Reasons Why FFXI is Declining

[ScreamingInDigital]

Why not just make the game free to play and implement various micro transactions like several other dinosaur games that were failing? There are 700 people online on my server which is the second most populated server in ffxi. 40-50% of these are afk in various places with their bazaars up.
I want what most other paying customers want, for this game to flourish and in the direction the game is currently going this game is taking a turn for the worse. In order for ffxi to flourish we need more players. The various word of mouth recruitment campaigns have done very little to populate in-game worlds and those that come back to see if ffxi has gotten any better were severely disappointed and cancelled their subscriptions a month later. The game just isn't able to compete anymore with paid subscription games like World of Warcraft(incoming flame war) so why not implement a new structure that has been tried successfully by many other online RPGs?
Everquest, Lineage 2, SWTOR, LOTRO, and many others have gone from a non-viable business model to a game that actually makes money by implementing micro transactions and doing away with the monthly fee.
Also make Abyssea 75-99 and make it and a few select jobs subscription only, that should bring in some revenue and more importantly some customers.

EQ, SWTOR and LoTRO still offer a subscription option. As long as they maintained a sub option (in the event of such a switch happening, which I doubt at this point... but who knows, SE has been known to go from one extreme stance to another before), I think it'd be okay.

They need to stay the hell away from NCSoft's "Truly Free (to nickel and dime you to death)" setup. It's an abomination. I used to be a huge Lineage 2 player, for several years, and loved the hell out of that game. Then they did the whole "Goddess" expansion, switched to a fully F2P/Cash Shop model. They lied through their teeth in their lead-up PR, claiming that only non-game/stat effecting items would be sold (claiming they understood how such items in a PvP setting like L2 could be disastrous). They then proceeded to start selling such items almost from day one, changing their logic from "won't happen" to "well, they're optional!" They said this full knowing that in a competitive game like that, people will spend money - lots of it - to get an advantage over their rivals. People had been buying Adena, for just that reason, for years already in that game, so they didn't even have to 'test the waters' to find out.

They knew exactly what they were doing when setting up the F2P model for that game, and "Heavy Handed" doesn't even begin to describe it. Worst P2P to F2P transition I've ever seen. It went from being a game I played and loved for years, to "get the hell off my computer" in less than a week.

They did the same thing with Aion.

I don't believe, at all, though, that FFXI needs to go F2P. What FFXI needs is some serious thought and reconsideration of the direction they've chosen to take it. Trying to go with the vertical progression approach is just not going to fly. It's been proven time and again that developers can not crank out new content fast enough to stay ahead of players. Developers repeatedly underestimate their players and think they can somehow "stay ahead". It never works. SE's model of long-term progression with a "lateral" approach, rather than "vertical", served FFXI wonderfully for years. Yes, people complained about it... but they kept playing and the game maintained a healthy population for over 7 years before any kind of a noticeable decline began, which I would contend had more to do with the game's age at that point than anything else. Even then, XI's population decline was far slower than most any other comparable MMO out there (sub-based, etc).

SE could have stayed the course, continued creating content the way they did, and I believe the game would have remained healthier and the population wouldn't have dropped as it did. Instead, they decided to hop on the "mainstream MMO" bandwagon and start changing the game to be more like others (which they'd successfully avoided doing all those years prior). As I said in my last post, they decided to mix oil into water, and the results have been self-evident.

The population is at perhaps its lowest ever, and I don't think I've ever seen so many people as disappointed and upset about the direction of the game in all my time playing it.

They can't go back to Abyssea. They already raised the cap to 99 and, other than the "faux levels" granted through gear, there's only so far they can go in that direction.

I think they need to go back to their roots, look at what they did in those past expansions that kept people engaged and loyally playing for years. One thing I can guarantee they'll find is that their focus was far more on community, on lateral progression and on giving players challenges that weren't outright grinds, but that still took time to accomplish because they were difficult to do. Make old content relevant again for its own sake.

