Lower the days for relic making ?

[Alhanelem]

That's pretty vague. You could apply that logic to just about anything that you don't want changed. It's not necessarily true though. Just a theory. Personally, I've done a fair amount of coding though and if it didn't work the way I described, I'd be really surprised. I mean it's possible, but incredibly unlikely. The only thing that MIGHT be difficult is finding the spot where the timer is at in the code.

Yes, you could apply that logic to just about anything, but that's the thing- it's highly likely to be true. Let me explain something to you as I have some firsthand experience with this type of issue.

FFXI was originally created a very long time ago. I guarantee you that many of the people that wrote the original code no longer work for SE or at least no longer work on the project. Now imagine you're a Jr. programmer and you've been assigned to implement some random requests from the community. You fire up your IDE (devleopment environment) and you start looking for the relevant sections of code. This is when you realize that not only is the code badly written, it's also poorly documented by whoever wrote it, and they aren't here anymore to train anyone on it. Thus, a task that would have been simple for the original author is now a complicated one for the person looking at it, because they don't know where or what to look for.

I do QA work for a small indie studio, and I have watched staff members come and go over the years ive been involved with their projects. We've requested lots of bug fixes and feature tweaks that got rejected just because the original person who designed them doesn't work for the company anymore and they were the only ones who knew how it worked. It would cost them too much time and/or resources to implement it because someone would have to spend many man hours studying the code to figure out how to change it, even if the actual change would have been simple from a logic standpoint.

Just because something seems simple to us, even if some of us are programmers, doesn't mean it actually is simple because of situations like this. It could just be one number some place, but it might take time to find that number, and changing it could possibly break something unrelated- And anyone who's been around here for a long time knows how many random unrelated things have gotten broken every time they release an update.

So, when a community rep comes in here and says "it would be difficult for us to implement," they probably aren't just making it up.

[Manux]

Yes, you could apply that logic to just about anything, but that's the thing- it's highly likely to be true. Let me explain something to you as I have some firsthand experience with this type of issue.

FFXI was originally created a very long time ago. I guarantee you that many of the people that wrote the original code no longer work for SE or at least no longer work on the project. Now imagine you're a Jr. programmer and you've been assigned to implement some random requests from the community. You fire up your IDE (devleopment environment) and you start looking for the relevant sections of code. This is when you realize that not only is the code badly written, it's also poorly documented by whoever wrote it, and they aren't here anymore to train anyone on it. Thus, a task that would have been simple for the original author is now a complicated one for the person looking at it, because they don't know where or what to look for.

I do QA work for a small indie studio, and I have watched staff members come and go over the years ive been involved with their projects. We've requested lots of bug fixes and feature tweaks that got rejected just because the original person who designed them doesn't work for the company anymore and they were the only ones who knew how it worked. It would cost them too much time and/or resources to implement it because someone would have to spend many man hours studying the code to figure out how to change it, even if the actual change would have been simple from a logic standpoint.

Just because something seems simple to us, even if some of us are programmers, doesn't mean it actually is simple because of situations like this. It could just be one number some place, but it might take time to find that number, and changing it could possibly break something unrelated- And anyone who's been around here for a long time knows how many random unrelated things have gotten broken every time they release an update.

So, when a community rep comes in here and says "it would be difficult for us to implement," they probably aren't just making it up.

dude fire up Cheat Engine memory hack and you will be able to hack all sorts of things on a single player game and some online games you are always backing up dev in fact makes me wonder if they bribing you xd

Windower is an example of it...

If you can do so much with the 3rd party programs you are really saying the developers are not capable of doing there jobs right. Which I believe they can.

And no you don't have to agree with me with all the threads I made, As long as we can learn to agree and disagree :P

[vienne]

I'd rather see the devs change other things then this with their limited time and resources. 2 weeks is nothing and i fully agree with Alhanelem and Singforu... Maybe we should get rid of all the waiting times in game (sarcasm). There are far more important things which need to be adressed then this.

[Kensagaku]

If I may interject... I don't see how it would "destroy part of the game" to get a relic faster if you have the money and means to make it. I understand the lore argument, but riddle me this: how do you know if X player took the full time to get it (farming, daily dynamis, etc) versus buying the currency pieces outright with their gil? Does their relic look cheaper, more poorly-made? Not really. In essence, it affects nothing but your sense of "but this is how I see it."

It's not an instant gratification point; it's quality of life. Instant gratification would be more "push button, receive relic" than removed wait times. They still have to take the time to do the runs for their necropsyche, their attestation, and their fragment since those can't be sold. They still have to do their trials to get it up to 119. They're not instantly being thrown the best weapon it can be just because they have the means to complete the first step right away. I mean technically you can complete an Empyrean in the same way; since it's all entirely item trades, if you have them stockpiled from various endeavors then you can have it finished in a heartbeat, with no wait time except for watching your Magian Moogle dance himself to death while calling down the sky's worth of stars.

