Request. Please allow trust in abbysea

[Afania]

I think really the answer to the thread is simply if you can't do it because you didn't get things when they were being done by everyone, well FFXI is not for you and you should simply quit now.

Many players do not want "their" game changed in any way, even if it helps players the game desperately needs.

"players can't get atmas" too bad for them!
"players can't get clears in dyna" Sucks for them, no competition for me!

Re-subbing to FFXI is honestly just about reliving fun times of the past, once you try to make progress you see it's really not worth your time anymore. The problems you are having with these minor things now will be magnified when you try to do higher content.

I would suggest that you get as much fun as you can and just unsub Lord, I'm on my 6th week back after being absent for 2 years and I highly doubt I'll bother subbing next month. The game just doesn't want returnees or new players and any community the game had has long since rotted away.

Get what fun you can and find another MMO.

I don't think anyone in this thread go "too bad for you if you can't get atma". From what I've seen, Lord repeatedly said he/she doesn't care about proc/atma, just wanted clear.

I'm also pretty sure if he asked "I'm a returning player and I need help with clear" ppl on his server would help as well. But instead he insisted to solo everything and when he can't solo, he blamed the community for disagreeing with his opinion.

I know plenty of friends often help new/returning player on missions and such. It's just the matter of asking for help.

[Damane]

I think really the answer to the thread is simply if you can't do it because you didn't get things when they were being done by everyone, well FFXI is not for you and you should simply quit now.

Many players do not want "their" game changed in any way, even if it helps players the game desperately needs.

"players can't get atmas" too bad for them!
"players can't get clears in dyna" Sucks for them, no competition for me!

Re-subbing to FFXI is honestly just about reliving fun times of the past, once you try to make progress you see it's really not worth your time anymore. The problems you are having with these minor things now will be magnified when you try to do higher content.

I would suggest that you get as much fun as you can and just unsub Lord, I'm on my 6th week back after being absent for 2 years and I highly doubt I'll bother subbing next month. The game just doesn't want returnees or new players and any community the game had has long since rotted away.

Get what fun you can and find another MMO.

i am sorry i would agree with Lords point, if he HAD one. but Abyssea is very soloable without atmas, alot of people stated that ilvl 117 emience gear is really sufficient to get started and get alot of things done easely and that is true, from that point on you can go on and farm the atmas, even more easy to farm atmas if you have NIN or WAR lvld. Its like you guys are totally phasing out all the information people are throwing at you.

the only adjustments abyssea, dynamis and voidwatch needs are easier procing, to accomodate for solo/small PT playing thats it.

[Pixela]

Explain how this is what I said earlier, explain how the steps I provided aren't able to be done or don't work.

Seeing as Dynamis is actually a major part of the economy and Trusts being allowed in Dyna wouldn't only interfere with individuals but the economy at large due to the fact it would result in more mobs dying without procs and thus less currency overall in the entire server... this is hardly a matter of selfishness, rather it's a legitimate concern. Explain to me why this should be changed for a few people who can't get wins and are possibly not even asking for help/shouting to make a group while hitting the economy at large and I'll have a talk with you about it. Simply misinterpreting that which people are saying means nothing in the end.

Atma drop rate without a red proc is somewhere around 1%. Spending possible months monotonously repeating low tier to get one base atma to get upto doing bosses (good luck with the walrus) is just not worth it for content with no worthwhile drops in it anymore. Experiencing the story and taking months is not worth it.

Square know this is an issue because they already had a campaign for new and return players to get the atmas etc, why argue against that being full time or players being able to get key atmas easier.

Dynamis:

There are 11 Dynamis zones and a dedicated farmer can farm anywhere in the whole zone for a limited amount of time.
Server populations are in the hundreds for western players.
You can enter at any time.
People who were farming would not use DPS trust (this issue may I remind you was about getting boss clears), only healers or tanks (and the main point wasn't for farming it was for clears). Don't you dare tell me that the long term players (many who are against trusts) aren't using cure alts which is no different at all.
Not allowing players to get clears is causing more issues since they can't access other areas and as such just farm the 3 starter areas.

Trusts in Dynamis will have almost no impact on currency prices.

[Zarchery]

There are 11 Dynamis zones and a dedicated farmer can farm anywhere in the whole zone for a limited amount of time.
Server populations are in the hundreds for western players.
You can enter at any time.
People who were farming would not use DPS trust (this issue may I remind you was about getting boss clears), only healers or tanks (and the main point wasn't for farming it was for clears). Don't you dare tell me that the long term players (many who are against trusts) aren't using cure alts which is no different at all.
Not allowing players to get clears is causing more issues since they can't access other areas and as such just farm the 3 starter areas.

Trusts in Dynamis will have almost no impact on currency prices.

See here's where you're utterly misinformed. I can tell you've never farmed currency.

First off, there are only 10 Dynamis zones -- Bastok, Sandoria, Windurst, Jeuno, Beaucedine, Xarcabard, (the 6 original), as well as Valkurm, Buburimu, Qufim, and Tavnazia (dreamlands Dynamis).

