Feedback to SE regarding WOEpath empys / coin weapons.

[Stompa]

Question answered, thankyou.

[Fynlar]

jesus christ wall of text

Anyway, they won't. These coin weapons are far from being the only pieces of gear that have gotten shat on by Adoulin, for what it's worth.

It's taken this long just for them to *attempt* to make previously-relevant RMEs relevant again, not to mention that it's only at the behest of a HUGE outcry by the playerbase (they originally had no plans to do ANYTHING with RMEs and were perfectly content with letting them fall to Adoulinian obscurity) and we still aren't exactly certain yet that they'll compete and that they'll be relevant again.

What makes you think your never-really-relevant coin weapons will become suddenly relevant? From the very beginning they were designed to be inferior options.

As I said in the other thread, I would at least be thankful they are giving coin weapons SOME purpose by allowing you to use them to unlock the empy WS.

[Demon6324236]

In all honesty though they have made it clear in many posts that the idea of WoE weapons were specifically to give access to the WSs without giving you the real power of an Empyrean weapon. By allowing you to use a WoE weapon to fully unlock the WS, they see it as being a final step to the true realization of what those weapons were meant to be for.

I can understand to some extent why this is bad, but at the same time, I understand why its actually better this way. It allows the WS to scale anywhere, whatever, for every player. If a player only has access to level 106 gear, well, they can use the WS, and have a 106 weapon, if the person is using a 119 weapon, same deal. If they made a direct upgrade it would have some sort of requirement probably which would make it harder for some people, when the point of the weapons is to make the WS more accessible. If anything, I would say its even better this way for another reason too, rather than making them, say, 113, and all the power that comes with level 113, you can use it with anything, if they did a flat out upgrade you would outgrow it eventually and be weakening yourself or using a weaker weapon just for the sake of the WS, this way, that's avoided.

Really, I have said this all before, and I am sure you know my stance on it, but in reality I feel like your holding onto a basic weapon model which many others share as well as an item name, since those are the only 2 things lost by this update rather than the one you prefer. I think this path the simpler for everyone, but it is only my opinion.

[Demon6324236]

The post I was referring to was...

In regards to Walk of Echoes weapons, these were implemented with the concept of allowing players to use the specialized empyrean weapon skills, so instead of revamping them we felt it more appropriate to have them serve to unlock the weapons skills (planning to have restrictions based on jobs and level).

The main line of importance being is underlined because it points out, the weapons are there for the WSs. They are not special weapons in their own right, weapons of legend or special power, only weapons which give access to a special WS. As I explained before, they are not NQ Empyreans, neither the Devs nor the Moogle programed by them refer to the WoE/Coin weapons as Empyrean weapons, the origins of the Empyrean title itself are the Devs and the Moogle, which is why it makes no sense to call them NQ Empyreans, their makers do not recognize them as such even, its a delusion of grandeur. They were made to supply the WS, originally through a decently powerful weapon, one of which has become outdated, their idea is to allow it to live on via unlocking the WS itself, and in all honesty, it makes sense.

You made no Empyrean, yet you are getting the same reward that any Empyrean 90 wielder is getting, and if you look at the DMG amounts, Coin 99 weapons not far off from those, so really, its fair to me.

[Fynlar]

Why the hell can't they patch my Woepath99s so they are as powerful as Forefronts.

The same reason they haven't and won't bother to patch elemental path magian weapons.

[Jerbob]

WoE path weapons may have been intended as a quicker way to access the weaponskills, but the fact that they were quite decent weapons in their own right (to say nothing of the time required to make them) means that using those initial intentions as a basis for deciding whether to upgrade them or not is flawed. As Stompa says, they aren't comparable to the "... of Trials" type weapons; those were exclusively designed to grant access to weaponskills, whereas WoE weapons are clearly designed to be useful as a primary weapon.

