Dem RMEs....

[Demon6324236]

As a point of note to demon458745034whatever etc. who follow me around from thread to thread trolling on me and flaming my NQ Empy, those are legit weapons and didn't require a slave team farming Aby Bosses for you to build it. Most Tyrant Linkshells used the members as slaves to build HQ empys for the leaders, the slaves got some +2s and that was it. I chose to solo my NQ Empy and devote my LS time instead to helping people, not forcing them to farm Bukhis for 100s of hours just for my weapon.

Ok, first off, stop acting like I am following you and giving you shit for your weapon, I am allowed to have an opinion and reply to a single person multiple times without it being following/trolling, especially when I am attempting to inform you of things you seem to be unaware of in the first place. I made a Fake Ukon, the Shamash, much the same as you did with your H2H, I know the work that need be put in them, I know the effort, I know the time, I did it myself.

Secondly, you apparently either have been in horrible linkshells, with horrible people, or have no idea what you are talking about. I was in a casual social linkshell with nothing more than a few friends of mine I have played with for the last 2 or so years, I made my Almace, not by making them my slaves and forcing them to do my bidding, but my going out and soloing what I needed to and asking for assistance when and if I needed it. I did not dualbox it, I did not brew it all, I worked hard to get it, and asked for help when I needed it.

I made both a real, and fake Empyrean weapon. Yes, Coin weapons are fake Empyrean weapons. Do you know why? Because simply put if you make an Empyrean weapon, the moogle makes a comment when you complete the first stage which actually calls it an Empyrean weapon, when you make a Coin weapon, he does not say anything special, he treats it like just another stage. I am near finished with my Masamune and my fake H2H, I will provide you screenshots when I am finished if you so wish, so you can see the difference. No matter if you wish to accept it or not, its not the same, they are in a different class.

I was also on a Aby LS in 2010, and as WHM I spent my whole days alliance-burning bosses for the LS leaders empys. So I have in effect built around 10 full HQ Empys, they just werent for me coz I'm not a Tyrant LS leader. Obviously it is easier to build a HQ empy now using SOA gear, and you can low man or solo a lot of it now. But when I built my NQ empy, those were the options, have a slave team grinding bosses and /pass all the drops so only you would get stuff for your HQ empy, or go WOE and solo the open battlefield for your NQ Empy. I spent 16 months in WOE and worked hard on my NQ, which is a very good weapon, it just doesnt have aftermath. But I can sleep soundly at night knowing I didn't force my LS to be slaves with all their game time just so I could have a HQ. And I can manage fine without aftermath.

As I said, horrible people, horrible LS. I did my Almace at level 90 cap, the majority of my time was spent on WAR with my GF on THF helping me, using Regen Atma to live through procing so we could kill the gigas and move on to the next. Was it hard? Yes, it wasn't a cake walk. Did I force my GF to do it? No, many times she did not come with me even because she was not able to get on due to work, but I made due with what I had and got it done. You will get no pity from me in the fact you did it, I did one too, it took me about 2 months of doing WoE to make mine, rather than 16, so I can understand your valuing it more, but it doesn't change facts.

And if you read the quote in my last post, they are "BUILDING ON" all those weapons including NQ Empys, and thinking about freeing the WS from all those 4 weapon groups, not just NQ empys.

Yes, that came from this thread, I know, yet this post, the most recent on the subject to my knowledge, says this...

Future Plans for Equipment
•Relic, mythic, and empyrean weapon revamps
•Unlocking empyrean weapons skills

Now I know were going to go back to this whole thing about how Coin weapons are Empyrean weapons, but again, the Moogle does not recognize them as such, and since they did not include Coin weapons in those weapon revamps, I am inclined to believe they are to be excluded from such an adjustment. If I am wrong, then cool, I'm wrong, I can continue to use my Shamash, if I am correct however, I will happily use Ukko's Fury on my Ixtab I earned from Yumcax and be on my way.

[Demon6324236]

Heads up again. Bri and Sobek are the two easiest bosses in Aby. I built an Almace for my LS friend earlier this year, we duoed it easy upto the end of Sobek stage.

Cool, I know they are, doesn't mean I didn't do it. You made the H2H, Chloris might be annoying to get pops for, but the fight itself is easier than Bria or Sobek, at least Bria has the annoying zombie attack and Sobek can 1hit you with Tyrant Tusk, Chloris has Doom, nothing more, unless you count Hundred Misses. The Sandworm was a pain, probably couldn't solo that one, but at the same time, ask friends to help once you have pops, not make them your slaves, not demand they help, ask, and offer +2s, not hard.