For their part, the playerbase has to get off this gear obsession they've been on. Every other complaint I see sometimes is something to do with getting new gear. This is the product of SE trying to turn the game into a vertical-progression setup. As Stompa said perfectly earlier in the thread, the fun of playing FFXI used to be playing FFXI. SE needs to look back to their own past, see what they did right, find a way to bring it to the present, and get themselves back on the right track. They're just getting deeper and deeper into the weeds with the decisions they've been making over the last few years.

FFXI was originally envisioned as a grand adventure, not a race to "end game". They need to return to that vision.

My 2 gil, and of course, my opinion.

[predatory]

EQ, SWTOR and LoTRO still offer a subscription option. As long as they maintained a sub option (in the event of such a switch happening, which I doubt at this point... but who knows, SE has been known to go from one extreme stance to another before), I think it'd be okay.

They need to stay the hell away from NCSoft's "Truly Free (to nickel and dime you to death)" setup. It's an abomination. I used to be a huge Lineage 2 player, for several years, and loved the hell out of that game. Then they did the whole "Goddess" expansion, switched to a fully F2P/Cash Shop model. They lied through their teeth in their lead-up PR, claiming that only non-game/stat effecting items would be sold (claiming they understood how such items in a PvP setting like L2 could be disastrous). They then proceeded to start selling such items almost from day one, changing their logic from "won't happen" to "well, they're optional!" They said this full knowing that in a competitive game like that, people will spend money - lots of it - to get an advantage over their rivals. People had been buying Adena, for just that reason, for years already in that game, so they didn't even have to 'test the waters' to find out.

They knew exactly what they were doing when setting up the F2P model for that game, and "Heavy Handed" doesn't even begin to describe it. Worst P2P to F2P transition I've ever seen. It went from being a game I played and loved for years, to "get the hell off my computer" in less than a week.

They did the same thing with Aion.

I don't believe, at all, though, that FFXI needs to go F2P. What FFXI needs is some serious thought and reconsideration of the direction they've chosen to take it. Trying to go with the vertical progression approach is just not going to fly. It's been proven time and again that developers can not crank out new content fast enough to stay ahead of players. Developers repeatedly underestimate their players and think they can somehow "stay ahead". It never works. SE's model of long-term progression with a "lateral" approach, rather than "vertical", served FFXI wonderfully for years. Yes, people complained about it... but they kept playing and the game maintained a healthy population for over 7 years before any kind of a noticeable decline began, which I would contend had more to do with the game's age at that point than anything else. Even then, XI's population decline was far slower than most any other comparable MMO out there (sub-based, etc).

SE could have stayed the course, continued creating content the way they did, and I believe the game would have remained healthier and the population wouldn't have dropped as it did. Instead, they decided to hop on the "mainstream MMO" bandwagon and start changing the game to be more like others (which they'd successfully avoided doing all those years prior). As I said in my last post, they decided to mix oil into water, and the results have been self-evident.

The population is at perhaps its lowest ever, and I don't think I've ever seen so many people as disappointed and upset about the direction of the game in all my time playing it.

They can't go back to Abyssea. They already raised the cap to 99 and, other than the "faux levels" granted through gear, there's only so far they can go in that direction.

I think they need to go back to their roots, look at what they did in those past expansions that kept people engaged and loyally playing for years. One thing I can guarantee they'll find is that their focus was far more on community, on lateral progression and on giving players challenges that weren't outright grinds, but that still took time to accomplish because they were difficult to do. Make old content relevant again for its own sake.

For their part, the playerbase has to get off this gear obsession they've been on. Every other complaint I see sometimes is something to do with getting new gear. This is the product of SE trying to turn the game into a vertical-progression setup. As Stompa said perfectly earlier in the thread, the fun of playing FFXI used to be playing FFXI. SE needs to look back to their own past, see what they did right, find a way to bring it to the present, and get themselves back on the right track. They're just getting deeper and deeper into the weeds with the decisions they've been making over the last few years.

FFXI was originally envisioned as a grand adventure, not a race to "end game". They need to return to that vision.

