Elemental Magic Adjustments Continued

[Camate]

Greetings!

I have a couple of follow-ups to your questions regarding the elemental magic adjustments.

Where is Meteor?

We have no plans at the moment to make adjustments to Meteor. This spell does not belong to any element and its damage is affected through magic attack bonus and the number of people casting the spell.

Are these gonna be applied to the elemental spirits for summoner?

Due to the fact that these adjustments will only be applied to player characters and not to monsters, the elemental magic adjustments will not be applied to spirits because the magic they use is treated as a monster type of magic.

On the other hand, the magic used by automatons and adventuring fellows are classified as player type magic, and as such these adjustments will be applied to them as well.

[Jerbob]

...the elemental magic adjustments will not be applied to spirits...

Well goodness me, this is quite unexpected.

Oh, wait...

[Daemon]

This post is in regard to the new elemental magic adjustment.

Sorry Guys I did post this on the test server feedback area thinking that it was the correct place to share my opinion, so Please forgive me for the repost here, As it seems the devs are responding through this post only.

Please I do hope people can analyze what ive written. And thanks!

I will only write about Tier 4 spells then you can get a better understanding of the rest after you see my point.

Tier IV
MP Cost
Before After

164 190 ICE
171 219 THUNDER


Tier 4 spells will cost more mp... 190 MP for Ice, 219 for Thunder, that would mean at level 99 you would barely cast 5 spells before running out of mp... (I didn't add MP gear because most likely mages will be switching gears during each cast) so let's say the average mage has about 1k MP to dedicate toward nukes)

Maybe this won't matter for people playing in Abby but this clearly will be an issue in areas where no temp items/ atmas are available.

If you only cast Ice IV alone the increase is 26 more mp per cast than now meaning if you casted this 1 spell 5 times, it will cost you 130 more MP. For a total of 950 MP to cast 5 times.

If you only cast Thunder IV alone the increase is 42 more mp per cast than now meaning if you casted this 1 spell 5 times, it will cost you 210 more MP. For a total of 1,095 MP to cast 5 times.

Do you see my concern? ^^

Just because you can kill stuff faster wont matter if there is an increase in downtime.

Increasing the power of spells is nice and well deserved at 99 especially if we are investing the time and money to get high INT equipment [above 100+] (And us nuking jobs have been long overdue the attention/ ESP BLM), but making spells cost more mp for Tier 4 & 5 would mean either no one uses those spells often anymore or less play and more sitting to recover mp. It will also drain MP faster during events where procs are needed.

And if you're going to tell us to just use tier 3 and below that's like telling any other 99 job to take a step down. Maybe Tier 1-3 might be mp effecient and useful for solo purposes outside events/adoulin in low level areas, but for VW/Abby BLM will have to spam Tier4, AM, JA, GA spells for proc, and these events are fast pace compare to soloing.

I just don't see anyone wanting to Nuke Tier 3 and lower at boss fights. If Nukers have more downtime, then playing the roll of "Nuker" will become less popular than it already is now. (For the fact that 18 man alliances need other jobs too and not just Nukers)

Think about the people who play outside of Abby/VW.
It's pretty sad to be level 99 and only be able to maybe cast 5 tier IV spells (That's if you didn't waste mp on buffing yourself and others before battle). Maybe less for other race than Taru.

Personally, (and i cant speak for others) but Id rather not have the elemental change at all if there's going to be more downtime. It's already bad enough as it is having to wait for mp recovery only being able to kill 1 mob in adoulin with full mp as a redmage.

Sad no? Level 99 and it cost over 1k mp to kill only 1 monster in adoulin....

I didn't even mention what it would be like for jobs who casts Tier 5 Spells.

Why SE are you afraid to give us a little power? So far you guys give adjustments like these disguised to look like a great thing but secretly take away that power through some catch.

Like people got excited about the merit adjustment for ws however most of us that are strict to meriting 5 points for the purpose of having a max damage ws have no use for that adjustment.

[Just my personal opinion] Having the ability to see higher number damage is great and all, and all of us at 99 already killing ourselves trying to obtain the best gears to accomplish this, but as a mage job id prefer less downtime over higher damage/mp cost. Having high damage means more enmity.

Or please give us some hope that some miracle adjustment will be made to all mages where SE Devs will grant us a nice boost in MP or add stronger Refresh gear beyond the 1-3 tick per piece. Something, anything would be more than appreciated

Clearly this new mage adjustment is good for players at lower levels who can make use of the lower tier spells. And yes recast and casting adjustment helps benefit every mage job that doesn't nuke, only use the lower tiers for procs but observe what you are adjusting (Elemental spells clearly to improve Nukers) , and most of us are beyond the level 75 era where we would like to very much make use of the spells we bought especially some of us who paid over 7 mil for Tier 5/Comet, 10+ mil gil for Meteor. (I'm still disappointed that u need to use Elemental seal to cast it each time. The spell itself is a real MP Killer as it is, the spell doesn't even do massive damage solo and not very many people even have the spell yet being that it's difficult to obtain but even if it wasn't limited to single use with elemental seal, the cost of the spell is very high, and we all know it "can " be amazing dmg with several blm but at what events do you see several blm team up for meteor? Not saying it never happens but BLM job itself is nothing more than a nuker therefore left out on a good majority of events that other jobs serve better purpose when blm is not needed for proc)


Edit: You give us this amazing spell, since day one of FFXI Release over a decade ago, we got to see intro video everyday that we logged in of the little cute tarus casting Meteor, Dream about it every single day from the start of the world of this amazing game us fans have come to love wondering when the day will arrive when we will finally get the spell only to find out that through such rarity, extreme limitations, that the spell has not made a proper debut yet. How much longer do you need us to wait before we can have some real fun and enjoy what you have given us? Some of us players are getting old, youd be surprised, I have friend reaching age 60.. Are you waiting for the generation of our kids or our great grand kids? Some of us would love to blow stuff up with a great big bang within this lifetime... so please dont forget about us too....

