Please Rework "FULL BREAK'S" effectiveness + other GA ws's like it DEV TEAM /wave

[kingfury]

@ Fiarlia:

BOOM!! And there you have it folks! Good o'l communication ^^ Thanks Fiarlia /bow and for you, I'll gladly make that change since it was indeed meant to come off that way(the artistic signing of a piece of work)

In my art career, I've used both types of signatures, the natural one and the more "official styled" one to sign my work. I'll admit I don't frequently invest as much work into message boards, and since this one happens to be the "Official" message board for FFXI, I chose to run with the more official styled signature. Incredibly easy fix, and one that is perfectly compromising. Thank you for the compliments to my art, and for shining some light on the subject. /salute.

[kingfury]

@ Zyeriis:

I gotcha man. Thanks. I was however requesting something more along the lines of what Fiarlia communicated in terms of "open-minded" description, but thanks all the same. Clear, level-headed communication is what got the signature altered.

[Melodicya]

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[kingfury]

Hello Everyone!
While we appreciate the civil discussion, a number of posts recently made have been unrelated to the purpose of the forum and thread. Please follow the forum rules when making posts for a trouble-free and productive exchange of information.
Please visit the following page for reference on the forum guideline:
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Thank you!

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Hate to have you guys dawning your red armor for such a thing ><; Hopefully the issue has been rectified ^^ /

[wish12oz]

This is a fix that would be completely useless and a waste of time, good WARs would still spam Ukko's regardless, so no thanks to this idea, let's have SE to work on useful stuff.

[kingfury]

This is a fix that would be completely useless and a waste of time, good WARs would still spam Ukko's regardless, so no thanks to this idea, let's have SE to work on useful stuff.

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Talked about this a few post back ^^ It's indeed a tragic game dynamic that I'm sure wasn't the intension by the Dev Team. The dependency of your most powerful ws's in your arsenal to be the most effective in both offensive and defensive situations.

A good WAR, or player for that matter, understands both offense and defense in this game and how to balance both based on the situation in front of them. Trying to run in and do high amounts of damage ALL the time for every situation is a quick way of getting yourself K.O.'d most of the time. Strategy is what is bred from our weapon skills and Job abilities. Now imagine for a moment that the Break ws's used on GA were just as effective now at lvl 90 as they were the day a player received them. Wouldn't that breed more strategy during battle vs trying to only do the most melee damage? As you know, some monsters in this game just don't accept that type of strategy."

[noodles355]

If you want to physically see the results of a full break WS then run a parser. Eye-balling results is never an accurate means to study something in FFXI concidering how marginal most upgrades are.

For example, I play dragoon. My WS in abyssea average anywhere between 2500 to 5000 damage. However, it appears everytime I use Angon, which lowers the mob's defence by 20%, my WS damage looks to be lower. Why's this? Is it because Angon actually somehow lowers the damage output of my Drakesbane? No it's not, it's just that I have gotten unlucky and whilst having many triple-attacked Drakesbane with lots of crits, on the few occasions I use angon I don't get a teiple attack proc and only a few of the hits critical.

However, if I was to just continue to eye-ball it without thinking, then the simple conclusion would be that Angon is making my WS weaker.
But I know full well that's not the case. The only reason my highest dmage angon WS was lower than my highest damage non-angon WS on the same mob is luck.

You see? Eye-balling numbers in the chatlog is very rarely an accurate means to study something. This works both ways: by eye-balling the chatlog I may think a certain circumstance is upping/lowering my damage when it's actually not, and likewise I may think a certain buff or ability is not increasing/lowering my damage output when it infact is. With the way FFXI works with the random-number-generator the only way to accurately study something's increase is to parse it over a significant period or time and compare the average results over those time periods (or whatever other scale would be best to use, number of mobs etc).

You say "I want to be able to see the difference in the chatlog after using Full Break" I say: Go download and run a parser. Kill the same mobs for a great period of time with full break, and then repeat the same test with Raging Rush or Ukko's or whatever you normally use. Compare the average results between the two parses, you will see your average melee strike damage has risen slightly in the full break setup.

[noodles355]

If you want to physically see the results of a full break WS then run a parser. Eye-balling results is never an accurate means to study something in FFXI concidering how marginal most upgrades are.

For example, I play dragoon. My WS in abyssea average anywhere between 2500 to 5000 damage. However, it appears everytime I use Angon, which lowers the mob's defence by 20%, my WS damage looks to be lower. Why's this? Is it because Angon actually somehow lowers the damage output of my Drakesbane? No it's not, it's just that I have gotten unlucky and whilst having many triple-attacked Drakesbane with lots of crits, on the few occasions I use angon I don't get a teiple attack proc and only a few of the hits critical.

However, if I was to just continue to eye-ball it without thinking, then the simple conclusion would be that Angon is making my WS weaker.
But I know full well that's not the case. The only reason my highest dmage angon WS was lower than my highest damage non-angon WS on the same mob is luck.

You see? Eye-balling numbers in the chatlog is very rarely an accurate means to study something. This works both ways: by eye-balling the chatlog I may think a certain circumstance is upping/lowering my damage when it's actually not, and likewise I may think a certain buff or ability is not increasing/lowering my damage output when it infact is. With the way FFXI works with the random-number-generator the only way to accurately study something's increase is to parse it over a significant period or time and compare the average results over those time periods (or whatever other scale would be best to use, number of mobs etc).

You say "I want to be able to see the difference in the chatlog after using Full Break" I say: Go download and run a parser. Kill the same mobs for a great period of time with full break, and then repeat the same test with Raging Rush or Ukko's or whatever you normally use. Compare the average results between the two parses, you will see your average melee strike damage has risen slightly in the full break setup.

これ。どういたしまして。

[wish12oz]

A good WAR knows that killing stuff faster has better results then killing slower and making the mob weaker, you take the same amount of damage and get the same drops, but one way is faster. This is still a useless idea and a waste of SE's time, no matter how you look at it.

EDIT: if the WAR is dieing he should get better DT gear or a better WHM. Breaks were also never useful or good.

[kingfury]

A good WAR knows that killing stuff faster has better results then killing slower and making the mob weaker, you take the same amount of damage and get the same drops, but one way is faster. This is still a useless idea and a waste of SE's time, no matter how you look at it.

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I gotcha. Except of course when you're fighting certain types of NMs that can one shot you if in front of it trying to melee. What my quote was saying, is that not every monsters accepts the "zerg it to death" strategy. Some NMs warrant a "slow and steady" battle tactic, especially depending on how many party members you have.

EDIT: if the WAR is dieing he should get better DT gear or a better WHM. Breaks were also never useful or good.

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Again, this doesn't really help if you just got one-shotted in the face from being inside when you should've been /away ^^ That, and I'm glad you agree with the OP / I was suggesting there were monsters that you could actually use these Break ws's on at low levels and possibly see some results. Those results were not that good, but it was possible to at least see them.