Development Team Response Request - Job Adjustments

[BurnNotice]

6) Content Roadmap.
Some say maintenance mode, but is the game really? I seem to recall some hubbub about a "surprise" for FFXI fans a while back, but heard nothing since. What about the mobile version? Might there be an expansion in the works? Are we getting a fourth iteration of Dynamis to bang our heads against?! Either way, this is more about countering the ennui of content or at least having things to look forward to in the short term. Stuff like converting merit spells to scroll learned is something myself and others certainly requested in the past, and it's nice it's finally happening here and there, but it's pretty obvious some jobs need more than that. Old issues like conquering the "max spell" limit also need to be addressed, as it certainly puts a finite growth on casters. More generically, the goal with job stuff should be improving functionality and identity. If need be, actually talk to us to find what we want or what we feel lacking. Lord knows I spent years doing that for RDM in the past to what has equated to mixed success these days. That experience has also taught me you'll have people who vehemently disagree with said attempts at conversation, sometimes merely to be contrarian to the person bringing the idea. Be mindful of that should it be a route taken. Anyway, the occasional JP post roundup doesn't really cut the mustard, either. To some extent, it's like they don't even care what the NA side has to say, and that has almost ALWAYS been a problem. Too little, too late, mayhaps, but the joke about being a forum rep here being the easiest job in the world is one we don't make without reason.


7) To other players...
...part of this is a problem of our making, too. Putting aside a lack of new content, broken mechanics, or whatever, what tends to boil down to greed and/or elitism isn't really doing the community any favors. Seeing posts from people saying Trusts should be removed the game come off as a real head scratcher to me, as for many I suspect they're what has made modern FFXI even remotely playable. Further trying to "force" interaction does no good with lacking features like I outlined earlier above, but also does nothing to remotely incentivize established players into helping those who are not. I get it, certainly, that if content has no personal worth, it's not really worth doing. But what would change that? And I'm not talking about fleecing poor newbies or returnees out of their hard-earned gil. What would it take to perhaps nudge "you" out of the commonly isolationist linkshell system to help total strangers? Should we perhaps acknowledge certain drop rates are too horrid? Maybe more or a universal content point system that can fuel common endgame buys? And no, we don't need some self-proclaimed altruist swooping in here saying they help people so nothing is possibly amiss. You're not on all servers. You're but one of many. Frankly, I'd say it's rare to even see such claims verified. So, hey, I'm the pope. Prove me wrong? Jokes aside, people just need to be more welcoming and accommodating, not be jerks or gatekeepers.

Totally agree with your points, but there is two that stood out the most. The roadmap was a thing and SE Dev decided to stop doing that due to frequent changes and delays.

As for players asking to have the Trust system to be removed, that makes no sense at all. If those same players take a moment and think, the main purpose of the Trust system is to help new players get into the game, complete storylines and quest, and tackle certain endgame content to help develop their skills to be able to join the general population of others who do endgame content. For years, I've seen new or returning players get turned away from endgame content because they don't have the proper gear( which they need help getting to begin with) and/or they have not access to certain content due to them not progressing through the storyline/quest that requires help from others but unfortunately no one is available or willing to help (this is why the trust system was implemented in the first place).

[rotflcopter]

Showing your dissatisfaction couldn't possibly be easier. All you have to do, is actually do nothing. Don't pay the sub. Money speaks very loudly.

That's one way but unless everyone quits the game at the same time, it wouldn't be a very effective message. So here I am to voice my complaints in the hopes the Devs will step their game up.

[Seriha]

Can't really say boycotts work for video games, either. Which is pretty much the general message of advocating one simply stop subscribing, nevermind getting people to do it en masse. I also look at it as if enough people do pull out in protest, SE would just shut the game down because it's no longer worth it. The nightmare of POL/SE account system aside, I know one thing I always felt lacking was player surveys. When I tried WoW forever ago, when I eventually unsubbed, Blizzard at least had the awareness to query why with a few generic options and then a fill in the blank. Did they ever actually do anything with such info from players? Couldn't tell you, but it at least sends a better signal. My time on RIFT saw a couple surveys over time, too, but more for general gameplay inquiries.


Just for funsies, I also recall almost winning a custom item design entry in RIFT. We had a shield contest at one point in FFXI here, I think, but pretty much nothing since then. A hell of a lot more could be done to engage players. Sure, we had a GM asking what items should stack to 99 recently, but pretty much saw posts getting pulled because some people were pointing out just increasing stack sizes wasn't really going to fix certain issues. And in this vein, I actually believe we need a completely new AH system, and not just what I proposed in my earlier post, but I figure getting all the cross-server stuff going is enough reinventing the wheel for now.


