[dev1240] Linkshell Concierges

[Dale]

This opinion is probably going to be unpopular: but if I had my way players would only be able to have one linkshell and that's it.

I find this encourages players to be loyal and willing to contribute on a more even playing field when that is the case.

[Sasuko]

This opinion is probably going to be unpopular: but if I had my way players would only be able to have one linkshell and that's it.

I find this encourages players to be loyal and willing to contribute on a more even playing field when that is the case.

It may not be as unpopular as you think, and certainly not entirely wrong. There are pros and cons to both, as well as exceptions. There was a time when I may have more enthusiastically agreed with your opinion. However, with the current state of the game, being able to be active in two shells at the same time instead of jumping between them for periods of time would more than likely increase both social and event activity on many linkshells. Kind of like a consolidation/merging, while expanding at the same time.

Edit: Actually, thinking about it more at the moment, even years ago it would have been nice to be able to hang out on a linkshell with your less endgame inclined friends while still being aware of what is going on in your more hardcore shell. Heck, I wish the possibility was on the table when I used to run a large social LS back on Midgard because I wouldn't have had to give up being present in that linkshell in order to also engage in HNM/endgame linkshells. The best I could do at the time was make a deal with an endgame LS to funnel members of my own to it who were actually interested in such activities to try and keep people together. I suppose it was beneficial to my own LS that we were not limited to only one possible LS, or I would have to seriously choose between friends and personal in-game goals.

[Dale]

It may not be as unpopular as you think, and certainly not entirely wrong. There are pros and cons to both, as well as exceptions. There was a time when I may have more enthusiastically agreed with your opinion. However, with the current state of the game, being able to be active in two shells at the same time instead of jumping between them for periods of time would more than likely increase both social and event activity on many linkshells. Kind of like a consolidation/merging, while expanding at the same time.

Edit: Actually, thinking about it more at the moment, even years ago it would have been nice to be able to hang out on a linkshell with your less endgame inclined friends while still being aware of what is going on in your more hardcore shell. Heck, I wish the possibility was on the table when I used to run a large social LS back on Midgard because I wouldn't have had to give up being present in that linkshell in order to also engage in HNM/endgame linkshells. The best I could do at the time was make a deal with an endgame LS to funnel members of my own to it who were actually interested in such activities to try and keep people together. I suppose it was beneficial to my own LS that we were not limited to only one possible LS, or I would have to seriously choose between friends and personal in-game goals.

I used to run a linkshell on Midgard too. I was also very lenient when it came to recruitment and it grew to be huge and I can't tell you how many hours and hours me and my friends spent helping new members complete their various job training quests, sky access, COP etc. only to have them basically say _____ you when it was all over and go join another LS.

So basically instead of helping our LS grow stronger, we were just wasting our time training the recruits for other linkshells who of course wanted nothing to do with those members while they were young, inexperienced, and in need of help. And to twist the dagger even more, we often would end up competing against those very same players we had taken so much time to groom later in places like Sky. It was very discouraging to say the least, and eventually lead to many of my friends and even myself to stop being so generous with our help toward fellow members.

So due to my personal experience with this, you could say I'm bias and I dislike even the mention of an endgame linkshell. I've always thought a linkshell/guild should be about creating a foundation for players to experience and learn the game together and work as a team to get things done. When they are seen as just chat channels associated with certain events or activities I believe it cheapens their purpose overall and a lot of good people who are trying to build a strong community can end up getting taken advantage of.

All that being said: you make a lot of solid points and I'll admit the issue isn't black and white. But needless to say, I have learned my lesson and we are very careful about who we bring into our linkshell now. I won't ever put myself through that endless treadmill again.

[Sasuko]

I can't tell you how many hours and hours me and my friends spent helping new members complete their various job training quests, sky access, COP etc. only to have them basically say _____ you when it was all over and go join another LS.

So basically instead of helping our LS grow stronger, we were just wasting our time training the recruits for other linkshells who of course wanted nothing to do with those members while they were young, inexperienced, and in need of help. And to twist the dagger even more, we often would end up competing against those very same players we had taken so much time to groom later in places like Sky. It was very discouraging to say the least, and eventually lead to many of my friends and even myself to stop being so generous with our help toward fellow members.

I know those feelings quite well myself, which is why in the past I would have cheered on your opinion wholeheartedly. I could probably still run people through all the old missions in my sleep, having repeated them to a ridiculous degree for others. I also still have a mule with gear and meds I crafted for LS people to borrow to make the CoP missions more successful. Although stepping back from those feelings of bitterness and resentment that I carried for years myself, I realize also that only being able to have a single linkshell at a time would not change the situation. The more hardcore linkshells would still be known, and the same result would occur with players who had a strong interest in an endgame focus if the more laid back LS was unable to provide it such as mine was not. I know I had no desire to push and force people to do things they did not enjoy simply so myself and some others could progress down that route. While we dabbled in the more hardcore aspects of the game for fun, none of the more casual players were really "ready" for it, but I don't believe in excluding interested parties simply because they don't have the time (or sometimes even real interest) in obtaining better gear or skill. Obviously this creates a difficulty all it's own. lol.

The only real preventive against losing members to linkshells with a different focus would be if the system locked you into that LS until you either recreate, server transfer, or the shell is broken. I'm not sure I would like a system that locked you into the same LS for the rest of your character's life either. It could be miserable if you end up in one that you are very much incompatible with, and that definitely doesn't make the game enjoyable or fun as a game should be.

