why has getting and keeping a group together for endgame gotten a lot harder?

[Granis]

Hey, I've been trying to get into parties or form my own to actually do some events, and I and other leaders are finding it harder and harder to get enough people together to do high tier battlefields/skirmish/incursion/delve/etc. especialy when you consider how "strict" party roles are.

I just feel like it's hard to get anything done in terms of endgame events if it's gotten so hard to fill a party out for high tier battlefields or skirmish or even Adoulin missions, sometimes It's really, REALLY difficult to get that elusive Aegis/Ochain PLD or a COR or BRD so you have songs/rolls. I just feel like with the limited server pop being able to find good PLDs as well as a good buffer job, and some nights it's even hard to find that last DD sometimes.

I'm willing to admit it just might be my server. but even when I'm not taking charge as a WHM and forming my own group (which is what I usually have to do.), when I join someone else's shout, it just falls apart because we can't find one more person or we can't find x or y job we need to have a good party comp.

days like these makes me really miss the pre-SoA days where more people could tank besides Aegis/Ochain PLDs (remember how prolific NIN tanks were in Aby? or hell, WAR with /NIN tanks?) and that not having that BRD or COR didn't destroy your chances of getting anything done. back in Aby a lot of the time we had to roll without songs or rolls and we had to try our best to make due. (granted we had cruor buffs and Atma back then, but hell, for VW and those other non-Aby events pre-SoA that was a bigger deal.) But now it seems a lot of contents you NEED good rolls or songs, and/or you NEED a good GEO, and a good core of other mage support types for stunnign and all that, which I guess would make things more interesting if it wasn't so hard to even get such strict compositions together.

It's really cool SE is trying to fix these group coordinating problems with LS Concierges and the Unity thing, but the Unity thing is just going to be another big NM event you probably on't have the right party comp to actually do.

It's ahh, it's frustrating. even LS groups might be hard to pull off if your LSes don't have the right mix of jobs.

[Draylo]

Try to replace the BRD/COR with a GEO, it works but people just don't even bother trying. If anything, you can still complete events w/o them you just need to do a lower difficulty.

[Granis]

Yeah, I guess you have a point, but I already only do high tiers on Norm or so because AAs and such are already no joke and I think it'd be a little embarassing having to set it to VE just because we don't got rolls/songs or because we have to let a MNK or something try to hold hate because no PLD with appropriate shield.

[Draylo]

All the AA have been soloed on N by RDM and SCH, if you can't beat N w/o songs/rolls while someone has soloed it... that is troubling.

[Granis]

All the AA have been soloed on N by RDM and SCH, if you can't beat N w/o songs/rolls while someone has soloed it... that is troubling.

Well it's more of a problem where ppl don't want to even attempt it without an "optimal comp" and if I go "hey guys there are no PLDs or song/roll people biting one of you DD is gonna need to hold hate and we might need to try it with a weird setup" most people seem to jump ship because they don't wanna risk losing or having to do something like MNK tanking.

and "lowering the difficulty" makes them jump ship even faster.

[Draylo]

Do you have any friends you can do it with? Like I said, its been *soloed* that means you can handle it with one support and a decent DD. You need optimal gear like DT sets and such though, so if you aren't confident in your skills you can only do a lower difficulty. People can still tank w/o being a PLD, I do it all the time on BLU. You need decent ilevel gear like skirmish3 gear or reforged relic gear. People have trioed delve zones, AA fights on difficult etc. I've personally gone with odd setups to many different fights and still won. The only thing you really need that cookie cutter setup on is specific NMs and VD fights. Even then GEO will suffice and they are probably easier to find than BRD.

[InpendingDeath]

Hey, I've been trying to get into parties or form my own to actually do some events, and I and other leaders are finding it harder and harder to get enough people together to do high tier battlefields/skirmish/incursion/delve/etc. especialy when you consider how "strict" party roles are.

I just feel like it's hard to get anything done in terms of endgame events if it's gotten so hard to fill a party out for high tier battlefields or skirmish or even Adoulin missions, sometimes It's really, REALLY difficult to get that elusive Aegis/Ochain PLD or a COR or BRD so you have songs/rolls. I just feel like with the limited server pop being able to find good PLDs as well as a good buffer job, and some nights it's even hard to find that last DD sometimes.

I'm willing to admit it just might be my server. but even when I'm not taking charge as a WHM and forming my own group (which is what I usually have to do.), when I join someone else's shout, it just falls apart because we can't find one more person or we can't find x or y job we need to have a good party comp.

days like these makes me really miss the pre-SoA days where more people could tank besides Aegis/Ochain PLDs (remember how prolific NIN tanks were in Aby? or hell, WAR with /NIN tanks?) and that not having that BRD or COR didn't destroy your chances of getting anything done. back in Aby a lot of the time we had to roll without songs or rolls and we had to try our best to make due. (granted we had cruor buffs and Atma back then, but hell, for VW and those other non-Aby events pre-SoA that was a bigger deal.) But now it seems a lot of contents you NEED good rolls or songs, and/or you NEED a good GEO, and a good core of other mage support types for stunnign and all that, which I guess would make things more interesting if it wasn't so hard to even get such strict compositions together.

