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  1. #101
    Player radarbabyeater's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Location
    To the sun.
    Posts
    69
    Character
    Hrohj
    World
    Asura
    Main Class
    RNG Lv 99
    Here are my thoughts about changes to the Thief job. I apologize; this is a very extensive list. Commentary and opinions are welcome, of course.

    Job Ability Changes:

    "Perfect Dodge"
    • Evades all melee and ranged attacks.
    • This applies to any melee or ranged TP abilities used by the target.

    "Steal"
    • 25% chance to steal an item from the target.
    • This item cannot be an R, E or R/E item.
    • If used within the rear arc of the target, the base success rate is increased to 30%.
    • If used within the front arc of the target, the base success rate is decreased to 20%.
    • Any gear with "Steal" +X is a direct percent increase to successfully steal an item. This bonus is added after all other modifications to "Steal".
    • Against any NM, the base success rate is divided by 2, rounded down.

    Example: Against Gin, you use "Steal". You are behind Gin, so the base success rate is modified from 25% to 30% and then divided by 2 since Gin is a NM. Your new base success rate is 15%. You have "Steal" +15 in bonuses from your equipment, so your new success rate is 30%. You could steal a square of Moonbow Leather since it is the only item that Gin drops that is neither R, E nor R/E.
    • Even if you successfully steal an item, that does not prevent the target from dropping the same item again if defeated.
    • You cannot steal the same item more than once from any target while it is still alive! This applies even if different players are currently playing as a Thief and are actively trying to steal an item. This applies even if you are defeated, log out or the target becomes unclaimed.
    • In the event that a target has had every possible item stolen from it, using "Steal" will fail to procure any more items.
    • Merit Point modifications to "Aura Steal" will not affect the mechanics of stealing items at all; you will still dispel and absorb effects as expected and still have a chance to steal an item from the target.

    "Bully"
    • No changes.

    "Accomplice"
    • Transfers 50% of the enmity of the selected party member to the Thief. The party member that is the target of "Accomplice" will be granted an Enmity -20 effect. This is to help back-line and front-line jobs focus on performing their expected role with less worry about enmity accumulation. It obviously sets you up to transfer a good amount of Enmity via "Trick Attack".
    • The recast time of "Accomplice" is reduced to 3 minutes.
    • The recast time of "Accomplice" is no longer shared with "Collaborator".
    • Note: The enhanced effect from all versions of the Empyrean head equipment are the same.

    "Collaborator"
    • Transfers 25% of the enmity of the Thief to the selected party member. The party member that is the target of "Collaborator" will be granted an Enmity +20 effect. This is to help certain front-line jobs maintain their role of being the the tank within the party. It also helps other front-line jobs focus on performing their expected rolls with less worry about enmity accumulation.
    • The recast time of "Collaborator" is increased to 3 minutes.
    • The recast time of "Collaborator" is no longer shared with "Accomplice".
    • Note: The enhanced effect from all versions of the Empyrean head equipment are the same.

    "Flee"
    • Increases movement speed by 75% instead of 60%.

    "Mug"
    • Mugs an amount of Gil equal to the maximum amount of Gil the target could drop multiplied by 2.
    • Successfully mugging the target does not affect the amount of Gil dropped when it is defeated.
    • Any gear with "Mug" +X is a direct percent increase to multiplied amount.

    Example: You have "Mug" +7 in bonuses from your equipment; thus, you would mug 2.07 times more Gil. If a target could normally drop a maximum of 25,000 Gil when defeated, you would mug 51,750 Gil from that target.
    • You cannot mug the same target more than once while it is still alive! This applies even if you are defeated, log out or the target becomes unclaimed. However, different players that are currently playing as a Thief can mug the target one time each.

    "Despoil"
    • 10% chance to despoil an item from the target.
    • This item can only be an R, E or R/E item.
    • You cannot despoil any item with an item class of Ultra Rare.
    • If used within the rear arc of the target, the base success rate is increased to 15%.
    • If used within the front arc of the target, the base success rate is decreased to 5%.
    • Any gear with "Despoil" +X is a direct percent increase to successfully despoil an item. This bonus is added before all other modifications to "Despoil".
    • Against any NM, the base success rate is divided by 5, rounded down.

