[dev1143] One-handed and Ranged Weapon Adjustments

[darkhorror]

technically speaking, martial arts costs TP/hit just the same as DW, since they're both outright delay reductions rather than haste effects. Not saying that I disagree with you, since I'm a mnk and a pup and I know full well how strong h2h has always been, but I thought that was worth clarifying.

Yeah, the point I was trying to make was that H2H is strong because of it's high base DPS, so it can make up for the loss of TP and WS frequency with melee damage.

[Himrik]

Off handing a weapon that does so much less damage than the main hand weapon hurt's the DPS by a LOT.

Off handing a weapon gives you the second weapon bonuses, be it Accuracy, Attack, stats, etc...
You can keep the severe damage from coruscanti, the critical damage boost from Aluh Jambiya or the eightfold attacks from Kraken Club (You won't have to worry for you DPS when you can WS every 5 seconds), and there are craftable weapons with very high DPS.

With the exact same modifiers, Dual Wield is way too overpowered. It's why 2-handed weapons were changed in the first place. Change dual wield, and in several months, no one will ever use 2-handed, so SE will need to upgrade the bonuses, so people will complain about one handed weapons, etc, etc...until anyone can OS any monster.

[FrankReynolds]

Off handing a weapon gives you the second weapon bonuses, be it Accuracy, Attack, stats, etc...
You can keep the severe damage from coruscanti, the critical damage boost from Aluh Jambiya or the eightfold attacks from Kraken Club (You won't have to worry for you DPS when you can WS every 5 seconds), and there are craftable weapons with very high DPS.

With the exact same modifiers, Dual Wield is way too overpowered. It's why 2-handed weapons were changed in the first place. Change dual wield, and in several months, no one will ever use 2-handed, so SE will need to upgrade the bonuses, so people will complain about one handed weapons, etc, etc...until anyone can OS any monster.

Dual wielders aren't even close to surpassing 2 handers in damage. Don't kid yourself. That bonus stat from the offhand doesn't change anything.

[Kincard]

If you seriously think that the stats from offhand can overpower the base damage and fSTR cap differences you probably don't know very much about how the game works. In order for it to happen they'd need to add some very overpowered weapons that work for the offhand.

That aside, I'm not sure how to feel about the decided change for MNKs. It's true that they are stronger than all the other 1Hers but last I checked they were still pretty behind jobs like WAR and DRK when the buffs go up. Not sure how big the difference is though.

[woie]

Greetings,

There has been a variety of feedback both for and against these changes, especially in regards to how it will affect those that dual wield and use hand-to-hand weapons. The development team's goal is to make adjustments so that there is balance between two-handed weapons and one-handed weapons.

In regards to hand-to-hand weapons, we'd like to go about these adjustments carefully or else there may be too big of a jump in power, so we will be making some slight adjustments during the next Test Server update. The 75% STR modifier that is currently only applied to the right hand will be slightly reduced to 62.5% and we will be applying it to both hands. (The 75% DEX modifier for both hands will not change.)

We'll continue to update you on any planned changes!

but giving us a 141 dmg H2H weapon was fine.... i lol'd

[FrankReynolds]

If you seriously think that the stats from offhand can overpower the base damage and fSTR cap differences you probably don't know very much about how the game works. In order for it to happen they'd need to add some very overpowered weapons that work for the offhand.

That aside, I'm not sure how to feel about the decided change for MNKs. It's true that they are stronger than all the other 1Hers but last I checked they were still pretty behind jobs like WAR and DRK when the buffs go up. Not sure how big the difference is though.

I'm more concerned with how fragile monk is. I haven't done any Delve NMs etc. with any super elite geared groups, just pickups. My damage seems fine VS Sams, Drks etc., but perfect dodge counter doesn't keep you alive like seigon / third eye when that mob turns your way.

[Cream_Soda]

I don't see how it's too large of a jump in power.

h2h is the only category that doesn't get anything at all in the offhand. No grips, no dw. etc. We can't reach the amount of haste that 2handers can with hasso, which will always keep them at top in damage in anything that matters (for example, the only delve megaboss clears have all been zerg parties; soul voice marches, embrava, etc.)

And comparing to DW, we get no kinds of stats to put in the offhand at all. Can't add a lower delay wep in the offhand to enhance martial arts. Can't put something with acc/attack/crit damage in the offhand.

There's no reason for the second punch to be treated as an offhand to begin with. There's no bonus for that slot that every other job has access to.

[Mirage]

Greetings,

There has been a variety of feedback both for and against these changes, especially in regards to how it will affect those that dual wield and use hand-to-hand weapons. The development team's goal is to make adjustments so that there is balance between two-handed weapons and one-handed weapons.

In regards to hand-to-hand weapons, we'd like to go about these adjustments carefully or else there may be too big of a jump in power, so we will be making some slight adjustments during the next Test Server update. The 75% STR modifier that is currently only applied to the right hand will be slightly reduced to 62.5% and we will be applying it to both hands. (The 75% DEX modifier for both hands will not change.)

We'll continue to update you on any planned changes!

Bolded text for emphasis. Are you saying that some people are against the idea of boosting one handed weapons? Because I have a hard time believing that. In that case, who are against it?

Could you also comment on the issue of only increasing the accuracy of the sub-slot weapon? In which instances would dual wielders such as thf, dnc, nin and blu be getting too much attack power by having their sub-weapon also gain 75% of their STR as attack?

[Byrth]

I don't see how it's too large of a jump in power.

h2h is the only category that doesn't get anything at all in the offhand. No grips, no dw. etc. We can't reach the amount of haste that 2handers can with hasso, which will always keep them at top in damage in anything that matters (for example, the only delve megaboss clears have all been zerg parties; soul voice marches, embrava, etc.)

And comparing to DW, we get no kinds of stats to put in the offhand at all. Can't add a lower delay wep in the offhand to enhance martial arts. Can't put something with acc/attack/crit damage in the offhand.

There's no reason for the second punch to be treated as an offhand to begin with. There's no bonus for that slot that every other job has access to.

This is a stupid argument and you should feel embarrassed putting it forward. Look at other posts in this thread.

[Babekeke]

This is a stupid argument and you should feel embarrassed putting it forward. Look at other posts in this thread.

Of course it's stupid. He recommends SV marchES along with Embrava, and in his previous post he said how Perfect Dodge doesn't help MNK much lol.