Of these, the first 6 aren't reliable currency farming zones. They're packed with beastmen. You can only farm effectively if you can get proc, and you can only reliably get proc with job abilities. Since only MNK NIN THF BST and RNG type beastmen mobs can be proced with job abilities, that means that most mobs will not net you any currency. The mobs are evenly distributed, so it's impossible to pull one of the 5 JA proc types without pulling several time wasting mobs you can't.

So that leaves us with 4 zones. In each of those zones, you can only JA proc during 1/3 of the day, on your choice of 3 mob types. For example, in Dynamis Qufim...

0:00 - 8:00 --- Bynes -- Krakens, Tribats, Rocs
8:00 - 16:00 --- Ordelle Bronze -- Weapons, Snolls, Fat Bats
16:00 - 0:00 -- Whiteshells -- Raptors, Tigers, Diremites.

The problem is that the mobs here are so weak and have a long enough repop timer that each mob type can only support one farmer at a time. If it's 16:00 and one guy is at the diremites, nobody else can farm the diremites. There's really 2 sets of mobs high tier and low tier, so during that time you can probably support 6 farmers at a given time. More than 3 is rough because I've noticed that the proc rate and currency drops are worse on the lower tiers.

I don't really see a lot of harm in trusts in Dynamis for clears and relic farming, and anyone who tried currency farming with trusts would probably get a terrible yield and give up. So I really don't care about this. But Dynamis currency farming is a lot less flexible than you think.

[Pixela]

See here's where you're utterly misinformed. I can tell you've never farmed currency.

First off, there are only 10 Dynamis zones -- Bastok, Sandoria, Windurst, Jeuno, Beaucedine, Xarcabard, (the 6 original), as well as Valkurm, Buburimu, Qufim, and Tavnazia (dreamlands Dynamis).

Of these, the first 6 aren't reliable currency farming zones. They're packed with beastmen. You can only farm effectively if you can get proc, and you can only reliably get proc with job abilities. Since only MNK NIN THF BST and RNG type beastmen mobs can be proced with job abilities, that means that most mobs will not net you any currency. The mobs are evenly distributed, so it's impossible to pull one of the 5 JA proc types without pulling several time wasting mobs you can't.

So that leaves us with 4 zones. In each of those zones, you can only JA proc during 1/3 of the day, on your choice of 3 mob types. For example, in Dynamis Qufim...

0:00 - 8:00 --- Bynes -- Krakens, Tribats, Rocs
8:00 - 16:00 --- Ordelle Bronze -- Weapons, Snolls, Fat Bats
16:00 - 0:00 -- Whiteshells -- Raptors, Tigers, Diremites.

The problem is that the mobs here are so weak and have a long enough repop timer that each mob type can only support one farmer at a time. If it's 16:00 and one guy is at the diremites, nobody else can farm the diremites. There's really 2 sets of mobs high tier and low tier, so during that time you can probably support 6 farmers at a given time. More than 3 is rough because I've noticed that the proc rate and currency drops are worse on the lower tiers.

I don't really see a lot of harm in trusts in Dynamis for clears and relic farming, and anyone who tried currency farming with trusts would probably get a terrible yield and give up. So I really don't care about this. But Dynamis currency farming is a lot less flexible than you think.

I farmed Dynamis to death, that was 2 years ago though. I know there are best camps and best areas. I've gone in when the populations were 4 times what they are now, all those camps were taken and I had to farm in a bad spot. I still farmed coins, I still farmed enough to come out where it was worthwhile.

When I did it I did tri boxed (with 3 computers), I had a whm/rdm (dia spam), thief/dnc and nin/dnc and I proc'd 99% of every mob I pulled. I know people still take in alts, which makes the trust issue...not an issue. Tust in dyna will have no impact on currency prices.

What people are really saying is "I don't want more competition" but this isn't about competition, because everyone can still go in there and farm the sweet areas/camps with or without trusts as /dnc. The whole issues with trusts was for killing bosses.

[Afania]

I farmed Dynamis to death, that was 2 years ago though. I know there are best camps and best areas. I've gone in when the populations were 4 times what they are now, all those camps were taken and I had to farm in a bad spot. I still farmed coins, I still farmed enough to come out where it was worthwhile.

When I did it I did tri boxed (with 3 computers), I had a whm/rdm (dia spam), thief/dnc and nin/dnc and I proc'd 99% of every mob I pulled. I know people still take in alts, which makes the trust issue...not an issue. Tust in dyna will have no impact on currency prices.

What people are really saying is "I don't want more competition" but this isn't about competition, because everyone can still go in there and farm the sweet areas/camps with or without trusts as /dnc. The whole issues with trusts was for killing bosses.

If the issue is killing bosses, then you should ask for boss adjustment, not asking SE to change something that would affect game economy/balance/player relative strength. Putting trusts in dynamis makes a pretty big difference compare with adjusting boss moves.

[Demonjustin]

Atma drop rate without a red proc is somewhere around 1%. Spending possible months monotonously repeating low tier to get one base atma to get upto doing bosses (good luck with the walrus) is just not worth it for content with no worthwhile drops in it anymore. Experiencing the story and taking months is not worth it.

