Job balancing?

[detlef]

I'm not proposing the perfect solution anyway. Just a concept that might help to solve the problem. Maybe it scaled so that Ghorn versus Langeleik is somehow beneficial enough to meet your standards or Ghorn versus no instrument at all (although keep in mind that +song is duration too, not just potency). I don't know, it's just a concept. The difference between what you're proposing (uncap songs) versus what I'm saying (significantly buff songs and limit us to one of each type) isn't that big, I just care a little more about NQ BRDs and making the job easier to play than you do.

[VoiceMemo]

For ease of play, I would suggest a quest for either Daurdabla or Terpander to be able to unlock the 3rd and 4th song natively. Since both are used for quantity of songs, 4 an 3 respectively. Neither are used full time, they are used to get pseudo songs on for replacement with the instrument with all songs or the appropriate plus song.

In this way we would not need to cast 6 songs for a 4 song brd, or 4songs for a 3 song brd. You would just need to cast 4 songs at full power and 3 songs at full power.

For song power if base skill is not increased, or the base power not increased, SE would need to change the way the songs are calculated to give a percentage boost vs the static boost. That would be one way to lessen the gap vs NQ brd, REM brd, and GEO.

[detlef]

That'd be great. But I don't think they're gonna make a legendary instrument into a KI.

[OmnysValefor]

[...] [to VoiceMemo] I just care a little more about NQ BRDs and making the job easier to play than you do.

I was an NQ bard. At this point, I'm not even a bard. I mean I had all the good R/E gear, I had all the instruments that Bard should have when they don't have a horn or harp. But that's what I like about GEO. I'm not wanting to commit to an Idris and become perma-GEO, even though I otherwise give it my all (and find people ALWAYS wanting me GEO), just like R/E bards were perma-bards before that.

Not wanting to bother making legendary weapon(s) for a job shouldn't bar a person from performing well (not necessarily superb) on the job. This is why Paladin's JSE shield, Priwen, is one of the best in the game and why Paladin can't help but -DT-cap these days. Yes, bleeding-edge things require an Idris or an Aegis paladin or a RUN with a giant ceiling-fan-blade, but it's nice when people who have done a job very well, like detlef's bard, still remember that not everyone wants to.

As an HQ Paladin myself, I like that NQ paladins can tank and NQ dd can still perform well.

[VoiceMemo]

I'm perfectly fine with buffing NQ brd, but not at the expense that a REM brd's boost becomes a pittance, where there is regret for having done all that work to obtain the legendary instruments/weapon. If NQ brd gets boosted REM brd should also get a boost.

Why does mediocrity need to be the norm, what about those that strive for exceptionalism?

As for mechanics of brd mobs that dispel songs are annoying yes but that's part of the job, something you have to deal with, dealing with multiple songs is the same thing, the way the job was designed. You don't see me asking for smn to be changed(I really don't like the mechanics of the job) so I don't play it. Let those of us who like to play the job to keep playing it. The number/way songs are applied don't really need any change, just the difference in power between NQ, REM, and GEO.

Coloration of song icons with numbers would be the best way to identify which song is on party members, but SE already said no to it.

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...-Icons-for-BRD

[dmuller30]

Although BRD is an underutilized job and taken over by another job there are other jobs that still need some smoothing out. Being a SMN forever and a day I know that needs a lot of work and some tweaking. As far as the other jobs it seems like they can't get close to any of the end game content NM's because they will die in a few hits which is horrible. How do we have jobs that die without any effort from mobs. I was on my MNK the other day trying to do some stuff with ls and who dies first . . . . . Me although it took a bit for me to die I mostly had to dodge runaway a lot to the point where I didn't get to do much but run away from the mob so I wouldn't get one shotted. And if I wasn't running away and tried to do some dps still had to worry about any spike spells the mob had on themselves. On my SMN I feel as if the limiters on them should be adjusted because just like BLM we are limited by our MP. Why such a huge delay time when bst can do there so fast? I just don''t understand the reasoning not to mention our buffs are still stuck at 75. . . It makes no sense still either. I am not sure about any of the other jobs so I don't really know what problems need to be addressed by those other jobs maybe a list of things that could be adjusted?