As for Trusts, yeah, they're pretty much there to help in absence of players who have no interest or simply aren't around. I was very much historically an EST night owl player, most functional between 7pm-6am. Even trying to hang with PST folk, times after 2am were usually guaranteed to be dead. I can only really imagine how much more I would've gotten done in those later hours if the system existed back in the day, but as is, SE has pretty much admitted they've ceilinged the value of Trusts for endgame content because they want people to play together. Sadly, you can't just say you want that and it is then so. The time of day you play is super important, not to forget other factors like your chosen job and its gear/mastery levels. Also never been a fan of the "advice" that people level something like GEO or whatever if it's not their actual interest, because it usually comes off as "Play this job I don't want to play, but nonetheless want to take advantage of and likely not be shy about telling you how to play it, too!" I've also run into people who deliberately won't help others during the return campaigns because they just want assume they'll be gone when the free time is over. That's just sort of a self-fulfilling prophecy in my book, and goes back to something needing to be done about content appeal.


As a food for thought process, how would people feel if SE added a fast track option to the introductory ilvl RMEA weapons or severely diminished currency costs of pre-ilvl phases? Personal guess, I'd see some people for it. On the other hand, I'd also see people complaining that their "hard work" was suddenly invalidated with a patch not unlike the Thief's Knife back in the day. Of course, I'd also say it's 100% possible to code a partial refund NPC to nip that very gripe in the bud. Refunded currency can then go toward another weapon or simply be sold. As for the newcomers to the weapon pool, they obviously don't have to put up with the same mundane time sinks of farming whatever just to get a weapon that's at least usable, albeit not optimal, in the current modern endgame. There would still need to be a viable alternate "rite of passage" so to speak, but it is something players should be able to set their sights on once they're in, say, +1 Ambuscade gear and not feel like they have a giant slog ahead of them beyond the obvious ilvl upgrade requirements that exist now. The other alternative is that players just not give a crap about RMEAs at all, precisely because it's so much for what may seem so little (especially for casters). Thus, we have a contrast it what some would view as prestige content, while others think it a waste of time and resources.

[Alhanelem]

As a food for thought process, how would people feel if SE added a fast track option to the introductory ilvl RMEA weapons or severely diminished currency costs of pre-ilvl phases? Personal guess, I'd see some people for it. On the other hand, I'd also see people complaining that their "hard work" was suddenly invalidated with a patch not unlike the Thief's Knife back in the day. Of course, I'd also say it's 100% possible to code a partial refund NPC to nip that very gripe in the bud. Refunded currency can then go toward another weapon or simply be sold.

The problem with this is actually less the work that went into it, and more that any idea you have for compensation would destroy the economy the entire economy revolves rather heavily around RMEA currencies. So, your proposed compensation would drastically devalue the currency as a whole flood of it reenters the market, which in turn will either drive the prices for everything not related to RMEA way up or make said currency completely worthless until it all gets used up.

RMEA weapons are not required, they are meant to be a lengthy side quest that one aspires to complete over a long period of time. As strong as some of the weapons are, I do not believe at all that any are completely essential to having a functional job that can be used in content. a couple come kind of close, tbf. But not required. Further, nerfing these completely optional grinds will only make the rather slow rate of new content addition all the more noticeable.

Keep in mind that SE is apparently working on something substantial, which they're promising us by the 20th anniversary.

[Seriha]

Optional is going to be a matter of opinion depending on the job and weapon. Things may not be as bad now as they were VW era or early Adoulin, but I still see questionable expectations pushed forth by people when it comes to PUGing. As well, if something so optional is truly a backbone of the economy, it tells me that said economy is in dire need of help in other ways.


Conceptually, we'll no doubt have people who think pushing sidegrades forever is better than vertical progression, and of course that XI raising the level cap was the worst move SE ever made. Frankly, I was ready for a "reset" when that initiated because I'd pretty much gotten everything from all the content I cared for and there was a definite endgame ennui going on from established players as I saw my friends list and linkshell slowly diminish in population. The concept of Relics and their eventual counterparts is, pardon the pun, a relic of that era and something that should either be left to die or adjusted should future content actually embrace yet another level increase, either directly or through ilvl gear. When you stop to consider the direct gil drops from monsters is pretty much non-existent, NPC values on most things are too low (or have been deliberately neutered), and that today's prime casual money making method involves exploiting niche periods of time throughout the week to NPC sparks-bought gear, items costing hundreds of millions of gil, and no less expected, may start looking particularly ludicrous to the outside eye. In this case, perhaps a reset is literally the best move that could be made with character acquisition being more tied to content participation than how fat their wallet may be to avoid old money problems and the ills of the crafting system. But something like that also demands a full expansion and full team attention, which the root of this thread infers SE is not giving.