Square know this is an issue because they already had a campaign for new and return players to get the atmas etc, why argue against that being full time or players being able to get key atmas easier.

Umm~ if you look back a few pages you'll see I was the one who actually brought up the campaign to you in the first place. I've said from the start of the thread till now and will continue to say that instead of asking for Trust in Abyssea you should ask for that to be permanent. That said Abyssea has multiple worthwhile drops, I can give you a list if you'd like as it's quite easy to list off gear I still use today from Abyssea even for just RDM, let alone other players and other jobs.

There are 11 Dynamis zones and a dedicated farmer can farm anywhere in the whole zone for a limited amount of time.
Server populations are in the hundreds for western players.
You can enter at any time.

All correct, and yet only 3~4 are worth farming, 3 are overcrowded as it is, and procs are unfairly set to an unbalanced level which makes /DNC insanely better than all other methods and instantly removes the other zones from being at all good due to being unable to proc anything but JA in a timely manner.

People who were farming would not use DPS trust (this issue may I remind you was about getting boss clears), only healers or tanks (and the main point wasn't for farming it was for clears). Don't you dare tell me that the long term players (many who are against trusts) aren't using cure alts which is no different at all.

Using cure alts for what? Bosses? Well, perhaps I should say ADL as it's the only 'boss' people fight regularly and ok, I'll contend that's true people do use cure mules for that. For farming currency? Ha! No. Farming currency is done with /DNC or by a DNC, either of which provides more than enough healing. The last time I died in Dyna was to a 4k Needles which no amount of healing from a WHM mule would've saved me from. This isn't because I'm a good player, it's because they're level 95~96 mobs which I can destroy even in 117 gear.

As for the bosses. If there were a way to allow Trusts only for bosses I'd be right there with you, arguing for this cause. The fact is that's not going to happen which means you're not going to see me agreeing with Trusts in Dynamis. This is really the only thing you'd need to get to happen for me to support it. That said nerfing the bosses to not spam Death was something I also brought up, I'd be perfectly fine with that too since it's the real reason they can't easily be soloed. You can use /NIN and solo them if you're smart about it but it's definitely not safe nor will it get you through every fight every time.

Not allowing players to get clears is causing more issues since they can't access other areas and as such just farm the 3 starter areas.

Trusts in Dynamis will have almost no impact on currency prices.

Wrong on both accounts. I've explained why on prices. As for the zones, well if we're counting all of them the only 3 zones locked behind closed doors are Xarc, Beau, and Tavnazia. That is unless you want to count the oh so difficult CoP storyline as a block to those zones. That means 7 of 10 zones are free to go to at a whim. Now if you want easier wins I'm fine with that, I already said that much, but changing Dynamis to allow Trusts is never going to be a good idea unless it's for bosses only due to the impact it'll have on the economy.

[Kensagaku]

Even the wins aren't that hard these days, with level 117-119 equipment. Worried about Death? Stop trying to resist it, and instead use that /dnc for Violent Flourish and stun it. It should be the only threatening move from the original city zone bosses as long as you know to turn away from the gaze-type moves. For the Nightmare areas, there are several weakening items if you kill the NQ NMs in the low-tier areas, and you can use those to make the boss of the zone more tolerable. The only one I think that could be more balanced for solo playing is Angra Mainyu, and that is because of Chainspell Death; while Death by itself isn't bad since mobs don't cast that close together, tossing Chainspell on it is a pretty good chance of death. That plus the dragons - though I haven't re-fought it yet at 119 to determine dragon difficulty - makes it a bit of a brutal fight for anyone trying to get the clear.

As for Trust in Abyssea, while it impacts me very little, I still think it's silly. Without any Atma and level 117 gear you can farm your first atma; if you're worried about red proc rate, go nin/dnc or dnc/war, which gives you several procs while maintaining survivability. NIN/DNC gets you katana (1), great katana (2), and dagger (2) for 5/13 procs. About half of them right there isn't bad. Go dnc/war and you've got dagger (2), staff (2, though may need merits for the second), scythe (1), club (2), and sword (2). It's about job efficiency at that point.

For me in Abyssea, I did most of my stuff solo too. At the 99 cap I was soloing a good portion of my +1/2 items between NIN, DNC, BST, and SMN. You're right that I had help for some of the harder atmas, but I also did it 20 levels ago, where we needed help. Now with 20 levels worth of stat vomit on our gear to make us stronger, there should be little risk as long as you plan out your order of attainment and do proper research.

So yeah, I think Trust in Abyssea is unnecessary, but at the same time, I don't care; I was able to solo it, and think you should be able to with the bar lowered so much, but someone having a Trust impacts me very little in Abyssea.

[Zeargi]

I feel the most frustrating thing about this thread, is that most people have offered to help, gave advice, offered strategies, gave reliable references, but none of that seems to matter... Everything seems to be completely rejected. But in the end, those that offer the advice are the 'Bad Guys'

[Lithera]

I feel the most frustrating thing about this thread, is that most people have offered to help, gave advice, offered strategies, gave reliable references, but none of that seems to matter... Everything seems to be completely rejected. But in the end, those that offer the advice are the 'Bad Guys'

Pretty much how this thread has been from page one.