Idea to solve the low level gear problem.

[RAIST]

EDIT: as I was typing this all up, it looks like people started bring these points up, but I'm going to leave it as is since it covers some aspects not brought up yet, though more needs to be mentioned still.

I'm surprised this hasn't come up yet...so guess I will have4 to play devil's advocate again....

This sort of thing already exists via Conquest Points. And before you say it, they don't have to use THEIR CP to get it when they first start. As stated, they can already find decent gears for the first 10-12 levels really cheap from vendors. It should be noted that this actually continues to around level 20, after that it gets questionable whether it's better to get it crafted or hunted on the AH for something better than the CP gear. You are moving through levels so fast, you only need to update armors and such about every 7 levels or so, and the CP gear upgrades in 5 level tiers via simple crafts (bond an ingot to a harness and it goes from level 10 to level 15, a sheet to mail and it goes from 20 to 25. When the vendor/CP gears aren't available in your home nation (or you don't have the CP yet), you can get a friend to get it for you. not like those of us sitting on 150+ CP really need it that much now.

And that is another problem with this idea...new players won't have the tabs for a while, just like with CP. At least with the CP system, other players can get the item and send it. With the proposed FoV system and making them R/E, it would create a problem by trying to solve a problem--they would need to be maybe Rare, but not R/E for it to work as intended.

Here is a quick rundown of the gear options available to new users/new jobs:

Vendor gears are available at varying levels all the way to around level 40 or 50, forget the exact cut off. But the prices become unreasonable in comparison to the cost to have the gears crafted by someone (used to be available in the AH cheaper) at around level 20-24. However, the lvl 24 Chainmail set is still 50/50 on that front and though expensive is still a viable option to purchase as it can by upgraded for players with a simple crafting recipe to level 36 Silver Mail that is in the upper tiers for defense rating at level 36 (just need to bond silver chains to it, 46 GS cap to make it). All these pieces can be bought/sold via AH/Bazaar, most can be crafted, and some even drop from NM's as well. NPC's bbuy them back for a fraction of the cost, and you are better off posting them on the AH if you aren't going to get a crafter to upgrade them later. Yes, I am bringing crafting into the mix again. A handful of these vendor gears can be upgraded later for better gear--some of it is the gear some of these users are looking for on the AH, and are made by simple recipes like applying 2 lizard
skins to a level 7 pair to leather trousers (@500 gil from NPC) to make a level 17 pair of lizard trousers. This particular example only has a level 18 leather craft cap, and can be made as early as level 8 leather is made (with difficulty), but reliably at level 15 leather--you will get lizard skins while xp-ing during the early levels in dunes (11-14) if you go there, so this can be essentially a free upgrade if you know a crafter.

CP gears/weapons are available starting at level 10, and can be purchased as low as 1000 CP at rank 1. Most all the items in the first 5 rank levels, again, can be upgraded via simple crafting recipes to cover intermediate levels to carry a player through to the next tier: 10>15, 20>25, 20>34, 40>43, 50>52. As you go up in level tier, the rank goes up by one and the cost doubles from the previous tier (level 10, rank 1, 1k CP> level 20, rank 2, 2k CP, level 30, rank 3, 4k CP). These pieces can be traded, delivered, bazaared, and auctioned, and I think the NPC's will buy them from you as well.

Allied Notes Gear. While this is not so much directed at the new players, it is an option for exisitng players that have been doing campaign and are taking a job from 55 up. however, SOME of these pieces are just labeled Rare and CAN be traded, bazarred, and sold via AH/NPC's as well--so older players CAN get these for new players that have made it to 55+ and are having trouble finding gear. There is no Conquest Standing mechanic restricting access to these pieces--only rank (medals for campaign). If the item is not from your allied nation, you just go to that nation and pay a higher price to get it (1.5x markup). These gears comne available at level 55 and Stars/ medal rank (5th evaluation and up), and some peices cost as low as 7,000 AN to buy if in your allied nation (10,500 if not). These pieces are staggered in level and cover all the way up to level 71. They do not have any crafting recipes to upgrade them, but some of the lower level pieces are still reasonable pieces to use as high as level 75 at least as swap-in pieces for situational use.