The HQ Empys I was talking about building were the Azdaja Bukhis etc. high stages with stronger mobs and larger # of items needed, and back in 2010-2012. Also some of the lower stages such as stage 1 HQ empy staff the kon[a] ZB is not an easy mob to farm, not as easy as Bri anyway. Everyone knows Almace is the easiest path to build, but you keep bringing it up as an example of how building HQ empys is so easy. Back in 2010 we farmed Bukhis and Azdaja in alliance Aby LS, it was traumatising back then lol. And of course all drops went to the four LS founders. You will find that such Tyrant LS were VERY common in the early Aby years 2010-2012, when ppl could be exploited coz they wanted to get +2s. However they soon discover that its easier to /sh run +2s than to grind Buhkis 100x for the LS slavelord, and u finished your +2 item after three kills and were then forced to log in on WHM for the next three weeks for more Bukhis and /pass everything. That kind of shit is why people like me went to WOE and built our NQ empys.

Azdaja was easy, and is still easy, by anyone who knows how to shadow tank and tanks him from behind. Bukhis is annoying, that one I give you, but it still had nothing at all to do with the H2H path, same as Azdaja. If you were making the Empyrean Staff, it was for the WS, nothing else, in which case the Coin weapon worked just as well, unlike others where there was an actually useful benefit to getting the real thing. Everything after that is simply you talking about, again, a horrible LS. I have said it before and I will say it again, if a LS wants me to continuously go to events on a job I don't want to, or to events I don't want to, for me to never get anything besides scraps at best, I leave that LS, because its not worth my time to be in a place where I am treated like a dual box mule. If you chose to stay there and put up with it, you made that choice, a rather bad one in my opinion, but you made it all the same.

Regarding upgrades, the item I quoted you earlier, says "we are planning to build on REMC" and to free the ws from REMC. It does NOT SAY what you and the other person above said, about "coin" weapons (btw I'm going to start calling your HQ empys "Riftcinder weapons" instead of HQ empys, since riftcinder (like coins) is one of the final items required!) and that coin weapons are only getting ws freed from them, it says all those 4 groups are being 'built on' and the ws will be/may be freed from the whole group.

Your post you quoted was from 5/1, in other words, the beginning of May, the one I quoted, was from last month, August 21st. Now, since my post is more recent, it is more likely to be accurate than the post of which you quoted which was made 3 and a half months prior. My quote only mentions RMEs, not Coin weapons, a distinction made by SE both when they made the trials, due to the Mooge's conversation with you, and SE when they made the thread you pointed out, where they specifically called them different things. What this means is, that in SE eyes, the only ones that matter on this subject, Coin weapons are not Empyrean weapons, and vice versa, which means since they were not mentioned in the quote I made, they are probably not being revamped.

Doesnt matter to me what anyone else calls those weapons. Both NQ and HQ follow the empyrean NM path through all 9 nm stages, and they both contain the empyrean weaponskill. To me it seems pretty obvious that makes them low-quality and high-quality Empys respectively. But we can start calling them coin weaps and riftcinder weaps instead if that makes you happy.

I started calling them Coin weapons when the representatives of the company as well as the producer of the game started calling them Coin weapons. Its not a term I heard used any time before that, till that time, I called them fake Emps. If you want to call Empyrean weapons riftcinder weaps, then by all means, do, but no one ever has before, there is no reason to do so, and its a different set of circumstances. To you, it seems obvious that by going half way on a weapon then taking the easier path makes them near equal, where 1 is high quality and 1 is normal quality, however SE seems to think of them as 2 separate categories of weapons, not the same one as you do.

Fact ; Gear Snobs killed this game more than anything SE or the external game market ever did. The fact you call them fake empys is just a good example of gear snobbery. They are normal-quality/low-quality Empys, for people who don't have billions of gil, a team of slaves, and thousands of hours to spare.

As I said, I own a Shamash, no different than your H2H in any way, a fake Emp, Coin Weapon, whatever term you choose to use, they are the same in terms of what they are for the different categories. How is it being a snob to call a weapon which is clearly inferior, and made to be so, a fake? Its not the real Empyrean weapon, it has the WS of an Empyrean weapon, but it is not recongnised as one, it is a copy, a ripoff, a fake, it mimics the most important part of the weapon while being nothing more than generic in the rest of its design. An Empyrean weapon has a unique model/look, like almost every RME does, it has a few unique stats, as all RMEs do, and it has an Aftermath, as all RMEs do, but Coin weapons lack all of these, every one of them is a copy of another weapon's design, they have no special stats or traits, and no Aftermath, they have only the weapon skill.

