New Head/Frame

[Jakuk]

There are many, many, community created models, animations, and skins that were created without the use of the PS2 devkits that work just fine when swapped into the game, I'm no expert, but is it not possible for the dev team to use similar alternative tools now that console compatibility is no longer an issue?

It's more whether it's worth the time and money to do so.

[Selindrile]

It's more whether it's worth the time and money to do so.

That's not what they're saying though. >.>, if it's in part due to the idea that they'd have to create new tools, I'm saying they're already out there, if it's the actual manpower of creating the models/animations, well perhaps that's something that can be discussed with the community about what they'd rather have with the limited dev time we have available. Either way, I think we should have an honest discussion about it.

Also, I'm absolutely SURE the community would be happy to submit user-created models, animations, and skins, which would save dev time and they could simply handle the side of things they're already handling now, that's how a few games create content, Trove comes to mind.

[Jakuk]

That's not what they're saying though. >.>, if it's in part due to the idea that they'd have to create new tools, I'm saying they're already out there, if it's the actual manpower of creating the models/animations, well perhaps that's something that can be discussed with the community about what they'd rather have with the limited dev time we have available. Either way, I think we should have an honest discussion about it.

Also, I'm absolutely SURE the community would be happy to submit user-created models, animations, and skins, which would save dev time and they could simply handle the side of things they're already handling now, that's how a few games create content, Trove comes to mind.

They're a business, they can't just use community submitted creations, or tools. It'd open them up to lawsuits.

[Selindrile]

They're a business, they can't just use community submitted creations, or tools. It'd open them up to lawsuits.

You mean like the shield model they already made from a user-submitted skin? http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/fo...Design-Contest
Or the multitude of other games that do exactly that on the regular? Such as Trove, Second Life, Neverwinter, Everquest2, Star Trek Online, City of Heroes?

[Nyarlko]

You mean like the shield model they already made from a user-submitted skin? http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/fo...Design-Contest
Or the multitude of other games that do exactly that on the regular? Such as Trove, Second Life, Neverwinter, Everquest2, Star Trek Online, City of Heroes?

There are different legalities that would apply since there is a difference between soliciting user submissions under explicitly defined use terms vs using unsolicited stuff. Pretty darn sure that Japan has different Fair Use laws than the US, and I think all the games you mention are run by US based companies.

[Selindrile]

There are different legalities that would apply since there is a difference between soliciting user submissions under explicitly defined use terms vs using unsolicited stuff. Pretty darn sure that Japan has different Fair Use laws than the US, and I think all the games you mention are run by US based companies.

Also, I'm absolutely SURE the community would be happy to submit user-created models, animations, and skins, which would save dev time and they could simply handle the side of things they're already handling now, that's how a few games create content, Trove comes to mind.

Was talking about user submissions from the beginning, not fair use, all of the games I listed publish content that is user-generated and user-submitted.

After doing some googling I see many, many articles mentioning that few Japanese games use user-generated content and saying that more should, but I see none mentioning the reasoning behind this being anything due to legal issues.

There are some Japanese games that use user-generated content such as Little Big Planet and Super Mario Maker but I will admit I was hard pressed to find examples, and in these two the design tools are within the game which wouldn't be the case here, but regardless, the fact that they released the shield that was user-submitted should be enough to prove that using user-submitted designs should be viable.

[Nyarlko]

Was talking about user submissions from the beginning, not fair use, all of the games I listed publish content that is user-generated and user-submitted.

After doing some googling I see many, many articles mentioning that few Japanese games use user-generated content and saying that more should, but I see none mentioning the reasoning behind this being anything due to legal issues.

There are some Japanese games that use user-generated content such as Little Big Planet and Super Mario Maker but I will admit I was hard pressed to find examples, and in these two the design tools are within the game which wouldn't be the case here, but regardless, the fact that they released the shield that was user-submitted should be enough to prove that using user-submitted designs should be viable.

There's also the argument that a single-case contest barely counts as precedent. I wouldn't be overly surprised if they were to do a repeat and hold another contest for a single item, but again, outside of something like that, there are going to be issues w/ a Japanese company implementing user-sourced designs.

The best example of legal problem possibility would be the anime "Super Dimensial Fortress Macross". If I'm remembering my history on that one, the reason it was never licensed for NA distribution was due to copyright issues over the music since I think the composers retain the copyrights :? That's why it ended being frankensteined into Robotech. XD Not 100% sure of the details tbh, only that the Japanese production company does not hold all rights by default.

Given the apparent technical difficulty for the current dev team to add new models to the game, the graphics/textures are probably the least of the issues involved with getting anything "new". Which means that user submitted content wouldn't help much anyway.

I believe that the most viable route to go would be to start hollering for new head/frames that are reskinned/recolored rather than unique. If all that they have to consider is "How/what should it DO?" without concerns about creating new assets, then there might be a shot at seeing something actually happen. ^^

[xiozen]

That's not what they're saying though. >.>, if it's in part due to the idea that they'd have to create new tools, I'm saying they're already out there, if it's the actual manpower of creating the models/animations, well perhaps that's something that can be discussed with the community about what they'd rather have with the limited dev time we have available. Either way, I think we should have an honest discussion about it.

I think this portion of the response is spot-on. I agree 100%. My original post, which was responded to by Sicycre [much appreciated], addressed the issue about not adding "new head/frame options for the automatons" as it relates to " new designs"...my point is really providing the PUP job with a "new" (new meaning concept associated with job type) based on support in the same vein as a bard or geomancer...

If we consider the fact that the assets used for a bard or geomancer in accordance with their functions are pre-existing, adding the requested modification to PUP (an adjustable automaton with access to these assets) would be an enhancement to an already customizable job... The automaton can perform the functions of "BLM", "WHM", "RDM", "PLD", "RNG", "WAR"...has access to "blink" similar to shadows of NIN... etc. all through various attachments.

The answer to this Sicycre is not a new head/frame combination as originally requested (existing head/frame can be used..heck, gives a new use for possible harlequin usage...) but "new" attachments that USE EXISTING ASSETS for Bard or Geomancer to provide support.

Please consider it.