My 2 gil, and of course, my opinion.

And the problem with that was, they actually created nothing that I would call endgame, IMO Delve and skirmish aren't endgame. Endgame (except for hnms), always had a progression associated with it. You couldn't do dynamis until you'd attained rank 6, you couldn't do sky until you had sky access, same with jailers and limbus with sea access. There has always been a progression to be able to do endgame activities, along comes SoA and anybody can go in and do a skirmish or join a Delve group, one person completing one WKR so 17 other people can join them in a shout group is definitely not endgame.

I had really high hopes for this expansion, I mean they billed it as the first full expansion in 5 years, but what did we really get? We got Reives, WKR, Delve and Skirmish, that's the best they could come up with in their bid to keep us? Pitiful if you ask me. This is definitely not the grand adventure I was hoping for, and I feel more than a little let down at wasting the money I spent to get the expansion.

[Damane]

And the problem with that was, they actually created nothing that I would call endgame, IMO Delve and skirmish aren't endgame. Endgame (except for hnms), always had a progression associated with it. You couldn't do dynamis until you'd attained rank 6, you couldn't do sky until you had sky access, same with jailers and limbus with sea access. There has always been a progression to be able to do endgame activities, along comes SoA and anybody can go in and do a skirmish or join a Delve group, one person completing one WKR so 17 other people can join them in a shout group is definitely not endgame.

I had really high hopes for this expansion, I mean they billed it as the first full expansion in 5 years, but what did we really get? We got Reives, WKR, Delve and Skirmish, that's the best they could come up with in their bid to keep us? Pitiful if you ask me. This is definitely not the grand adventure I was hoping for, and I feel more than a little let down at wasting the money I spent to get the expansion.

delve is definitly endgame, haveing prequesites for sky sea etc was just retarded. ANYTHING you do at max lvl to further your gear is endgame. atm its delve and skirmish mostly because old content got irrelevant, in the november update it might be anything again with hardmode and REM updates.

[predatory]

delve is definitly endgame, haveing prequesites for sky sea etc was just retarded. ANYTHING you do at max lvl to further your gear is endgame. atm its delve and skirmish mostly because old content got irrelevant, in the november update it might be anything again with hardmode and REM updates.

This just doesn't have the endgame feel to me. I mean back when there was actual endgame content any number of people could attend, (well not any number dynamis was capped at 64 I think) but at most other events you could bring as many people as you felt you wanted to bring. Now you get to bring 18 tops which equals 1 ochain pld, 2 sch, 1 drg, 2 brds, 2 cors, and the rest mnks or wars, and forget the other 16 jobs out there, that's not endgame, that's just a special event for 6 jobs.

[Krashport]

Well the item mall is here already... Yeah its a lowball mall, but still it's a mall. $12.95/mo, then keep login'in to participate. Though they do like to call it;
The Repeat Login Campaign!
http://www.playonline.com/ff11us/cam...h/login04.html

f2p might not be that far fetched, seeing not many have realized that an item mall is here already...

[predatory]

when a game goes f2p it is dead, any moron knows that, The idea isn't to kill the game, its t get the game designers off their lazy fucking asses and get to work. They seem to think that they can ignore what the population of the game wants, and for there to be no repercussions, how about this for a repercussion, I buy 1 share of stock in the company then go to a stockholders meeting and tell them exactly why ffxi is falling flat on its face. The reason this game is failing is the dev team is weak and lazy. in Japanese terms they have no honor and should be replaced, especially the head developer. Get your shit together SE because you have lost the driving force in the game world, and that is simply imagination and ingenuity, us in the player base can only carry your lazy asses so far

[Demon6324236]

Does age affect the game? Of course, I wont say that the game is unaffected by its age. But that does not mean that all our issues now are caused by it primarily. There have been a lot of new games in the past including FFXIV, and while I know that being what it is, FFXIV is taking some people, I don't think that it alone is causing what we have seen recently. For this to happen so fast, I think it was a combo of the two, but primarily SoA did the damage, FFXIV was just assisting it, because while I know some people who would never quit, they looked at what this is becoming, and saw FFXIV as another FF game which may fill the void, as such, they left.