That is where I've come to feel being able to "equip" two linkshells at the same time is a compensation of the two ends of the spectrum. The grey of the black and white of it. While I look back and see how it could have been of great benefit in the past as well with keeping members active who in turn would have been able to continue giving back to the LS while still being a part of a more focused and driven group, I think it would be a great asset still with the decline in the player base. For example let's say your main linkshell is simply not very active anymore outside of one or two scheduled events, yet you have that innate loyalty to the LS which makes you unwilling to "jump ship" so to speak even though you also have a pearl to a more active one. To keep up with what is going on in the second pearl, currently you would have to no longer see what is going on in the first. So if a couple people become active on the first and want to do something as an LS, you could have been the 6th to help accomplish it instead of the idea dissolving at not having a 6th...but you wouldn't know unless you sat around staring at the silence for hours waiting, someone sends you a tell, or in some cases are lucky enough to see the shout if they're even willing to shout.

That type of scenario seems fairly common these days, and also why I think SE going back to the idea of dual linkshells and getting that implemented would be far more beneficial to the game than this current idea which feels like an over complicated way to fill your inventory with pearls and encourage linkshell hopping.

This system is good for new players who need a friendly casual LS which will answer all those new adventurer questions, and provide assistance with LBs and advice etc.

I agree, this system could be very useful for new players in search of an LS, or returning players who no longer have a home. RalphTheGalka is right though, and I think the over complication in the system could be a hindrance for the very players that would have the most benefit of the Concierge.

... because the people there have a lot of heart and are fun to be around.

Those are the best friends to have in a game!

[Dale]

I know those feelings quite well myself, which is why in the past I would have cheered on your opinion wholeheartedly. I could probably still run people through all the old missions in my sleep, having repeated them to a ridiculous degree for others. I also still have a mule with gear and meds I crafted for LS people to borrow to make the CoP missions more successful. Although stepping back from those feelings of bitterness and resentment that I carried for years myself, I realize also that only being able to have a single linkshell at a time would not change the situation. The more hardcore linkshells would still be known, and the same result would occur with players who had a strong interest in an endgame focus if the more laid back LS was unable to provide it such as mine was not. I know I had no desire to push and force people to do things they did not enjoy simply so myself and some others could progress down that route. While we dabbled in the more hardcore aspects of the game for fun, none of the more casual players were really "ready" for it, but I don't believe in excluding interested parties simply because they don't have the time (or sometimes even real interest) in obtaining better gear or skill. Obviously this creates a difficulty all it's own. lol.

The only real preventive against losing members to linkshells with a different focus would be if the system locked you into that LS until you either recreate, server transfer, or the shell is broken. I'm not sure I would like a system that locked you into the same LS for the rest of your character's life either. It could be miserable if you end up in one that you are very much incompatible with, and that definitely doesn't make the game enjoyable or fun as a game should be.

That is where I've come to feel being able to "equip" two linkshells at the same time is a compensation of the two ends of the spectrum. The grey of the black and white of it. While I look back and see how it could have been of great benefit in the past as well with keeping members active who in turn would have been able to continue giving back to the LS while still being a part of a more focused and driven group, I think it would be a great asset still with the decline in the player base. For example let's say your main linkshell is simply not very active anymore outside of one or two scheduled events, yet you have that innate loyalty to the LS which makes you unwilling to "jump ship" so to speak even though you also have a pearl to a more active one. To keep up with what is going on in the second pearl, currently you would have to no longer see what is going on in the first. So if a couple people become active on the first and want to do something as an LS, you could have been the 6th to help accomplish it instead of the idea dissolving at not having a 6th...but you wouldn't know unless you sat around staring at the silence for hours waiting, someone sends you a tell, or in some cases are lucky enough to see the shout if they're even willing to shout.

That type of scenario seems fairly common these days, and also why I think SE going back to the idea of dual linkshells and getting that implemented would be far more beneficial to the game than this current idea which feels like an over complicated way to fill your inventory with pearls and encourage linkshell hopping.

You're right it doesn't prevent it from happening out-right. But I do believe having only a single linkshell would make someone think twice before abandoning it in hopes of finding greener pastures. Especially if that linkshell was very helpful to them and the player would have to risk losing that to try out a different one.

I'm sure some would still jump ship though so you're point is taken.

[Olor]

For example let's say your main linkshell is simply not very active anymore outside of one or two scheduled events, yet you have that innate loyalty to the LS which makes you unwilling to "jump ship" so to speak even though you also have a pearl to a more active one. To keep up with what is going on in the second pearl, currently you would have to no longer see what is going on in the first. So if a couple people become active on the first and want to do something as an LS, you could have been the 6th to help accomplish it instead of the idea dissolving at not having a 6th...but you wouldn't know unless you sat around staring at the silence for hours waiting, someone sends you a tell, or in some cases are lucky enough to see the shout if they're even willing to shout.

That type of scenario seems fairly common these days, and also why I think SE going back to the idea of dual linkshells and getting that implemented would be far more beneficial to the game than this current idea which feels like an over complicated way to fill your inventory with pearls and encourage linkshell hopping.

I've had this happen and unfortunately it just speeds the decline of smaller shells. I always feel bad when I swap out shells but then I don't like being in a really lonely shell with 2AFK people and one person soloing their MONs only... you know? So I agree that equipping multiple shells should be the priority and will help smaller shells grow and not falter.

I like this LS concierge idea in theory but then I don't want to carry around more pearls or be in unsustainably small shells.