I've yet to see even 1 BLM invited for adoulin/Delve... So yeah this update was pretty exciting until seeing that a good amount of spells will now cost more mp than now when update happens.

It would be nice to play in areas independently where we can stop relying on temp items and atmas, then maybe people will learn to get -pdt gear, buy food and meds and show up at event ready.

Thank you for talking the time to read my concern over the new upcoming adjustments.

[bigdave]

so keep blm's meteor useless thanks for making me waste 30 million gil on it

[Demon6324236]

so keep blm's meteor useless thanks for making me waste 30 million gil on it

This... is so very correct. I have never once seen any party for any event bring 6 BLMs, even 3 BLMs is only in VW and any time I have ever asked the other BLMs if they had it, I have had 1 said yes, and every other one has said no. This spell was built flawed, rather than being the ultimate BLM spell its become the ultimate BLM waste of gil, providing nothing for the job in the end, and if its damage will be even lower by compare to others, it becomes only worse...

[Zhronne]

What about Helix damage? Kaustra damage?

[Chimerawizard]

stuff

You hit the nail on the head. While a Nuking DD can deal a lot of DMG in a single instant, it's still only about the same as a fully buffed DD can do on a single WS. They don't have any concerns with recast, MP, & have the HP/def to take a hit when they pull hate. Also, between WS's they get to dmg the mob with constant melee swings making them able to deal even MORE dmg. Forget not that WAR/MNK/DRK/SAM/RNG are the competition for DD spots in a party. They also win every time in dmg, & almost every time at survivability.

Meteor is an expensive and weak spell. A typical delve boss has 1m+ HP. meteor can do ~50k. how long would it take two parties of BLM's + tank party to kill one of those? (BLM parties cycle meteor every 5 minutes to avoid the resistance) There is just no place to use meteor in the game.

Dear SE:
I have for you a new formula for Meteor that will make it worth more than just collecting dust in the spell list.
DMG=['final caster mythic bonus?']x['total elemental magic skill'/100]x[total INT/100]^(final caster's MAB)
notice MAB is only taken from the final caster & it is not multiplied with other terms, instead it takes the other terms and brings it to a power of INT.
Devil's advocate, 6BLMs w/ lots of INT & final caster w/ mythic.
DMG=1.1x[4.2x6]x[2.00x6]^[3.5]
DMG=27.72x5986
DMG=165,930

That looks like real meteor dmg combining 6 BLMs (I think there's a 99,999 dmg cap, so 99,999 would be the actual ending dmg).

I actually think that is how MAB should work in all spells anyway. There are dimishing returns from increased INT & MAB on all spells. If a term were made to take another term to a power, nuke DD's might be capable of competing with physical DD's for a spot. Haste gives an increasing return the more that is stacked. Mages don't benefit from that haste since it just means we run out of MP that much quicker.

On another note, It's time Modus Veritas got un-nerf'd. Even with 10 SCH's, with 5/5 MV merits, using it on a single helix it'll have 1 tick before it wears, the dmg from which would be 1024x normal dmg, so ~350k on a good day, oh wait, there's a 99,999 dmg cap. so dmg would only be 99,999. 10 alliance spots for 99,999dmg? DD's still outrank the alliance of sch's thanks to the recast on MV. (6x SCH is only 64x normal DMG & 1.95 ticks) making Meteor a stronger nuke if adjusted the way mentioned above.

Forgot to mention:
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, please give some feedback on "How would you like certain items to be changed?"
You made the thread after all.

[Motenten]

@Daemon: Obviously, then, you'd switch to Stone/Water nukes if you want to improve MP efficiency. Damage per MP on tier 4s, for a given nuke set (per my spreadsheet) is 11.7 for Thunder IV, and 19.8 for Stone IV. That is, for a 1000 MP pool, you'd do a bit under 12k damage with Thunder IV, and nearly 20k damage with Stone IV.

If casting more nukes isn't a problem, you can improve it further by dropping to Stone III, where you'd have 22.4 damage per MP. It's a small improvement, and you'd only go that route if you needed very bit of MP efficiency possible.

And you don't need yet another Magian staff for it; Int and MAB are going to be better options for the 'lower' elements.

For tier 5's, it's 20.3 dmg/mp for Stone V vs 11.6 dmg/mp for Thunder V.

[Raksha]

What about Helix damage? Kaustra damage?

Seconded..

[Kristal]

What about Helix damage? Kaustra damage?

Those are damage over time spells, and Kaustra isn't even elemental magic. This thread is about nukes, so while Meteor is relevant, helixes and Kaustra are not. Might as well ask about RDM merit tier 2 changes then.