[RabidInfant]

Hello everyone, first post on these forums by me.

I think the reason(s) why FFXI is declining is purely different for each person.

I can only speak for myself but I have played this game since UK x360 beta release and I still play on the x360 now, in all of that time FFXI has been a drug running through my veins, there have been many many days where switching the x360 on and logging in has been the first thing I have done in the morning and logging off has often been the last thing I have at night, not unlike many of you I suspect.

In all of that time of me playing FFXI I have been a constant player, always subscribed, never inactive and always thrilled to be playing the game and never wanting it to end. But for every light there must be a dark, and here is mine, albeit very selfish and to some maybe even petty...

I finally after many months of work obtained my twashtar 85 around March 2012, I had solo'd and duo'd all of the paths to that point, had many hours of work, many hours of tediousness, many frustrations along the way, I was doing it all on DNC and SMN and had help off a BLU, the amount of mobs we killed with no KI still haunts me, but we carried on when we could, for months.

I wanted the twashtar for my DNC, so on I plugged until I got there, the first time I equipped my level 80 twash I stood in my moghouse looking at myself not wanting to venture into Jueno where others would see I didn't yet have rudra's storm, then finally after soloing all the KI mobs and then Itza some 35ish times I eventually got my 85 twash, and I think for 1 week I just stood in Jueno, proud and content, and at level 85 it sat, quit happily until February 2013 when I got it to level 90... 'that's it' I thought, I was content, I had a dagger that I felt warranted all the effort, I felt good, using the dagger felt good and I actually felt like it was all worth the massive effort I had put into obtaining it.

I looked forward (naively) to SoA release so I could run around and poke mobs with my shiny level 90 twash, I thought to myself I should be able to get into some partys with this dagger, its not the best it can be but it was still very usable (pre SoA)...

So SoA comes, I was not expecting new weapons to absolutely and completely blitz my hard work in the blink of an eye, suddenly my heart sank, I do actually remember the feeling of almost betrayal, like I was laughed at by SE, and everything I had tried to achieve previously was now seemingly all for nothing... I cant tell you how so very very near I was to quiting right there, the game I love so much, I was very very close (and depending on the November update I kind of still am).

Now it is not just all about my hard work on the twashtar, I had slowly been putting together gear for MNK, WAR and a few other jobs, and all of that seemed to get blitzed too, all what felt like over night... I was semi-useful at one point, then I was obsolete, in the blink of an eye...

Part of me will never forgive SE for this, I don't see them the same now, I would not put that much effort into one item again, I know it's only a game but it's a game that does demand many hours of effort for reward, or at least it used to... pre SoA.

So I have a level 90 twashtar, and I still don't know if it's going to be worthless in the November update or not, if it is only level 99 EMR's that get 'updated' then what's the point, 90% (guessing sorry) of all EMR owners do not have them to level99 and probably wont either due to either a lack of funds, or availability of HMP's, there just is not enough on the server to sustain how many people would like to upgrade, even if it was just 20 people looking to go from 90-95 it would still need 30,000 HMP to be in circulation, which is completely insane really, then there's the riftdross...

So for me at least that is why FFXI declined, that's my story... yours may be different but that's how I feel and I still don't know where I will be in 3 weeks time after the next update... I am finding it a little hard to commit fully and whilst it is difficult to put into words how it really feels, I have tried.

Thankyou for reading.

Rabid.

[saevel]

The only reason you see FFXI subscriptions declining is the player base has gotten older and now has children, careers and lives. Much of the older FFXI content was based on gigantic time sinks that forced you to commit large amounts of time to get anything accomplished due to group focused play. As the game got older the player-base split into two halves, the people who have actual lives outside the game and can only afford to play a few hours per week (per week not per day), and the people who still devote a few hours per day (averaged) to the game. This split has only gotten wider and people naturally leave over time, with no advertising or other ways to attract new players the game's total population has slowly dwindled.