    Example: Against Gin, you use "Despoil". You are behind Gin, so the base success rate is modified from 10% to 15% and you have "Despoil" +18 in bonuses from your equipment, so your new base success rate is 33%. This amount is then divided by 5 since Gin is a NM. Your new success rate is 6%. You could despoil a Gin’s Scale, Yamarang or Dingir Ring since they are the only items that Gin drops that are R, E or R/E and are not classed as an Ultra Rare (Ashera Harness) item.
    • Even if you successfully despoil an item, that does not prevent the target from dropping the same item again if defeated.
    • You cannot despoil the same item more than once from any target while it is still alive! This applies even if different players are currently playing as a Thief and are actively trying to despoil an item. This applies even if you are defeated, log out or the target becomes unclaimed.
    • In the event that a target has had every possible item despoiled from it, using "Despoil" will fail to procure any more items.
    • "Despoil" no longer inflicts pointless enfeebling effects on the target.
    • Job Point modifications to "Despoil" will not affect the mechanics of despoiling items at all; you will still despoil TP as expected and still have a chance to despoil an item from the target.

    "Conspirator"
    • Will now affect the player being attacked by the target.
    • Bonuses from "Conspirator" are figured at the time of activation.
    • If no player has enmity on the monster, no bonus will be granted at all.
    • If 1 player has enmity, party members who are conspirators will be granted "Subtle Blow" II +15, Accuracy +30.
    • If 6 players have enmity, party members who are conspirators will be granted "Subtle Blow" II +20, Accuracy +35.
    • If 12 players have enmity, party members who are conspirators will be granted "Subtle Blow" II +25, Accuracy +40.
    • If 18 players have enmity, party members who are conspirators will be granted "Subtle Blow" II +30, Accuracy +45, "Triple Attack" +5%, Haste (Job Ability) +5%.
    • Note: The augmented "Conspirator" effect from all versions of the Empyrean body equipment will also be granted to any party members who are conspirators instead of just the player activating the job ability. This equipment must still be worn for to receive the augmented effects.

    "Hide"
    This is a complete overhaul. While under the effect of "Hide" several bonuses will be granted to the player currently playing on Thief. These bonuses are not available if Thief is set to your Support Job.

    General:
    • Activating "Hide" will cause you to become hidden (invisible) for 2 minutes.
    • Activating any Job Ability that is native to Thief will not cause "Hide" to be removed.
    • "Hide" will remain active until you sustain any damage.
    Combat:
    • Attacking the target with standard melee attacks or Dagger Weapon Skills will not cause "Hide" to be removed.
    Steal, Mug & Despoil:
    • While "Hide" is active, the final success rate of "Steal" is multiplied by 2, rounded down.
    • While "Hide" is active, the final success rate of "Despoil" is multiplied by 1.5, rounded down.
    • While "Hide" is active, the amount of Gil you can mug from a target is multiplied by 2.5 instead of 2, rounded down.
    Sneak Attack & Trick Attack:
    • While "Hide" is active, the positional requirements for the "Sneak Attack" Job Ability are removed.
    • While "Hide" is active, a Weapon Skill Damage +10% bonus is granted to "Sneak Attack".
    • While "Hide" is active, the positional requirements for "Trick Attack" Job Ability and the "Assassin" Job Trait are removed. This essentially allows "Trick Attack" to function as "Sneak Attack" for the duration of "Hide", but there still must be another player in front of you to transfer enmity.
    • While "Hide" is active, a Weapon Skill Damage +10% bonus is granted to "Trick Attack".
    • Note: Any equipment that has the "Hide" +X attribute only increases the duration of "Hide".

    "Sneak Attack" & "Trick Attack"
    • No changes.

    --

    Just remove "Assassin's Charge" from the game. It is literally almost useless.

    --

    Job Point Changes:

    Steal Recast becomes "Steal" Success Rate.
    • Description: Increases rate to successfully steal an item from the target.
    • Effect/Tier: +1% per tier; a maximum of +20%.

    Conspirator Effect becomes "Conspirator" Duration.
    • Description: Increases the duration of "Conspirator".
    • Effect/Tier: +1 second per tier; a maximum of +20 seconds.
    • Note: This bonus is granted to party members who are conspirators.