[Singforu]

If I may interject... I don't see how it would "destroy part of the game" to get a relic faster if you have the money and means to make it. I understand the lore argument, but riddle me this: how do you know if X player took the full time to get it (farming, daily dynamis, etc) versus buying the currency pieces outright with their gil? Does their relic look cheaper, more poorly-made? Not really. In essence, it affects nothing but your sense of "but this is how I see it."

It's not an instant gratification point; it's quality of life. Instant gratification would be more "push button, receive relic" than removed wait times. They still have to take the time to do the runs for their necropsyche, their attestation, and their fragment since those can't be sold. They still have to do their trials to get it up to 119. They're not instantly being thrown the best weapon it can be just because they have the means to complete the first step right away. I mean technically you can complete an Empyrean in the same way; since it's all entirely item trades, if you have them stockpiled from various endeavors then you can have it finished in a heartbeat, with no wait time except for watching your Magian Moogle dance himself to death while calling down the sky's worth of stars.

I find it funny how so many people call everything "Quality of Life" when it is not. Obtaining R/E/Ms is SUPPOSED to be an arduous task that takes a lot of time, they are legendary weapons. Obtaining equipment is not Quality of Life, and one is cheapening the quest by reducing the requirements. If you call reducing the requirements to obtain equipment as Quality of Life you might as well ask SE to make all the NMs in Delve have 20k HP so that all the casuals can solo the entire zone.... you know, Quality of Life.... /rollseyes.

[Kensagaku]

I find it funny how so many people call everything "Quality of Life" when it is not. Obtaining R/E/Ms is SUPPOSED to be an arduous task that takes a lot of time, they are legendary weapons. Obtaining equipment is not Quality of Life, and one is cheapening the quest by reducing the requirements. If you call reducing the requirements to obtain equipment as Quality of Life you might as well ask SE to make all the NMs in Delve have 20k HP so that all the casuals can solo the entire zone.... you know, Quality of Life.... /rollseyes.

Not waiting is "cheapening the quest"? They still have to get the same amount of currency, whether they got it prior or earned the gil to purchase the pieces. They still have to do all of the same trials. There is nothing that waiting causes them to "earn". Waiting is not a sign of hard work or an "arduous task." It is simply a gate, nothing more. Asking for Delve zones to be easier has nothing to do with simply removing a wait. Why are you so hung up on sitting and twiddling your thumbs? If it was something like "require less currency to finish a relic weapon" or "make there less stages in a relic" then yes, that's something I'd argue against, but removing a wait? That's just a foolish argument.

[Crevox]

Why must some people find reasons to argue against even the most simple of requests? I swear you guys, you will just search for reasons to disagree with anything.

[Alhanelem]

Why must some people find reasons to argue against even the most simple of requests?

Answer: because there are more beneficial and useful things the developers could do with their time, and I'd rather see them do something that actually matters over wasting any amount of dev time on something that doesn't really need changing because of how low impact an issue it already is.

[Alhanelem]

dude fire up Cheat Engine memory hack and you will be able to hack all sorts of things on a single player game and some online games you are always backing up dev in fact makes me wonder if they bribing you xd

If you can do so much with the 3rd party programs you are really saying the developers are not capable of doing there jobs right. Which I believe they can.

Changing variables in memory is easier than rewriting code- Finding a variable in memory by logical deduction is a lot different from finding a variable in many megabytes worth of written code. Same thing with reading them with windower. Windower does not modify memory, it uses it ti display information, and in some cases uses that information to determine what commands to have the client send (commands it can already send on its own, they're just not visibly obvious to the player.) All of this is a lot different from writing code, and considering that this is something that's on the server side only, it's not something you could manipulate with a cheat program or windower, renedering that line of argument moot.

This isn't a matter of agreeing vs disgreeing. This is a matter of facts vs fiction. If you wan't to disagree with truth, that's fine, but that doesn't make you suddenly right. Like I wrote in the post, I've done some work in the industry and have firsthand experience dealing with this very type of issue. It is NOT always as simple as you think it is.

That's a cool story, but the numerous recent changes to quest wait times tells us that someone currently working on the game does know how this works and where to look for it.

Given the long list of things they're unwilling to change because it would be "difficult to do so" even though it seems simple to us, I'd say it's not a simple matter to find those things. To counter your argument I'd point out that these changes have occured a few at a time spread out over months/years. If it was as simple as you think it is, they could change them all in a relatively short timeframe- And that's assuming they feel like it needs to be changed in the first place. If you didn't wait until you collected every single dynamis coin before beginning to turn in your items, this wait time wouldn't be that much of an issue anyway.

In my opinion, with precious little time left for us to get stuff, this should be considered a minimal priority issue compared to a lot of other things they could be improving. I'm not saying that it shouldn't be adjusted - rather that it's just about the least important thing they could invest any time on (And yes, I've been through the wait times myself and wasn't bothered)

[Zarchery]

Alhanelem, don't you know the script?

Player: Hey, can you modify this thing in the game? It's inconvenient.
Developer: We can't. The code is set up so that modifying that would be really difficult.
Player: No it isn't! Modify the code. We know it much better than yo.