[Anjou]

Should just be happy that we'll be unlocking the weaponskill, then building the dang things is considered relevant. Honestly though, I don't wanna be main handing a sword with a dat model of Coral Sword when I could be using a bajesus strong Buramenk'ah which has a unique model -while- I have access to the empyrean WS.

[FaeQueenCory]

I can understand to some extent why this is bad, but at the same time, I understand why its actually better this way. It allows the WS to scale anywhere, whatever, for every player. If a player only has access to level 106 gear, well, they can use the WS, and have a 106 weapon, if the person is using a 119 weapon, same deal. If they made a direct upgrade it would have some sort of requirement probably which would make it harder for some people, when the point of the weapons is to make the WS more accessible. If anything, I would say its even better this way for another reason too, rather than making them, say, 113, and all the power that comes with level 113, you can use it with anything, if they did a flat out upgrade you would outgrow it eventually and be weakening yourself or using a weaker weapon just for the sake of the WS, this way, that's avoided.

BIU part: Um... isn't that how it always was?
The coin weapons are cute... they give you access to the EmpyWSs... but there just isn't a comparison between them and a full Empyrean piece.
They always were a heck of a lot easier to make IMO: 50 seals? pshaw! I got >400 of them just from leveling a couple jobs from 75-99 in worm/bird pts. I don't even want to think how many ppl who go 30-99 have... >_>
And seeing as how all empys are like their Relic and Mythic counterparts... +30% full WS dmg.... that's crazy. (especially when you throw in gorgets and belts... dear Lord... that +30% is the only thing I worry about having them back with.)

So I agree too, the coin weapons were never even meant for a second to be stand ins for an Empy....
They were always just neat little toys... much like the latent: relic WS weapons... a cute little plaything... a cookie to tide you over until dinner...

Even if iLvfication was ever considered... I seriously doubt we'd see anything greater than iLv100.
115? 113? 106? ridiculous. They were never even that good before iLvs.
(that "that" is marginally ambiguous... it refers to the previously stated numerals; it is not a ubiquitous "that" that belittles them to worthlessness.)

EDIT:

Yeah but magians are way easier to build, and cost a lot less too.

Are you're serious?
Yeah... maybe the +dmg and +Macc magian staves are easier...
I have an ArkaIII.
Arka. III.
I think there might be 4 other smns who have done that.
Because... Dear Lord....
The summon paths are probably the worst trials ever.
They've become a lot easier (ie more mobs that can be 1shot) thanks to the convocaller and dashavatara sachets... but by no means are the smn path magian trials less than your WoE paths.
If anything... I find the coin weapons a heck of a lot easier to build... Because all you have to do is deal with NM pop times and farming/buying some items.

TBH, I wouldn't have a problem if they had gone across the board and made all 99 magian weapons iLv100.
But don't think for a second that the WoE coin weapons aren't anything more than magian trial weapons that just let you use the empy WS.

[predatory]

Just make R/M/Es super easy to get like WoEs and say they were just designed for the ws you get from them, and problem solved. Oh wait they tried that, it didn't fly. If it didn't fly with R/M/Es then why should it fly with WoEs? Or is it because your pet weapon should be more important than someone else's pet weapon?

[Damane]

Just make R/M/Es super easy to get like WoEs and say they were just designed for the ws you get from them, and problem solved. Oh wait they tried that, it didn't fly. If it didn't fly with R/M/Es then why should it fly with WoEs? Or is it because your pet weapon should be more important than someone else's pet weapon?

difference between RMEs and WoE weapons is that RMEs are legendary weapons. So I dont feel any bit sorry that WoE only unlock WS. Thats how it should be. Relic holders didnt bitch back then either when Empys curbstomped them into the ground when abyssea came around. Neither did they bitch when dynamis was changed the way it made Relics easy to get.

I am sorry I dont see a problem with your time wasted, stuff changes. My Relic needed also more time and gil 6-7 years ago then now. Stuff changes, deal with it.