If we're supposed to wait 3 more years for SE to fart something out for XI's 20th anniversary, I'd posit anyone happily doing that is a fool. In the end, I'm only critical because I care. Wasted potential is something I've often seen throughout the game's life. Some mistakes pander more to the psychological trappings of MMOs, sure, but others occasionally seem to reflect a fear to take certain steps because they're untested in other markets or even drastic. Should we aspire for growth, some element of risk is going to be required. Otherwise, I only see the base continually diminishing the more this course is stayed. And if that is SE's hope, just be honest with us and pull the plug now. People will be disappointed either way.

[Nyarlko]

I wish that the devs would give us a clear, precise statement as to what the scope of the current wave of job adjustments includes. There are jobs, like BLM, where the real issues are rooted in system level causes (that were sadly unaddressed in the case of BLM,) where the problems that players face when playing the job are not actually job specific. The recent NIN update with it's [i]amazingly[i] unimaginative choices for replacement merits and not even touching anything outside of merits does not bode well for how the remaining jobs are going to fare. It might help if the devs could at least tell us specifics about what's on the table and what's out of the question for potential adjustments, and it would definitely help if they requested feedback about what players want to see happen for each job before implementing changes. If they'd done that, then we could have avoided the WHM debacle entirely.

[Zehira]

Very well said.

Bottom line is just like you said the lack of effort being put into this game that is still a PREMIUM SUBSCRIPTION game is horrible. The development team needs to either step or be replaced.

I know the Director of 14, Mr. Yoshida has a fondness for this game. I wish we could reach out to him someway and tell him how dissatisfying this game's updates have been.

Whoa. Maybe you don't know but if we look at Matsui's history of works carefully. I personally think Tanaka and Matsui together deserve a credit for creating job/battle systems in the first place. If it wasn't for them you won't be playing Yoshi's FF14 then. Let us have some respect please even we are in this (extremely small) community (English). I know we feel frustrated, it is just a matter of time. Before you blame Matsui, you should think twice how poor Tanaka was training Matsui before he left FF11 and FF14 to Matsui and Yoshi.

Here is the history of Matsui's works:

[TullemoreAsuraFFXI]

Rotflcopter is in a category of perspective that wants ridiculously overpowered capabilities available to basically point and kill without even a modest challenge being presented. Although the update adjustments came with some itemization issues that needed to be addressed, i think accommodations NIN gains from having the SAN spells converted to scrolls and replaced with bonuses unavailable prior to the adjustment is a good step. In the response thread I did call for a reworking of the job trait subtle blow that would do wonders for getting MNK + NIN and subjob /mnk + /nin back into a favorable scenerio.

[rotflcopter]

Rotflcopter is in a category of perspective that wants ridiculously overpowered capabilities available to basically point and kill without even a modest challenge being presented. Although the update adjustments came with some itemization issues that needed to be addressed, i think accommodations NIN gains from having the SAN spells converted to scrolls and replaced with bonuses unavailable prior to the adjustment is a good step. In the response thread I did call for a reworking of the job trait subtle blow that would do wonders for getting MNK + NIN and subjob /mnk + /nin back into a favorable scenerio.

Where in my complaints do I say I want overpowered abilities? Thanks for putting words into my mouth though.

The complaint is that the Development Team is not giving us meaningful updates. For the past several months they have promised job adjustments and they started off with a few (Rdm, Drg, Dnc) that were at least somewhat useful. It has been completely downhill since then. I never said I want jobs to be completely overpowered.

Monk is already in a pretty good place if you know how to play it properly, at least in terms of damage. Does it bring anything unique to the table besides low TP generation on fights? Not really.

The Ninja update did nothing to really help Ninja except giving them access to all San spells. The merit point categories they put in were lackluster at best. Just like every job they have moved merit spells to scrolls and called it an update. Its not enough. They need to do better. If they can't, either we need new Devs or they should just update the rest of the merit point spells left on jobs (Rdm, Smn) next month and say "This concludes our job adjustments" and go work on something more meaningful to the player base.