It's really cool SE is trying to fix these group coordinating problems with LS Concierges and the Unity thing, but the Unity thing is just going to be another big NM event you probably on't have the right party comp to actually do.

It's ahh, it's frustrating. even LS groups might be hard to pull off if your LSes don't have the right mix of jobs.

It is more difficult, and yes lack of population is a big problem but also the fact most people are capped on gear so they get nothing but chapters, and most don't even need those. Most people don't like playing BRD and PLD (DD only mentality) or tend to stick with their friends and groups they know, but the lack of needing anything is he big issue. One thing I've learned in the past few months on this game unless it's your friends helping someone out is a crime. If I don't benefit from it {See you again!}

[Zumi]

I think its because once you beat the story missions there really isn't much left to do with the game. I know me and a lot of other people feel the same way.

I did delve and AA fights, and got a 119 set of gear for my paladin but do i need anymore gear from other stuff? Not really its really similar to the 119 AF set I have. Can I beat any content in the game, with 1 set of 119 gear yes. After I beat stuff once do I have a reason to keep farming it? Not really.

[Vasch]

I think a lot of the issue with the BCs stems from the fact that they cost merits to enter. Your average/casual player takes way longer to farm merits than a hardcore/dedicated player would. This makes it so that the average player will not want to attempt the content unless they perceive a high chance of success.

The drop rate on the BCs is also fairly low on Normal or lower, enough so that more casual players will not see value in repeated runs, especially when the drops they want are a 1 in 4+ chance even after the low drop rate. If drops were to be increased to 100% on normal, 50%+ chance of 2 drops on Difficult, and 100% 2 drops on Very Difficult, you would likely see more players tackle this content as well as high end players aiming for the top.

As far as Delve goes, a lot of the problems stem from the fact that the mobs in Delve 1 still need to be stunned. Finding a competent stunner is hard, even for the highest level of endgame groups. No matter how strong your DD are or how good your support is, most parties will get wrecked by Delve 1 mob attacks without a good stunner. This is bad because most of the Delve 1 gear is a good entry point to the rest of the 119 endgame gear, but your average players are unable to complete it in a pickup setting. People are paying 5m gil to get these clears from players that sneeze at the content and clear it and that's not how it should be.

[Afania]

Hey, I've been trying to get into parties or form my own to actually do some events, and I and other leaders are finding it harder and harder to get enough people together to do high tier battlefields/skirmish/incursion/delve/etc. especialy when you consider how "strict" party roles are.

I just feel like it's hard to get anything done in terms of endgame events if it's gotten so hard to fill a party out for high tier battlefields or skirmish or even Adoulin missions, sometimes It's really, REALLY difficult to get that elusive Aegis/Ochain PLD or a COR or BRD so you have songs/rolls. I just feel like with the limited server pop being able to find good PLDs as well as a good buffer job, and some nights it's even hard to find that last DD sometimes.

I'm willing to admit it just might be my server. but even when I'm not taking charge as a WHM and forming my own group (which is what I usually have to do.), when I join someone else's shout, it just falls apart because we can't find one more person or we can't find x or y job we need to have a good party comp.

days like these makes me really miss the pre-SoA days where more people could tank besides Aegis/Ochain PLDs (remember how prolific NIN tanks were in Aby? or hell, WAR with /NIN tanks?) and that not having that BRD or COR didn't destroy your chances of getting anything done. back in Aby a lot of the time we had to roll without songs or rolls and we had to try our best to make due. (granted we had cruor buffs and Atma back then, but hell, for VW and those other non-Aby events pre-SoA that was a bigger deal.) But now it seems a lot of contents you NEED good rolls or songs, and/or you NEED a good GEO, and a good core of other mage support types for stunnign and all that, which I guess would make things more interesting if it wasn't so hard to even get such strict compositions together.

It's really cool SE is trying to fix these group coordinating problems with LS Concierges and the Unity thing, but the Unity thing is just going to be another big NM event you probably on't have the right party comp to actually do.

It's ahh, it's frustrating. even LS groups might be hard to pull off if your LSes don't have the right mix of jobs.

A lot of the jobs are skippable, you definitely don't need a BRD, COR nor ochain/aegis PLD to beat the BC unless you're doing VD. Once I've seen a PUG leader refuse to enter a Normal difficulty BC without a BRD in pt, claiming it's 100% wipe without a BRD. It took me a while to convince him that it's completely not worth the time to /shout for a BRD and N is doable without a BRD. In the end we won fairly easily as well.

Next time if you can't find certain jobs, just go without them.