The only reason you see people quitting during expansion releases is that they had already wanted to quit and were simply holding out hoping ~something~ changed. Of course there was no magical land on the other side of the new expansion rainbow and they get depressed, quit and complain about it.

[Afania]

The only reason you see FFXI subscriptions declining is the player base has gotten older and now has children, careers and lives. Much of the older FFXI content was based on gigantic time sinks that forced you to commit large amounts of time to get anything accomplished due to group focused play. As the game got older the player-base split into two halves, the people who have actual lives outside the game and can only afford to play a few hours per week (per week not per day), and the people who still devote a few hours per day (averaged) to the game. This split has only gotten wider and people naturally leave over time, with no advertising or other ways to attract new players the game's total population has slowly dwindled.

The only reason you see people quitting during expansion releases is that they had already wanted to quit and were simply holding out hoping ~something~ changed. Of course there was no magical land on the other side of the new expansion rainbow and they get depressed, quit and complain about it.

No. You're just using YOUR(or your friend's) experience , and assuming everyone who quit for the same reason.

I've been playing FFXI since 2009, in my past 4 years, there are always ppl quit for personal reasons, new job, new wife/gf, new family, new kids, w/e. There are ppl quit in 2009 due to personal reasons, 2010 too, 2011, 2012, 2013.....there are ppl quitting for personal reasons every year since launch.

I've met high school student/college student every year too, including year 2013. It's not like in 2013 suddenly everyone's 30~40s.

I've been paying attention to amount of ppl online since SoA launch during JP prime time(10pm JPT), in March/April there were easily 2.6k~3k players, in July there are were around 2.4k, when 14 launched there were 1.7k and 1 month after launch only 1.4k left.

2.4k------>1.4k in 2 months. 40% player depopped in 2 months.

Do you honestly think 40% of players suddenly got a new job/family/kids in 2 months, out of nowhere?

You argued that ppl quit during expansion release because they were "holding out hoping something changed", if that's the case, we'd see 1.4k player in March/April, because that's when they should quit if they're really waiting for a change in SoA.

But we didn't, so it's safe to say the reason why ppl quit is irrelevant to having new family/job and waiting for a change.

Why players quit, the answer is very, very simple. It's the same reason why every other MMO on the market is declining.

There are not enough content, especially after SoA.

MMORPG is about having stuff to do to keep players around, if you run out of stuff to do, you cancel account. No one can deny this golden rule.


SoA content made all 4 previous expansion completely pointless to do, all you left is delve delve and delve.

Assuming you're a casual player, your pt is just avg pt which takes 40 min~45 min to kill tojil, and you never win lot on Oat so you have to farm plasm for it.

It takes less than 3hr to to get the best weapon in game.

THREE HOURS, in an MMORPG.

Let's assume you're super casual, you can only play 1 hour a week. It's going to take you 3 weeks to get an Oat. Last time I checked, SE doesn't release new content every 3 weeks.

What do you do after you get the best weapon in game? You go to SE account management and cancel sub, lol. It's not like there's anything else worth obtaining anymore since every other content outdated.

Populations are declining, because most hardcore players got Oat in June and quit, then semi-hardcore players got Oat in July and quit, then avg player got Oat in Aug and quit, then semi casual players got Oat in Sept and quit......players are clearing the content and getting best gears, hardcore or casual. And SE simply can't release content to keep up.

If they're making players getting best weapon in 3 hours, they need to release new content every 3 weeks at least. If they release delve 2 in august, delve 3 in sept, delve 4 in Oct maybe we'll still have 1.8k players instead of 1.4k players.


Now they hand out items too fast, and unable to release content just as fast, on the same time outdating 11 years worth of old content.......that's why everyone quit.

I know everyone loves getting gears super fast and easy....but I'm sorry, giving away best gears in 3 hour isn't going to keep a MMORPG alive, it's going to kill it. There's a reason why MMORPG is timesink, because it's the most effective way to keep players around. If you can't keep players around you get empy servers nobody stays.