You can tell me I am a snob or whatever you choose, it changes nothing, the simple fact of the matter which you refuse to accept is that Coin weapons are not Empyrean weapons, SE has put them apart, drawn a line between them, they are separate and different from one another.

My issue in this and other threads is simply that SoA made 'conquest points' weapons like the forefront that are stronger than the nq empys, and that is completey ridiculous. That was even on the forefront launch, but then SE patched forefronts to add DMG/skill+ to them, and my point is solely ; patch nq empys the same way, so I can toss my forefront h2h.

What I keep trying to tell you is that your going to end up unlocking Victory Smite, the only reason for having your Coin weapon in the first place, and then no longer need them. Then, you can move on and use other weapons.

Which seems more likely, and overall better? That SE goes out and makes your Coin weapon with no special stats besides the WS a little better with some skill, an ilevel, and a DMG boost, just so 2 months from now it can be worthless again and you will complain some more, or for them to simply unlock your WS, you drop your Coin weapon, and then go out and use Forefront till you have something better like Rigors or Oats, at which point, you can still use your WS?

Now before you go saying that people with RMEs should see it the same way, remember, your weapon has no special stats besides that WS, RMEs have a number of them, particularly Mythics, so its not the same story for them still.



I have given you quotes, examples, and facts, you have given me walls of text which tell me about your experience with horrible linkshells and the fact you lack the want to make a RME weapon because of them, but feel your Coin weapon should be upgraded all the same, while seemingly ignoring everything I said to you in favor of your own opinion.

[Demon6324236]

No I wouldn't complain again. As I said before I used Dumuzis for years and was very happy with it. I didn't cry myself to sleep over the lack of aftermath. I will keep using that weapon because I like it. I am just pointing out the logic-fail of making SOA conquest-points weapons that outdamage a nq empy.

Ok, lets say for instance they added 100 skill to Coin weapons. What happens when, like now, there are a pair of H2H that you can buy with Bayld which have 200 skill and 20 more DMG than your Dumuzis? Will you simply say nothing? If so, whats different between that and now? Nothing, there is still a large skill/attack/accuracy gap, you will complain again they changed it, you got a slightly better version of a weapon which could have been throw away had you simply learned the WS, and everything would have been able to continue easier once you bought the new Bayld weapons. If you wouldn't complain, you shouldn't be complaining now, because its basically the same circumstances.

Your rant about coin weapons not being worthy enough to patch with DMG+/skill+ attack bonuses, completely ignores the fact that SE patched the forefront lolconquestpoints weapons in exactly this way, despite them not being HQ RME's, forefronts got damage spiked overnight, so why you would seriously expect SE to not patch coin weapons in the same DMG/skill way, is not logical. We agree that HQ RME's are more powerful and important weaps than NQ empys, but you seriously can't tell me that forefront weaps are more important than nq empys, and yet those forefronts got patched overnight.

I think they upgraded all of the Adoulin gear in general because they made the content with that idea in mind, they simply had not finished everything they wanted to do technically with it such as ilevels and expanding the amount of stats on the gear that were possible to attach at the time. Now, they have, so they made the change. I do not think it was an update they meant to do separately, but rather, they wanted to do it at the same time & couldn't due to the SoA deadline, so they cut corners. Now, why do I expect SE not to patch Coin weapons when they did for the Forefront weapons? Simple, they were standardized weapons with nothing more than a special weapon skill on them to begin with. I think they see it probably in a similar way to how I do, if you have a Coin weapon and increase its DMG & give it some skill so its stats are the same as Forefront weapons, its not any different than if you simply slapped the WS on the Forefront weapon and called it a day. By allowing us to learn the WS, they are essentially doing just that, allowing us to use it with the Forefront weapons, rather than taking the time to come up with a method of upgrading Coin weapons to a Forefront level in stats.

Also I know the NMs I listed were not all for h2h, I also farmed nq empy 99s in staff club and dagger. I built those after the WOE 'bag' patch when it became far easier to obtain. So I have 4x nq empy 99, and I also have 27 Magian 99s in elemental paths and ws paths, all at 99. And all in storage now, coz SE decided to make SoA conquest-points weapons more powerful.

My point was that you were saying you didn't go out and make an Empyrean weapon, at the same time as telling me that mine was the easiest path, so I felt it only right to point out that your weapon of which you have been talking about, H2H, is not all to hard either, in my opinion its arguably the 3rd easiest, near the middle, harder than Bria/Sobek & Cara/C-C. Just because my weapon was the easiest does not mean that its the only one that does not require the enslavement of a linkshell worth of people to obtain however, which was what I was trying to say, you can make an Empyrean weapon without having an army of people working under you, which is what you made it sound like it took to make one.