In the beginning, no one knew ANYTHING about ANY of this information and had to explore and discover it on their own. As things were discovered, sites started cropping up to share the information--first in Japanese only sites, then eventually in English. Now, there are countless sites with all this information out there and can EASILY be found by googling, but if anyone asks in a group, chances are they will at least get pointed to the FFXIclopedia site. Another site is Alla--which has great lists (although slow) of all gears available by job, grouped by slot, and listed in order of level:

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/dyn/items/job.html

This shows the level of the item, it's stats, and whether it is purchaseble, crafted, quested, dropped and which zone to get it from if it isn't a crafted only piece. You can click on the item (I right-click, open in new page--faster researching) to get all the details on the item's acquisition.

In short, a system IS in place to cover these issues. Granted, it isn't easily known to a new player--but then again, it wasn't in the beginning, but IS now readily available online for all to see.

[Satyr]

EDIT: This sort of thing already exists via Conquest Points...

...In short, a system IS in place to cover these issues. Granted, it isn't easily known to a new player--but then again, it wasn't in the beginning, but IS now readily available online for all to see.

Conquest is a very old system both in terms of age and mechanics. FoV on the other hand is relatively new and something that SE is apparently expanding on in future updates.

You say that acquiring tabs takes a while which is simply not true. Currently you can easily get refresh and regen while chaining FOV pages and have a net gain of tabs. The level 9-12 page in Konschtat Highlands awards 36 tabs. I am saying make the gear cost something in the range of 50 tabs for hands and feet 75-100 for head body and legs. That does not sound like a pain to obtain IMO.

Conquest points on the other hand do take a long time to aquire, the low level rewards frankly suck, and the high level rewards are more or less unobtainable by newer players and cost a ton of points for just one item. Unless they were to add to the amount of stuff obtainable with conquest points and significantly reduce the cost of it, conquest points is not a solution for newer players.

Lastly yes the conquest system is there but it does not work to solve this issue and the reason for this has nothing to do with knowing that it is there or not. If conquest were the solution these threads would not pop up. The problem is not just for new players either. Many older players have just as hard a time finding gear to level a new job as new players do. It is not a matter of the gil, its just that the gear simply isn't there. If conquest were the solution then newer players with rank 10 and a bazillion conquest points would not be having the same problem.

[Karbuncle]

Perhaps, At least you make a good argument outside of "nolol"

[RAIST]

CP is really easy to get now...because the XP rate is now doubled, so is the CP rate. A EP mob granting 60 XP give 3 CP, and EM granting 200 xp gives 10CP. While it is stil on the slow side, it does grow at a steady pace. And as stated, they can get to around 15 or higher on the cheap vendor sets, level 10-12 if they are insistent on staying in the top tier gears. But in all honesty, that is just lunacy to stress over keeping everything at top-tier gears at such a low level. In many cases you are talking about the difference in being able to kill a monster 5 seconds faster or mitigating 1-3 points of damage per hit. High end gear just simply isn't relevant until AFTER a player would naturally be in the Jueno area because they are likely looking to move to Qufim. By this point, they should have been making friends and possibly have a social LS, and thus have access to people to help them out by then--either getting something with someone else's CP/gil, or having it crafted, or getting help farming something off an NM, completing a quest, etc.

That is another thing I forgot in my post--some items are actually QUESTED in starter nations. But.. that all involves a player taking a little effort to obtain an item, which is an idea that seems to have fallen to the wayside these days.....that's a whole other issue with the playerbase, and not the game's design.