Smn - I would love if the BP timers for each avatar were separate or the global cool down times were lowered.
Mnk - I honestly don't think it's the job I think it's the mobs and there constant spamming of aoe / status ailments, one time on a mob I was slept, stunned and terrorized the whole fight. . . . So that might be all melee jobs.

[detlef]

I'm perfectly fine with buffing NQ brd, but not at the expense that a REM brd's boost becomes a pittance, where there is regret for having done all that work to obtain the legendary instruments/weapon. If NQ brd gets boosted REM brd should also get a boost.

Buffing the baseline of a job affects the top tier of the job too you know. Stop talking about “REM brd” when you really mean Gjallarhorn, the only RME that affects potency. The one that’s already “a pittance” for almost every song.

Why does mediocrity need to be the norm, what about those that strive for exceptionalism?

Yeah, I think you’re going to have to get over yourself.

As for mechanics of brd mobs that dispel songs are annoying yes but that's part of the job, something you have to deal with, dealing with multiple songs is the same thing, the way the job was designed. You don't see me asking for smn to be changed(I really don't like the mechanics of the job) so I don't play it. Let those of us who like to play the job to keep playing it. The number/way songs are applied don't really need any change, just the difference in power between NQ, REM, and GEO.

BRD is super clunky to play, I’m surprised that you wouldn’t have any suggestions to streamline its play. If you think that the method to apply 4 full-strength songs can’t be improved then I don’t know what to say.

As an example, it would be nice if “one additional song” instruments just put up a dummy song that would be overwritten by the next song you put up, rather than the song with the lowest duration being overwritten. I think we’ve all had issues reapplying songs where the current set of buffs have a shorter duration than even a non-buffed Daurdabla song.

Coloration of song icons with numbers would be the best way to identify which song is on party members, but SE already said no to it.

Yes, that would help. Still, you’ll never know which of the two marches needs to be reapplied or whether it was Blade or Sword Madrigal that was dispelled. That’s why I proposed making the top tier song of each type as strong as doubling down on that song currently (and to balance things, only allow one song of each type). I know this would weaken your precious Gjallarhorn which costs maybe 65m on my server but it’s for the greater good.

[OmnysValefor]

Although BRD is an underutilized job and taken over by another job there are other jobs that still need some smoothing out. Being a SMN forever and a day I know that needs a lot of work and some tweaking. As far as the other jobs it seems like they can't get close to any of the end game content NM's because they will die in a few hits which is horrible.

I look forward to the next release of Ambuscade Armor. I hope that (using the salvage names) the Ambuscade version of Usukane and Skadi have a lot of -dt on them too. For years the trade has been whether you want to hit the boss or survive being near the boss. Sulevia's (War/pld/drk/drg) has finally traded survivability for attack speed. I hope the rest follow suit.

Mnk - I honestly don't think it's the job I think it's the mobs and there constant spamming of aoe / status ailments, one time on a mob I was slept, stunned and terrorized the whole fight. . . . So that might be all melee jobs.

It absolutely is the design of the mobs that are the problem, like I said before.

[VoiceMemo]

Yeah, I think you’re going to have to get over yourself.

This kindof shows your age to resort to personal attacks. I've not attacked your views. I've just expressed mine.

But this kindof thinking is like todays youth of that EVERYONE gets a trophy, not just the ones that were the MVP.

As an example, it would be nice if “one additional song” instruments just put up a dummy song that would be overwritten by the next song you put up, rather than the song with the lowest duration being overwritten. I think we’ve all had issues reapplying songs where the current set of buffs have a shorter duration than even a non-buffed Daurdabla song.

I've NEVER had overwrite order issues with Daurdabla. I remove my Emp Neck and Body when casting the Daurdabla dummy songs which reduces those song duration by 24 sec(20%) and then reapply with Gjallarhorn songs at full 4 min 51sec power.

[Olor]

lol "get over yourself" is not a personal attack.

And as a NQ bard who had the R/EX instruments I needed to be decent (even spent a lot of gil chasing after the +all songs augment on the skirmish flute!) I really appreciate that Detlef has suggestions that would help all bards not just ones with super instruments.

No, I didn't save up for a ghorn but I did voidwatch till it made me sick to get a haste harp. I definitely tried to be a good bard, not exceptional by any means, but one that would do their best.

I dislike this attitude some folks have in the game that if you're not rocking an REM you shouldn't expect to play... that's just not good for the game.