Remove jug pet caps altogether! Pet Level = /checkparam item level

[WoW]

The lore for Puks when they were added in Aht Urhgan was that they were one of many types of chimera (dragon and some sort of vermin). I always took it as that's the only reason Beastmaster can charm them is because they are part Vermin. It would be in SE's best interest just to re-categorize them under Vermin and end the dispute/potential for Puk jugs. It makes me wonder though if Killer Instinct works with a charmed Puk.

Full blooded dragons in my opinion do stray too much into Dragoon territory. It was always denoted in the lore of the game that Undead, Dragons, Arcana, & Demons were in a class of their own of being more sentient, hence why they could not be easily tamed. Each of them already have their respective "knights". I personally like Beastmaster just fine as being a "knight" of the 7 common creature types. I just wish Monster Correlation and individual pet identity was more applicable, among other things like just raw damage/utility increase.

How do you feel about blu and bst overlapping as it pertains to monster abilities? How about bst killer intimidation effects on gear? Dragons do not tame wyrms, puks, and dragons in XI. Bahamut is also described as the wyrm king, but has nothing to do with dragoons, nor do shadow dragons. Wyrms are thought to be bahamut's servants, not drgs. Also, puks are called wind wyverns, which is why they are classified as dragons. Iirc, these were categorized as beast at one point http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Category:Monoceros. They are described as beast. Chimera are described as a beast/reptilian hybrid, but are part of the arcana family, not beast or lizard/dragon. Chimera are hybrids as-well (But not charmable nor part of the bst bestiary). However, you brought up a great point, chimera are hybrid beast, part lion, snake, and goat; all are fair game in the bst bestiary. We should be able to charm Khimaira because they are part beast and reptile^^

Drg should not give two craps about a naul or a shadow dragon being a pet, because drg will never tame a naul or shadow dragon; drg game mechanics will not allow it. Dragon breathe every few seconds after a ws ftw?

[Rwolf]

I agree with you that Puks and Khimaira should be in Beastmaster's domain, as they have "beast" components, I just don't agree with you on Wyrms, Dragons, and Wyverns.

Beastmaster has a ton of potential pets left untapped, including a lot of powerful great beast types. I don't see the push in getting SE who already has a rigid stance on lore and fighting to get pet issues fixed, just to give Beastmaster a wyrm pet.

• Saying BLU and BST overlap, is like saying how do I feel about WHM RDM SCH PLD RUN overlap in White Magic and BLM RDM SCH GEO DRK overlap in Black Magic. Or how I feel about Ninja getting Max HP Boost when it was a Monk trait. That list goes on forever, there are shared abilities, effects and traits. However those things have nothing to do with lore.
  
  
• Killer effects on weapons and armor are no different than any other shared thing. If you want to get technical. You can say the same thing for Double Attack, Triple Attack, Magic Attack Bonus, Magic Defense Bonus, list goes on and on.
  
  
• Kindred are Demons. Demons are predatory to dragons. So a demon Beastmaster having a dragon pet makes a lot of sense because it is unique to their species not the job.
  
  
• Bahamut counter-argument makes no sense. The only interaction we have with Bahamut is CoP-related which the story has nothing to do with Dragoons. By that logic it doesn't make sense for a Dragoon whose lore is to hunt wyrms and dragons to subjugate one. But somehow it makes perfect sense that a humanoid Beastmaster with no lore whatsoever around dragons can...
  
  
• Yes puks are part dragon, just like they are part vermin. Not sure how you're trying to correct me when I said they were a chimera (hybrid) of both.
• I don't understand the Monoceros part in regard to advocating wyrm pets for Beastmaster.
  
  
• Khimaira are part beast/reptile/whatever else, as no one completely knows and are a chimera (different spelling). The general definition of a chimera is a definition of any species comprised as a hybrid of more than one species. In FFXI, Lamiae and Puks are other chimeras.

[WoW]

I agree with you that Puks and Khimaira should be in Beastmaster's domain, as they have "beast" components, I just don't agree with you on Wyrms, Dragons, and Wyverns.

Beastmaster has a ton of potential pets left untapped, including a lot of powerful great beast types. I don't see the push in getting SE who already has a rigid stance on lore and fighting to get pet issues fixed, just to give Beastmaster a wyrm pet.

• Saying BLU and BST overlap, is like saying how do I feel about WHM RDM SCH PLD RUN overlap in White Magic and BLM RDM SCH GEO DRK overlap in Black Magic. Or how I feel about Ninja getting Max HP Boost when it was a Monk trait. That list goes on forever, there are shared abilities, effects and traits. However those things have nothing to do with lore.
  
  
• Killer effects on weapons and armor are no different than any other shared thing. If you want to get technical. You can say the same thing for Double Attack, Triple Attack, Magic Attack Bonus, Magic Defense Bonus, list goes on and on.
  
  
• Kindred are Demons. Demons are predatory to dragons. So a demon Beastmaster having a dragon pet makes a lot of sense because it is unique to their species not the job.
  
  
• Bahamut counter-argument makes no sense. The only interaction we have with Bahamut is CoP-related which the story has nothing to do with Dragoons. By that logic it doesn't make sense for a Dragoon whose lore is to hunt wyrms and dragons to subjugate one. But somehow it makes perfect sense that a humanoid Beastmaster with no lore whatsoever around dragons can...
  