EDIT: an afterthought just hit me. Years ago, something possessed me to unlock BRD. I leveled solo on that job to about level 12 right outside Bastok via FOV and just running around spamming kills--start with FOV, ding, pop empy band when page wears, log new pages as it came available. I know, costs CP--but a Chariot band only costs 10CP and grants 75% xp bonus w/ 500 cap--not as good as empy, but still a nice shot in the arm when your TNL's are <3k the first 12 levels. Doing an FOV page with even just Chariot band up can get you from level 5-6 in one shot.

Guess what I was wearing? Dream hat, Dream robe, level 1 RSE that I rebought from the Galka (same gear you get when you start new). Granted the two santa pieces were event items (free to obtain in the annuual Xmas event) and the robe extended the duration of the selbina milk if I had to use it during an Oh SH!t I'm gonna die moment--but it was free and I already had it. The point is, I was able to get at least 10 levels in one afternoon with level 1 gears, completely solo right outside my nation--YEARS before the xp/cp rate was recently DOUBLED--on a job that isn't even designed to be a melee job, more a support job.

[Malamasala]

LV21-30 Caster Set:
Caster Helm: +2 INT, +2 MND, MP Recovered while healing +2, +10MP
Caster Body: +2 INT, +2 CHR, MP Recovered while healing +2, +10MP
Caster Gloves: -2 Enmity, +2 Magic Attack, +2 Summoning Magic Skill
Caster Legs: +2 CHR, +2 MND, MP Recovered while healing +2, +10MP
Caster Boots: +2 Conserve MP, +2 Magic Accuracy, +2 Singing Skill

With that choice, I'd prefer you put Summoner on the DD gear. Nothing in there helps a Summoner. Well, hMP does, but then you need to put BLU and DRK there since they also benefit from it.

Summoning magic isn't worth it until you can combine it up to like +30 over cap. And I believe that around level 20-30 you still are restricted to like +5 today. Not that it does anything useful without a decent Ward anyway, which doesn't come until later in the 30s, and only if the moon is right.

So yea, DD gear for the Summoner is the only logical choice.

[Satyr]

With that choice, I'd prefer you put Summoner on the DD gear. Nothing in there helps a Summoner. Well, hMP does, but then you need to put BLU and DRK there since they also benefit from it.

Summoning magic isn't worth it until you can combine it up to like +30 over cap. And I believe that around level 20-30 you still are restricted to like +5 today. Not that it does anything useful without a decent Ward anyway, which doesn't come until later in the 30s, and only if the moon is right.

So yea, DD gear for the Summoner is the only logical choice.

Well .. I personally have never played summoner and I am assuming that -avatar perpetuation cost would be too good for "tabs" gear. Most of the other bonuses that would help summoner just seem too good for this kind of gear also. I figured +skill was the easiest way to give something to SMN that wasnt too overpowered. Keep in mind ... Carbuncle mits would trump these gloves in any situation. The point here is that NM drop or crafted gear (in some cases) is still better than this.

[RAIST]

I have been playing for roughly 6 or 7 years (forget exactly when I started, but was well before TAU came out). I grew up heavily using CP gears--often times not from my nation (I am only rank 10 Bastok). I use my CP all the time to buy gears for lsmates--I can recall recently 3 Musketeer falchion, 1 Musketeer pole, 2 Republican mantles, and 3 of the GK's from Bastok CP. And i still have almost 200k CP. Those that are out of CP probably blew it trying to make money from it. There are people out of IS as well as they blew it buying coins to sell on the AH for cash. They also blew out their AN buying/selling gears when they first got released. Me, I have buttloads of both as I only used them to buy stuff I needed, and now routinely use them to buy items for friends as well.

