Thoughts on a shared subscription?

[Alhanelem]

It's amazing to me that so many adults in the west do not understand how inflation works

Insulting me doesn't make your argument better.

I know how inflation works. It's the concept of how growth over time de-values currency. We already had another debate about this in the past about how the US Federal Reserve tries to maintain a 2% inflation target, because that measure of slight growth encourages investment and innovation and consumer spending.

Don't treat me like an moron and expect to get away with it.

I'm not going to shed a tear that the $12.95 SE gets from me today is not worth as much as the $12.95 they got from me 20 years ago. They still have huge profit margins, far beyond that of any physical retail product.

This is really starting to come across as you arguing against me for the sake of doing so, you can not possibly believe that offering this kind of promotion would be harmful to SE. Even if it was, it would be a drop in the bucket, and it could even still be a temporary promotion and then they might have more full price subscribers later if they decide to end it.

That's called good marketing.

[Tharly]

Go read what inflation is and how it works.

Learn what consumption is. A game that has been played through has had most value used out of it. There is a world of difference between paying for doing new things and doing the same things over and over again for the same price.

[Alhanelem]

Learn what consumption is. A game that has been played through has had most value used out of it. There is a world of difference between paying for doing new things and doing the same things over and over again for the same price.

Could not have said it better myself.

[Voidstorm]

in 10 years that $12 will be worth $3 in real terms.

From what I see now vs ~20 years ago comparing things that matter like land... it's probably worth about $1 from back then.

[Pixela]

Learn what consumption is. A game that has been played through has had most value used out of it. There is a world of difference between paying for doing new things and doing the same things over and over again for the same price.

Almost all the content in FFXI in the past was added via $40 expansions and not the subscription, most of the content from expansions was held back (or just not finished at all and our $40 paid for it to be made) from the box install and added over the following years. We used to literally pay $40 for a XI expansion and it was just barren zones with maybe one or two minor things to do and 2 missions.

So in reality not only is FFXI cheaper today than it ever has been in history, you are also getting far more for that sub than ever before too.

I would say enjoy but you obviously already are since you're here and paying the sub, when there are literally hundreds of other mmorpgs you can play for free if you so choose.

Insulting me doesn't make your argument better.

The text aimed at you was under the quote from you, that was aimed at Tharly and others that do not understand that $12 today is not the same as $12 10 years ago and has a totally different real world value. You know that MASSIVE $3 a week that could pay your rent if not for being spent on the staff that make content for you.

I'm well aware you understand how inflation works, you just want to pay less when you would not want to pay less for ff14 (since you value that more).

[Pixela]

,, , ,, ,, , ,, ,

[Stuzey]

Back in the day, £12 used to get me, a ticket to the cinema, a meal, a coupe of pints and pay for the bus journey home, now it just about pays for the cinema ticket

This topic is becoming bogged down under the cost, to be perfectly honest, I think most FFXI players would happily pay for another expansion, the money isn't the issue, I see more people leaving these days as they have run out of content they want to do (Yes you can spam Odyssey, for new shinny gear, but when you have limited relevant content, you soon get bored... Let's be honest, fighting the same mob, over and over again, isn't really fun, Nyzul was fun, Salvage was fun, they had different levels to them, different mobs, more complexity, more rewards, that's what my £12 paid for 12 years ago.

While inflation may mean we are getting a better deal, it feels we are getting less for our money

[Pixela]

The issue with serious endgame players on FFXI is the drop rates increased massively, we went from players expecting to do salvage for years to complete sets to complaining they didn't cap out on Shinryu drops in a month. The mass majority of ffxi players are still working on Dyna D gear let alone Ody, so this "lack of content" is very much only impacting the top 10-20% that have the means to spam new content and now have expectations of getting all the drops in a few months.

Reality check: Every mmorpg has these people, they are totally insatiable and no dev team can keep them happy. FF14 devs literally telll their hardcore players to go play another game if they are bored and come back for new patches.

Back in they day we did Dynamis for 10 years because the drop rates kept you there, so this isn't that we used to have so much content before and so little now. It's that drop rates are so high you're actually capping content now when you barely ever did before.


Here the realtity if you want it put straight:

Pay $3 a month for ZERO updates at all EVER AGAIN because all the staff your sub pays for retire and are not replaced (and once this happens it is over, because they will not be able to train people to come on at a later date, this knowledge on updating this old engine will be lost forever), the reduced fee will just pay insurance fees, power, server maintenance etc costs.

or

Pay $12 a month to pay the wages of the people who work on the game now.

These are your two options, you cannot pay less and get what you're getting now because what little you are paying now pays their wages. As the money coming in is reduced they make more cuts to staff and so you get less and at a point they just quit trying to keep updating the game at all and retire or go work on some new project in SE.

Also this is not $12 a week, this is $3 a week for a game you probably spend upto 20-60 hours a week on. This is not a movie that you're done with in 2 hours, or a starbucks cofee you spend $3.99 on and is gone in 10. The only people that can possibly complain about paying so little are people who mass multibox, and if you did that (as I do) you chose to do it.

[Tharly]

So in reality not only is FFXI cheaper today than it ever has been in history, you are also getting far more for that sub than ever before too.

Confuse yourself how you want. The value is the lowest its ever been. You are paying the same price as a new car for a 19 year old car.

A 12.99 sub in 2003 is equivalent to 19.27 today with inflation. The cost of the addons went down to a point where you can get all of them for less than 10 bucks.

There are time sinks, unholy grinds and time gates galore to keep people subbed longer. Why do they stay subbed longer? Because the game still has value. Once most content has been done, the value has been used up and people quit. Then come back when there is new content, and higher value again.

14 is packed right now for many factors, but one of the main ones is a new expansion coming in a few months so people are finishing up the last one in preparation. I expect November subs to go up again when the people who are on break from 14 come back again for the new content.

Value is more than just a number with a dollar sign in front of it you can index to inflation.

[Stuzey]

You're right in saying drops are easier now, Abyssea seemed to be the catalyst for that change, you're also saying that with inflation we get better value for money now.

But Dyna D is almost 4 years old now..... Even with the fact you paid for the expansion, back in 2006 we got Aht Urghan, which gave us Salvage, Nyzul, Assualts, ZNM's, HNM's and a whole host more, which stayed relevant until 2010 (four years latter) and the level cap being raised. The monthly fee supported a lot more content, which was more varied and had more depth to it, as you say, you didn't cap out on it all, because you had so much variety in what you could do.