  
• Yes puks are part dragon, just like they are part vermin. Not sure how you're trying to correct me when I said they were a chimera (hybrid) of both.
• I don't understand the Monoceros part in regard to advocating wyrm pets for Beastmaster.
  
  
• Khimaira are part beast/reptile/whatever else, as no one completely knows and are a chimera (different spelling). The general definition of a chimera is a definition of any species comprised as a hybrid of more than one species. In FFXI, Lamiae and Puks are other chimeras.

Lore? As in those circle abilities you can get by subbing the "Knights" at lvl 5?

You made my point for me, drgs have nothing to do with every dragon (bahamut), only wyverns.

Your argument is contradicting; the thought of "no" dragon pets is contradictory because we can tame one, lol. Puks are not vermin, they count towards dragon kills. Puks are classified as dragons. The vermin argument is senseless because they are dragons.

Read this http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...l=1#post191859. The four sky bosses are a possibility, one of them is a wyvern. SE was going to allow us summon similar pets. If SE alluded to a the possibility, but yet, backpeddled, it is contradictory and I don't see how ppl can argue against it when SE alluded to allowing us summon a Adamantoise (Surfaced), Roc, Wyvern, and Tiger.

So, we can charm a dragon, SE alluded to allowing us call forth a seiryu -esque pet, and automotons are usable by anyone, but yet, ppl are screaming no to bst pet dragons.

Lore; beast are masters of the natural world, so saying our killer effects are not lore related is akin to saying dragoon's lore (you alluded) to is null-void, no? You discussed the "knights" bst having the 7 ecosystems while drg, plds,and drks having sentimental ties to dragons, undead, and arcana, but yet, it is ok for bst to tame a khimaira whom are Arcana. So essentially, anything that is not "drg territory' is off limits. The only lore drg have toward dragons in XI is dragon killers. Lets not act like drgs were taming wyrms and shadow dragons.

Also, i know chimera are hybrid, that is what i alluded to in my previous post when you were discussing hybrid (Puk).

Bottomline is this, beast can tame a dragon; idc if he is part vermin, behemoth, Black, Japanese, Korean, Blasian, taru, galka, pitbull, etc, they are classified as dragons and bst can charm them. Killer effects aside, we can charm them, which is not always the case as it pertains to being predatory.

[Rwolf]

Using a support job has nothing to do with lore and storyline. Puks are part dragon, part vermin. Go read the official description of the species from SE. It's classified as dragon because the system doesn't allow for both and SE chose to throw it under Dragons. Hence why I said SE needs to just change it to their vermin side so people will stop complaining BST can charm dragons. Because it's not a true dragon, it is part beast. I'm not repeating that any more and SE said no because of lore. If you want to ignore the lore officially written by SE and think the game's lore is based on job abilities and support jobs, knock yourself out.

Your posts are all over the place and really this is stemming from you personally not liking someone disagreeing with your concept of the game. Same as the other thread arguing BST pets are inexpensive because you've maxed Cooking. The real bottom line is you voice an opinion, you don't like when someone disagrees with your opinion and beat it to death with a wall of text that isn't really a counterpoint and get all wound up.

End of me participating in derailing a thread that's supposed to be focused on jug pet caps and pet levels. I agree and support SE's response on lore and explained why, and you are free to disagree.

[WoW]

Using a support job has nothing to do with lore and storyline. Puks are part dragon, part vermin. Go read the official description of the species from SE. It's classified as dragon because the system doesn't allow for both and SE chose to throw it under Dragons. Hence why I said SE needs to just change it to their vermin side so people will stop complaining BST can charm dragons. Because it's not a true dragon, it is part beast. I'm not repeating that any more and SE said no because of lore. If you want to ignore the lore officially written by SE and think the game's lore is based on job abilities and support jobs, knock yourself out.

Your posts are all over the place and really this is stemming from you personally not liking someone disagreeing with your concept of the game. Same as the other thread arguing BST pets are inexpensive because you've maxed Cooking. The real bottom line is you voice an opinion, you don't like when someone disagrees with your opinion and beat it to death with a wall of text that isn't really a counterpoint and get all wound up.

End of me participating in derailing a thread that's supposed to be focused on jug pet caps and pet levels. I agree and support SE's response on lore and explained why, and you are free to disagree.

SE alluded to adding a wyvern pet, but you completely glossed over that XD.

But keep ranting; puks are dragons, bottomline. If SE changed them to vermin that will just pile on to the contradicting because puks have dragon traits and count as dragon kills in ToM.

You can create all the lore you want (You never clarified lore btw, only "knights" Also, bst knight being a knight? whaaaa?), but fact, puks are dragons, get over it brah^^

You are also getting extremely confrontational and personal, this is personal because you are bringing up old threads I posted in, cooking? Really?

Balloon disagreed with me, but I respectably told him I can get with that http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...l=1#post516796. I agree, we still have monsters that are yet to see the light of day.

No clue what you are talking about brah "Shrugs" I even agreed with ppl about jug cost http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...l=1#post503768, my thing was the efficacy and cost does not equate; man....talk about ppl being all over the place, lol (You). I understand that everyone does not want to lvl a craft, but I would be lying if i told you it did not make jug accessibility much easier.

To end this derailment, PUKS ARE VERMIN; happy?^^
http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/P..._Fantasy_XI%29

P.S, they beg to differ, puks may be part colibri.