[dev1231] New Battle Content: Incursion! (I know it's just been announced)

[Draylo]

That is actually untrue, my group always fit random oddball jobs into Delve before they had this ridiculous HP change the more you bring. We even took in random people from shouts and forums that needed clears, now we can't do that anymore.

[Kavik]

As long as the party leader or alliance leader is in possession of a Velkk Fetish everyone will be able to access Incursion. There is no need for the whole party to possess the item.

Thank you for the clarification seeing as the original post that was put up states, "once ALL party and alliance members possess velkk fetishes." I read the statement to my husband (also an ffxi player) and he agreed that it sounded as if every person you invited would have to have one.

I'm sincerely grateful that is not to be the case.

[Bebekeke]

If only it was that ballanced...

Delve right now is a good example why it is a bad idea to take in more than 8~10 people and is most efficiently run with 6.
Not only does HP not scale proportionately, with more people pounding on a single mob its TP gain also skyrockets making fights considerably harder than they should be.

There is a reason why people want to only take rangers to certain fights these days.

Generally all the 'extra' people over and above the 6 are not feeding TP... an extra WHM, a SCH to stun, a RDM and/or GEO to reduce mob stats, a SMN for hate-free spike damage that doesn't give TP to the mob (and usually to swap in for buffs on DD for boss) and then maybe a BRD or COR to refresh/haste them if required.

[NimrodXI]

Useless, totally useless.

Instead SE should bring more content like "Wildskeeper reive" ... why ? Simple... people can join anytime they want with the job they like

[Xerius]

That is actually untrue, my group always fit random oddball jobs into Delve before they had this ridiculous HP change the more you bring. We even took in random people from shouts and forums that needed clears, now we can't do that anymore.

The point is you didn't bring those jobs because you wanted to, you brought those jobs because you decided shouting for another hour isn't worth it. The problem isn't that we need more content that allows more people in so the wildcard jobs get a chance to play, the problem is that we need to fix those jobs so there's a reason to bring them.

[Bebekeke]

Useless, totally useless.

Instead SE should bring more content like "Wildskeeper reive" ... why ? Simple... people can join anytime they want with the job they like

Yeah, just like WoE was.... maybe they should upgrade WoE to be more relevant to current gear levels with better rewards...

[Shirai]

Generally all the 'extra' people over and above the 6 are not feeding TP... an extra WHM, a SCH to stun, a RDM and/or GEO to reduce mob stats, a SMN for hate-free spike damage that doesn't give TP to the mob (and usually to swap in for buffs on DD for boss) and then maybe a BRD or COR to refresh/haste them if required.

Yes, when taking in 8 to 10 people you have the option of having the extras come on support jobs as the HP of the mobs hasn't scaled to proportions where an extra DD is needed to kill them in a timely manner and their buffs/debuffs do compensate for the HP increase.
But taking in anything beyond that number will increase enemy HP in such proportions that you have no other choice than taking in more DDs or you'll spend way too long fighting a single NM.

And I don't have to explain what an extra DD on a mob that already takes longer to kill means.

By the way, you may want to drop the illusion of counting on smn for its DD capabilities.
Compared to real DDs the output of a summoner is peanuts and will only make a marginal difference on your run.
I do agree on its other uses, however. (Personal experience as well)

[Bebekeke]

By the way, you may want to drop the illusion of counting on smn for its DD capabilities.
Compared to real DDs the output of a summoner is peanuts and will only make a marginal difference on your run.
I do agree on its other uses, however. (Personal experience as well)

It's not there to do damage comparable to a DD, but it does deal SOME damage, and that damage doesn't feed TP. It's primarily there for buffs/debuffs of course, but it would be silly to tell the SMN that it's damage is too weak, so stop doing BP rages and just stand there with Cait Sith out, looking pretty lol.

And let's face it, the new mobs will most likely have new abilities/auras or whatever that are unknown so for the first few weeks, most groups are going to take a SMN along for the extra safety of PD under 25%, just in case. Maybe even more than one if they're really bad once you level up a few times.

[Shirai]

*Points at signature*
You're not telling me new things here, summoner is also my little baby and I've been playing it quite a few years already.

However looking at the performance of summoners, it's nothing to write home about.
Overall an average summoner pushes 2~3% and a well geared and skilled summoner might push 7% maybe 8% damage with the use of Astral Conduit, as for buffs and debuffs;
You're better off taking a Red Mage or Geomancer these days.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying summoners are completely useless but there are other choices for most situations.
And yes, I am also aware of our defensive capabilities like EA and PD and our crowd management capabilities as well, and no those aren't always needed either.

[Draylo]

The point is you didn't bring those jobs because you wanted to, you brought those jobs because you decided shouting for another hour isn't worth it. The problem isn't that we need more content that allows more people in so the wildcard jobs get a chance to play, the problem is that we need to fix those jobs so there's a reason to bring them.

I don't think anyone is disagreeing with you. To correct you though, I do all my runs since the beginning of the event with my linkshell. I was simply saying I put random people in there just for clears or plasm, we usually clear most of those zones with 8~10 people in old Delve. The point is, you can afford random oddball jobs when they don't HURT you. Making HP scale w/o adjust drops makes it so anything more than necessary to win just hurts you in the end.