Relic Adjustments - The balancing act

[Insaniac]

This thread has gone off the deep end!!!

Apoc should never and will never break the haste cap again. 90% haste vs. 80% haste results in you doing twice as much damage.

Also yes it's gear haste. LOL at telling someone their argument is invalid because they made a mistake when you are the one who made the mistake. Also, please gtfo with the "most people cheated to get their relic" argument.

People who don't think relics and mythics should be at least as good as emps melt my brain. There is no justification for something that takes as much effort as a relic/mythic to ever be outclassed by something that takes monumentally less work. Saying they are trophies is absolute nonsense.

[Kitkat]

Just remove the off-hand limitation plz it's not fair at this moment which emp doesn't have that limitation; I still get the agi+ from Kannagi when used off-hand.

I concur with this, or at least make it so the visible stats work in offhand.

[DebbieGibson]

Saying they are trophies is absolute nonsense.

Nah, their strength should not be commensurate with the effort required to obtain. Slightly better sure, but the main reason to get outside of horn/shield is as a trophy item. Who is gonna waste 200m for 1% increase in dmg if they are really trying to improve their character? Would better to spend that on another job that has crapper equip, or to gear up an alt mule.

[Byrth]

For the record, my suggestion (and Kirschy's) was to just make Apoc a different kind of Haste outside the categories of JA/Magic/Gear Haste, but still leave it subject to the 80% cap. This would allow Apoc DRK to be a more versatile low-buff job, instead of using aftermath to give a mostly trivial advantage to your TP set.

[AldielQuetz]

And another note....

WE WANT IMPROVEMENT NOT ANOTHER HOOP TO JUMP THROUGH. KTHX.

Translation, fix the relics, fix the mythics, THEN add another trial.

Make the balance we all desire please, thank you.

[DebbieGibson]

The level 75 80 85 90 and 95 versions are going to be useless anyway so I don't see what the rush is about.

[Gouka]

Just to crystallize the arguments of the naysayers...

Nah, their strength should not be commensurate with the effort required to obtain.

"The quality of a reward shouldn't reflect the amount of work it takes to get it!" or,
"There should be no additional motivation for doing extra work!"

Sound about right?

If you start an Empyrean weapon, ANY Empyrean weapon, you can have it done in a matter of weeks if you have trouble with drops and with getting people to come help. Working hard on a Relic from the beginning is on the order of months and starting a Mythic from the ground is well over a year. But yeah, you guys are right, they should all be basically the same.

[Sama]

The level 75 80 85 90 and 95 versions are going to be useless anyway so I don't see what the rush is about.

That's exactly what I'm thinking... the ws dmg bonus on lv90 relic is as lame as you can think of. So just remove the off-hand limitation and we'll be happy, at least for a short while.

[DebbieGibson]

Just to crystallize the arguments of the naysayers...



"The quality of a reward shouldn't reflect the amount of work it takes to get it!" or,
"There should be no additional motivation for doing extra work!"

Sound about right?

If you start an Empyrean weapon, ANY Empyrean weapon, you can have it done in a matter of weeks if you have trouble with drops and with getting people to come help. Working hard on a Relic from the beginning is on the order of months and starting a Mythic from the ground is well over a year. But yeah, you guys are right, they should all be basically the same.

Do you understand that if the effort to acquire was commensurate with the benefits given that the weapons would be too overpowered? If empyrean takes a week and relic takes a month, that means bravura should have 400 base damage, and conqueror should have 800 base damage?

They should be better than empyrean, I agree, but just barely. It would be stupid if their power was commensurate with the time required to obtain.

[AldielQuetz]

A. Watch your mouth Debbie, that's your only warning.

B. The point is, shouldn't they at least be equal in strength of WS and aftermath? Yes they should. Nobody wants to degrade Empyreans by upgrading Relics and Mythics, we just want the time it takes to make one to be a talking point/leverage to push for equalizing the top percentile of weapons.

C. I like you Debbie, explitives are not necessary to make a point, we can all hear you fine.