    Triple Attack Effect becomes to "Triple Attack" Damage.
    • Description: Increases the damage dealt by "Triple Attack".
    • Effect/Tier: +1% damage per tier; a maximum of +20% damage.
    • Note: This effect is the same as Toutatis’s Cape, Assassin’s Gorget +2, Plunderer’s Poulaines +3, Hetairoi Ring, etc.
    --

    Group 1 Merit Changes:

    Flee Recast becomes "Steal" & "Despoil" Recast.
    • Description: Shorten recast time of "Steal" and "Despoil".
    • Effect/Tier: Recast -10 seconds per tier; a maximum of -50 seconds.
    • "Hide" Recast remains the same.
    • "Sneak Attack" Recast remains the same.
    • "Trick Attack" Recast remains the same.
    • "Triple Attack" Rate remains the same.

    --

    Group 2 Merit Changes:
    • "Assassin’s Charge" becomes literally anything else. This job ability is terrible and should be removed from the game entirely.
    • "Feint" remains the same.
    • "Aura Steal" is modified as described below:
    • Grants a chance to dispel an effect when you use "Steal". If an effect is dispelled, that effect is then absorbed by the Thief and the remaining duration of that effect is reset to the maximum duration. The effects of "Aura Steal" cannot be resisted. "Aura Steal" will still activate even when an item has been successfully stolen from the target. "Aura Steal" will no longer dispel and absorb any effects that are currently active on the Thief! This is to promote a higher probability to dispel and absorb more powerful or unique effects instead of dispelling and absorbing derp-level effects like "Protect" or "Shell" every time "Steal" is used.
    • Description: Adds a chance to dispel and then absorb an effect to "Steal".
    • Effect/Tier: +20% per tier; a maximum of +100%.
    • Example: 5/5 merits would give you a 100% chance to dispel and then absorb and effect when using "Steal" and if you had any augmented version of the Relic head equipment, you would dispel and absorb two effects instead of one.
    • Note: The augmented effect of "Aura Steal" from all versions of the Relic head equipment remain the same.
    • "Ambush" is modified as described below:
    • "Ambush" is a middling trait that sees almost no usage at all. An ambush should be a devastating attack erupting from an unseen vector of the battlefield and sets the attacker up to deliver a coup de grace. Hopefully this modification is more appropriate.
    • Description: Adds a TP Bonus effect to "Sneak Attack" and "Trick Attack".
    • Effect/Tier: TP Bonus +100 per tier; a maximum of +500.
    • Note: This TP Bonus is only active when in proper position to activate the effects of "Sneak Attack" and "Trick Attack". If the the selected target is under the effect of "Bully" or the Thief is under the effect of "Hide", the positional requirements won't need to be met for this Job Trait to activate on "Sneak Attack" and "Trick Attack".
    • Note: The augmented effect of "Ambush" from all version of the Relic body equipment is changed to Weapon Skill Damage +1% per tier; a maximum of Weapon Skill Damage +5%. "Sneak Attack" and "Trick Attack" do not need to be active for this effect to be active.
    (1)
    Last edited by radarbabyeater; 10-21-2020 at 08:22 PM.

  2. #102
    Player Atomic_Skull's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    1,248
    Character
    Bjorne
    World
    Fenrir
    Main Class
    MNK Lv 5
    Quote Originally Posted by radarbabyeater View Post

    "Sneak Attack" & "Trick Attack"
    • No changes.
    I would suggest changing SA to work like it did before it was changed early 2003 with a slight modification. It used to be that SA would work if you were outside the monster's cone of sight. That's a bit too good so instead the SA bonus would scale based on how far out of position you were.

    Also I would move the DEX and AGI bonuses from SA and TA into the weaponskill calculation rather than being calculated separately and then added together. Especially with Tauret and Evisceration using SA and TA are almost a waste of time now unless you want to TA on a tank. So instead of calculating SA as a critical melee attack with DEX adding to weapon DMG and then adding it to the WS calculation instead DEX would be added to the weapon DMG of the WS damage calculation directly.

    And no that would not be OP because DNC can already do this. They actually have a better SA than an actual THF. I have seen dancers popping off 60k+ Rudra's Storms over and over in Dynamis D. The reason they can is because their abilities are calculated within the WS damage calculation unlike THF where it's a separate term that gets added together with a forced critical WS.
    (0)

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