This game could beneift from a classic server.

[PlumbGame]

That's good. Personally my playtime has pretty much stayed constant throughout the years. But a lot of people (not me) play a lot more casually now. In addition to just having more life responsibilities, there are a wealth of competing MMOs and other game alternatives that simply weren't around 5-6 years ago. If you can maintain that play style then bully for you, but do you not agree that as a whole the player base has gotten less hardcore and devotes fewer hours per week than during the game's level 75 cap hey day?

People aren't looking for a "classic" server to try and be some MMO killer for another MMO. They are looking for a server because there is a decent chunk of people who prefer that play style that enjoyed FFXI during those days that would like to play during that era again.

I have no idea how I can agree with you considering the peak of FFXI was during the most hardcore days. Let me rephrase that. The currrent ffxi playerbase doesn't even come close to the subs SE had back in the day. To assume that "more casual" is what any FFXI player wants would be vastly inaccurate. To assume that the current subs to FFXI want more casual is another story, which again, would be hard to determine considering that the majority of the pop doesn't even visit the forums, let alone respond/look at anything other than dev responses. But now I'm starting to feel like a broken record through the same constant responses to give to players who obviously don't read a thread.

[detlef]

People aren't looking for a "classic" server to try and be some MMO killer for another MMO. They are looking for a server because there is a decent chunk of people who prefer that play style that enjoyed FFXI during those days that would like to play during that era again.

I have no idea how I can agree with you considering the peak of FFXI was during the most hardcore days. Let me rephrase that. The currrent ffxi playerbase doesn't even come close to the subs SE had back in the day. To assume that "more casual" is what any FFXI player wants would be vastly inaccurate. To assume that the current subs to FFXI want more casual is another story, which again, would be hard to determine considering that the majority of the pop doesn't even visit the forums, let alone respond/look at anything other than dev responses. But now I'm starting to feel like a broken record through the same constant responses to give to players who obviously don't read a thread.

What kind of play style are you referring to? Did you like the XP? The events? The world spawns? Or does this have something to do with the community?

Also you're a bit confrontational here. We can have a discussion without you getting upset.

[PlumbGame]

What kind of play style are you referring to? Did you like the XP? The events? The world spawns? Or does this have something to do with the community?

Also you're a bit confrontational here. We can have a discussion without you getting upset.

Uhh what. No one is upset at all. You are one of those people that says umadbro whenever someone disagree with you aren't you? I'm also confused by your question.

[detlef]

Uhh what. No one is upset at all. You are one of those people that says umadbro whenever someone disagree with you aren't you? I'm also confused by your question.

I'm asking you what you're looking for in a classic server. What aspects of the game from back then are attractive to you now? If you read the thread (as you accused me of not doing), there's not really much about what people want. It's unclear whether people want to be able to group up and XP at lower levels. Or if they miss competition for world spawns. Or if they liked the events.

[PlumbGame]

I'm asking you what you're looking for in a classic server. What aspects of the game from back then are attractive to you now? If you read the thread (as you accused me of not doing), there's not really much about what people want. It's unclear whether people want to be able to group up and XP at lower levels. Or if they miss competition for world spawns. Or if they liked the events.

There isn't just 1 thing people miss that want a classic server. Maybe that is why you are asking the question as it seems you feel there needs to be some sort of basis as to why someone would want that. As a whole, people want the entire experience. Now some people do find certain things not as attractable, like competing for HNMs, but still want the entire experience. There doesn't have to be an OR. I want it all.

[detlef]

There isn't just 1 thing people miss that want a classic server. Maybe that is why you are asking the question as it seems you feel there needs to be some sort of basis as to why someone would want that. As a whole, people want the entire experience. Now some people do find certain things not as attractable, like competing for HNMs, but still want the entire experience. There doesn't have to be an OR. I want it all.

What does 2014 have to do with anything? I play the same amount of time now that I did then, people who worked 40hrs a week in 2004 still work 40hrs a week.

I don't think the average FFXIer worked 40 hours a week back then. How many players picked up this game in HS or college? I highly doubt your average player back then was working full time. The game required a pretty hefty time commitment. Remember spending the entire evening looking for PT, finally getting a BRD, taking 20-30 minutes to get to camp, and then XPing for like an hour before somebody had to leave?

This is obviously my opinion, but I don't think people will still put up with that kind of experience. I used the argument that the player base as a whole is more casual, but perhaps it's more accurate to say that the player base has a much lower tolerance for bullshit now than they did back then. Even players who want a classic server.

The other thing is that back then we were eating mud. We ate mud because we didn't know any better. Nowadays, we know there's steak out there. We don't always have steak, sometimes we still eat mud. But why you voluntarily go back to eating nothing but mud with no possibility for steak?

[Natasha]

I don't think the average FFXIer worked 40 hours a week back then. How many players picked up this game in HS or college? I highly doubt your average player back then was working full time. The game required a pretty hefty time commitment. Remember spending the entire evening looking for PT, finally getting a BRD, taking 20-30 minutes to get to camp, and then XPing for like an hour before somebody had to leave?