And IF they were to add gears to tabs purchase, I seriously doubt they would be running that low in cost--they would be more in line withthe pricing of CP gears, adjusted for the rate of gain. CP comes considerably faster than tabs, and you don't spend it on a regular basis (you continually use tabs for buffs and repatriations). You also earn CP while you are earning tabs, and continue getting CP when not getting tabs--so long as you have signet and are in an area affected by conquest. Aside from getting gears, you are renewing xp rings and RR/Warp scrolls that cost next to nothing in comparison. CP is earned at a 5% rate of base xp earned (before ring effect applied). Tabs are a flat reward earned at the end of a page, and can only be earned once per game day. For every chain 5 you do in a party, you are getting at LEAST 100 CP if they are all EM (which they typically are higher)--that is DOUBLE the rate it was just a year ago. You sometimes have to kill 10 mobs to get that many tabs. You complete that page, get that 27-150 tab reward, then go back to killing mobs without a tab reward--just xp if you log more pages. Meanwhile, you continute to grab another 100+ CP again for every chain. Even if you are't chaining--you get upwards of 3 CP/kill on average with EP kills if they give (60xp). That still adds up faster than tabs.

It's been said many times by many people in several of these types of threads:

Not having the top tier gears pre 50 (well, maybe pre ~43-46 for some jobs) will not make or break the game for players.

The point is, a new system simply isn't necessary as there are already enough opportunities to get adequate gear for the level mobs they will be fighting. The exception would be BCNM and other NM fights, but you are going to be doing that with friends, adn the strength in numbers combined with STRATEGY balances things out. I have yet to see anyone propose a situation where there wasn't a means to acquire adequate gear for their level all the way up to level 50--even given the current state of the AH. I even laid out all the options for weapon selection, and pulled up the DPS rating of the weapons. In the end, it would have cost at least 8k gil to get around a 7% increase in DPS (if they went with updating a lvl 30 CP item to lvl 34 and HQ'ed) at level 42--and a new item was coming up for that player in just 4 levels. That particular item is easy to make (mats drop from mobs that you fight on the way to 46, or can still be found cheap in AH), and is a commonly crafted item.

An adequate system is already there.. people just are refusing to accept it and use it. That is a problem with the PLAYER, not the GAME.

[Karbuncle]

You must admit though, Back in ~2004~2007 the prime of the game around RoTZ~ToAU up to early WoTG, We all had it easy.

The auction house was usually stuffed to full with Armor for every level. People rarely had to go out of their way so far that actually spending thousands of gil 99% of new adventurers WILL NOT HAVE to level a craft just to be able to wear that 1 piece of Armor they want, Then we might consider a Small solution.

Even if We, High level players, feel this is stupid, We should still consider that the Economy for low level gear ain't what it used to be, and despite how much is available, we might want to Amend it for new players, Even if it seems redundant.

I was one of the people who argued "Use NPC/Etc". But this is a luxury some new players don't have. We can't just say "Go buy the NQ worthless DEF_only armor off the NPC and be happy ya scrubs" or tell them to use the Conquest points, cause lets face it You're not always going to be a mage in windurst, and you might need Bastok armor. You either have to pay someone who will purchase it for you (First off, Goodluck doing that), or hope your ahead of XXX nation in Conquest and can pay x2 points to buy it yourself.

All these solutions look nice on paper, But i think we as a high-level Community forget how much it Sucks to be a new player. No one hangs out in the 3 cities anymore, You're boned if something isn't on the AH, and you're then forced to wear Worthless armor offering no bonus but DEF, and at low levels, Any bonus you can get on armor is precious since its so few and far between.

These kind of problem are especially noticeable for what people seem to forget, Accessories! No Shops sell good/decent Rings, Earrings, Belts, Backs, etc.

Theres a Shop at Kazham i know sells NQ Beetle Earrings/Bone Earrings i think, But newbs Ain't getting to Kazham for level 16 Bone Earrings, unless they fork over 500k for an Airship pass or pray they have friends to get them Rank 3, or can find someone to shout for it.

Types of improvements like the one mentioned in this thread won't effect us high-level players, and it will only make new players lives a little easier. So even if we find it may make things too easy. There really is little harm in it.

