A Ninja without Throwing...

[Charismatic]

Who said anything about 2.4x damage or anything like that? You said Hi and Jishnu's do about the same damage... Jishnu's Radiance for my friend DOES average about 6kish on most stuff. I just did a dom ops party with him in Altepa tonight and he would one shot dolls 90% of the time. From 6-7k damn near every time. An ISL meant 4 dead dolls within like 30 seconds because sekkanoki, jishnu's, jishnu's, barrage, EES, jishnu's... and the best part is he's not even done with his WS build. I don't care about whatever else you're talking about but Blade: Hi does not do about the same damage as Jishnu's Radiance.

That's just not something you're going to get from Blade: Hi.

[wish12oz]

Who said anything about 2.4x damage or anything like that? You said Hi and Jishnu's do about the same damage... Jishnu's Radiance for my friend DOES average about 6kish on most stuff. I just did a dom ops party with him in Altepa tonight and he would one shot dolls 90% of the time. From 6-7k damn near every time. An ISL meant 4 dead dolls within like 30 seconds because sekkanoki, jishnu's, jishnu's, barrage, EES, jishnu's... and the best part is he's not even done with his WS build. I don't care about whatever else you're talking about but Blade: Hi does not do about the same damage as Jishnu's Radiance.

That's just not something you're going to get from Blade: Hi.

I could do that with Hi on lame weak dolls too~

And math says RNG WS's need to do 2.4x more damage then NIN's and ranged attacks need to do 18x more damage then a ninjas attack for the RNG to do as much total damage as a NIN.

[wish12oz]

Here, I spent 5 min out in altep fighting dolls, I did all of 4 WS's, here they are.
A mithkabob and berserk were my only buffs aside from atma/cruor buffs.
The last weak WS I did with the mob at like 10%, it was only 1 of the 3 hits Hi usually gets, and was to show what a single hit of Hi can do on those weak dolls.

http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c2.../weakdolls.jpg

With a stalwarts or minuet or chaos roll, any sort of attack buff really, probably even Dia2, would easily push me over into the 6-7k range. Anything else you would like to not prove?

[Charismatic]

With zerk and food you match the damage he does /SAM, yeah... that proved me wrong in that Blade: Hi is as powerful as Jishnu's Radiance.

[wish12oz]

With zerk and food you match the damage he does /SAM, yeah... that proved me wrong in that Blade: Hi is as powerful as Jishnu's Radiance.

Smart RNGs always sub SAM?
I fail to see how using the job abilities you always have is cheating. I also doubt he was doing 6-7k every time, completely unbuffed, but then, you could always go take your own SS's and prove it. Go for it, I would love to see it.
And what kind of gimp would be out exping or whatever doing dominion ops without at least cheap food?

[Charismatic]

And what kind of gimp would be out exping or whatever doing dominion ops without at least cheap food?

Oh, i dunno... probably the kind that oneshots them without it >.>
I'm pretty sure if when you engage an enemy, hit your WS macro... then the enemy dies, without using any food, that using food is irrelevant.

And I never said anything was cheating, stop putting words in my mouth. But yes, you have clearly convinced me that Blade: Hi is as strong as Jishnu's Radiance when the NIN is buffed and the RNG is not. Obviously this puts the weaponskills on equal footing.

[wish12oz]

Oh, i dunno... probably the kind that oneshots them without it >.>
I'm pretty sure if when you engage an enemy, hit your WS macro... then the enemy dies, without using any food, that using food is irrelevant.

Because you never do anything besides WS. So Only WSing matters.
And you never provided any evidence aside from 'cause i said so' to prove Jishnus does more then 200 damage to those dolls, at least I went out and killed a few of them and took SS's.

And I never said anything was cheating, stop putting words in my mouth. But yes, you have clearly convinced me that Blade: Hi is as strong as Jishnu's Radiance when the NIN is buffed and the RNG is not. Obviously this puts the weaponskills on equal footing.

Cause I'm sure your RNG friend wasn't using hasso, or velocity shot, or cruor buffs, or atmas, or whatever else, so that berserk from my SJ was such a huge buff right? And I'm sorry, I wasn't aware we were dealing with the poor crowd where people cant afford cheap food, and weren't using it while exping. When did not using food while exping become acceptable? When did exping without 2 BRDs or BRD+COR or 2BRDs and a COR become acceptable for that matter......


But anyway~
The point I was making originally was that the WS damage is close enough that a damage comparison between the two is not needed. By what you have said we've established that in 3 WS's without effort or high spikes in damage from TA's or DA's +allhitcrits on my part, I averaged between 0% and 15% lower WS damage then you said your friend was doing with jishnus. And all you did was loleyeballit, which means its probably a much lower average then you think.
And this is exactly the point I was making.
A RNG doing 15% more WS damage than a NIN is not going to save it. The RNG's WS's need to do 2.4x more damage then the NINs for it to matter, because the NIN does 2.4x more WS's then the RNG.
To explain this clearly to you, unless your friend is doing 14k WS's, my NIN would do more overall WS damage then he does after fighting stuff for more then 10 min, and overall damage over time is what matters. Not to mention the fact that in the time it takes for a perfectly geared RNG to shoot once, a NIN gets 18 hits in.....

[Greatguardian]

Obviously the only real answer is that MNK is better than both NIN and RNG. 7k WS? Pshawwww.



Also, not using Red Curry Buns fulltime (or at least Bison Steak on trash mobs) when they're 40k/stack (6k/3hr food for steak) and you (read: your friend) have an Empyrean Weapon is just insulting to the bow.

[Charismatic]

I don't see how not using food when it's not doing much of anything for you is an insult to anything. If you're one shotting without food, how is it an insult not to use it?
You guys make no sense.

[wish12oz]

I don't see how not using food when it's not doing much of anything for you is an insult to anything. If you're one shotting without food....

He most likely was not 1 shotting them with WS's, and you do stuff other then WS....
Like shoot arrows to gain TP, or barrage, or.... whateverelseRNGdoes.....

It's nice of you to not argue that RNG does more damage then NIN anymore too, glad to see you can handle math.