lost time at some medium level camps given the extended wait. I'd love to be able to just form a proper party, mix in some trusts to make up the slack, not have to wait long, and also drop a flag down to make the trusts stay put so we can have a proper party.

The way this game is headed they might as well just convert it into a single player game by making NPCs act like players running around and create fake Auction House traffic because the game plays solo now.