This is obviously my opinion, but I don't think people will still put up with that kind of experience. I used the argument that the player base as a whole is more casual, but perhaps it's more accurate to say that the player base has a much lower tolerance for bullshit now than they did back then. Even players who want a classic server.

The other thing is that back then we were eating mud. We ate mud because we didn't know any better. Nowadays, we know there's steak out there. We don't always have steak, sometimes we still eat mud. But why you voluntarily go back to eating nothing but mud with no possibility for steak?

In my experience almost everyone I played with was a 40 hr work week, and most of them loved the game like I did and quit some time part way through abyssea. Also i've tried all this "steak" out there and if you ask me THAT is actually the mud. That is my personal experience and you have yours, the reality is that there are people who truly loved how it was and there were those who hated it and those who were in between. Out of all of that I believe there is room on the MMO market to support both kinds of players, and since the "steak" gamers will have none of what I want is it really that unreasonable to come to where my favorite dish was served and ask that it be on the menu again?

As a side note, I don't know how anyone still has this opinion that old school games were not good just because they had flaws (all games have flaws, new school ones have different flaws). I mean, with things like divinity original sin selling well, games like dark souls picking up a large audience, project eternity, Richard Garriott's mmo, and camelot unchained all being funded well on kickstarter there is pleanty of evidence that people do in fact like that kind of game. Its not mud, its at worst its an acquired taste.

[detlef]

In my experience almost everyone I played with was a 40 hr work week, and most of them loved the game like I did and quit some time part way through abyssea. Also i've tried all this "steak" out there and if you ask me THAT is actually the mud. That is my personal experience and you have yours, the reality is that there are people who truly loved how it was and there were those who hated it and those who were in between. Out of all of that I believe there is room on the MMO market to support both kinds of players, and since the "steak" gamers will have none of what I want is it really that unreasonable to come to where my favorite dish was served and ask that it be on the menu again?

As a side note, I don't know how anyone still has this opinion that old school games were not good just because they had flaws (all games have flaws, new school ones have different flaws). I mean, with things like divinity original sin selling well, games like dark souls picking up a large audience, project eternity, Richard Garriott's mmo, and camelot unchained all being funded well on kickstarter there is pleanty of evidence that people do in fact like that kind of game. Its not mud, its at worst its an acquired taste.

Well I guess we just have different game experiences because the vast majority of people I played with at the start were young adults and barely 20-somethings who weren't holding down full-time jobs.

The "steak" I refer to isn't meant to refer to other games. It's more to refer to things that came along within FFXI that were vast improvements. Things like HP warps, Geomancer, /lastsynth, the currencies tab, faster movement speed. Things like that are almost indispensable now.

Finally, I'm not calling all of old FFXI mud. I played through it like everyone else, and if I didn't like it I would have quit. But there was a lot of mud back then, and I think a lot of us didn't recognize that it was mud because we didn't know any better.

[PlumbGame]

I don't think the average FFXIer worked 40 hours a week back then. How many players picked up this game in HS or college? I highly doubt your average player back then was working full time. The game required a pretty hefty time commitment. Remember spending the entire evening looking for PT, finally getting a BRD, taking 20-30 minutes to get to camp, and then XPing for like an hour before somebody had to leave?

This is obviously my opinion, but I don't think people will still put up with that kind of experience. I used the argument that the player base as a whole is more casual, but perhaps it's more accurate to say that the player base has a much lower tolerance for bullshit now than they did back then. Even players who want a classic server.

The other thing is that back then we were eating mud. We ate mud because we didn't know any better. Nowadays, we know there's steak out there. We don't always have steak, sometimes we still eat mud. But why you voluntarily go back to eating nothing but mud with no possibility for steak?

Uhh, almost my entire LS worked 40 hours, I was the exception due to being in HS. You ate mud in 2004? If you are referring to children doing stuff like eating worms, that actually still exists today.

The examples you gave aren't even hefty time requirements. EXPing for an hour is a hefty time commitment? Sitting in one spot with lfp flag up is a hefty time commitment? You are spending more time responding to these posts than the examples you gave.

[detlef]

Uhh, almost my entire LS worked 40 hours, I was the exception due to being in HS. You ate mud in 2004? If you are referring to children doing stuff like eating worms, that actually still exists today.

Oh let me explain myself a little better. The mud example was meant to represent many of the bad things we put up with because we just assumed that that's how things had to be. At the time, all we knew was that MMOs had to be punishing and the way you progressed was just by pushing through it and getting a marginally stronger. Kiting Kirin for an hour was just the way it was.

So we just put up with it because that's what we didn't know any better. So no I'm not talking about literally eating mud. And certainly not worms, I'm sorry for the misunderstanding.

The examples you gave aren't even hefty time requirements. EXPing for an hour is a hefty time commitment? Sitting in one spot with lfp flag up is a hefty time commitment? You are spending more time responding to these posts than the examples you gave.

If you add up the seeking time, the travel time, and the actual XP time, you're putting in a few hours without getting a lot back is my point. There was no guarantee you'd even get an invite at all. And this was during the game's peak when everybody was looking for XP.

I guess I just assumed that back in the day, not everybody had clear sailing XPing jobs that weren't RDM or BRD.