Personally i think We need to wait until the AH merge, See if problems persist, If not, Consider something like this.

Lets face it, We need to stop being so selfish and always complaining how hard we had it, or easy, and think of the new players. Making it easier for them to find armor isn't going to crash the game, Even if its already "easy enough". There is no harm in making a system like this, It can only server to improve the quality of low levels.

[RAIST]

/meh... maybe I've just been blessed with the linkshells I've had over the years... we always do just that--help each other out. We recently took on 3 newbs in our shell. They are planning to do one of their first Genkai's tonight. I did it for another one last month with Fenrir. I just spent 6 hours in vunkerl for the express reason of getting feet. I started it by myself, and brought in two lsmates...then a few more, then found people in the zone that needed unclaimed feet and brought them in. One was a complete stranger--he invited me the next day when he found my DRG feet in a chest. What goes around, comes around.

And we are always picking up items for eachother--or making them. I make jugs all the time for our BST when they ask. I even grab chigoes when I run across them on the AH just to keep some on hand for when people need the jugs---but that's just me. The point is, if you have joined up with a group in an LS it is usually for a reason--that being, having a group to help each other do stuff. If they aren't getting help from that group--maybe they need to seek out a new group. If they don't have a group yet, they should be asking around. I still see lots of people in Bastok. The synergy furnaces are being used a lot there, and there are base mats for smithing, alchemy, and goldsmithing there often as well--mostly just the weekends, so there is a timing element involved sometimes.

While I agree, it isn't as easy as it used to be--it isn't borked to the point that the game is unplayable. Everyone makes it sound like it is going to kill the game. If that's true, than why do I see so many people trying to form dunes/qufim parties still? They obviously are managing to get through the game somehow.....

[Karbuncle]

/meh... maybe I've just been blessed with the linkshells I've had over the years... we always do just that--help each other out. We recently took on 3 newbs in our shell. They are planning to do one of their first Genkai's tonight. I did it for another one last month with Fenrir. I just spent 6 hours in vunkerl for the express reason of getting feet. I started it by myself, and brought in two lsmates...then a few more, then found people in the zone that needed unclaimed feet and brought them in. One was a complete stranger--he invited me the next day when he found my DRG feet in a chest. What goes around, comes around.

And we are always picking up items for eachother--or making them. I make jugs all the time for our BST when they ask. I even grab chigoes when I run across them on the AH just to keep some on hand for when people need the jugs---but that's just me. The point is, if you have joined up with a group in an LS it is usually for a reason--that being, having a group to help each other do stuff. If they aren't getting help from that group--maybe they need to seek out a new group. If they don't have a group yet, they should be asking around. I still see lots of people in Bastok. The synergy furnaces are being used a lot there, and there are base mats for smithing, alchemy, and goldsmithing there often as well--mostly just the weekends, so there is a timing element involved sometimes.

While I agree, it isn't as easy as it used to be--it isn't borked to the point that the game is unplayable. Everyone makes it sound like it is going to kill the game. If that's true, than why do I see so many people trying to form dunes/qufim parties still? They obviously are managing to get through the game somehow.....

You did have it very lucky, I'm a little jealous. When i started the game my noob ass was in Crappy-No-stat armor for a long time, most of which i farmed for hours to afford. At one point i remember wearing a Friar's Rope on my ~15THF cause i didn't know any better... yah. this was back before CoP though...

Anyway, Well I understand that its not "Broken to unplayability". But it is "Broken to unenjoyability". Maybe some people are exaggerating a little, but a System like the one listed in OP wouldn't really hurt anyone, it would only server to help those who weren't as luck as you were.

Some new players truly don't have Friends, Or the Know-how to farm, etc. Even with proper research you need to get to jeuno to make any meaningful money, cause Beehive Chips at the Bastok AH don't sell like they used too lol, Nor Quadav Backplates.