Temper (A request)

[Demon6324236]

Implying we didn't used to do this with Refresh and Haste in meritpos and such?

No, implying I knew where we came from and do not want to go back to it because it was terrible...

[Damane]

No, implying I knew where we came from and do not want to go back to it because it was terrible...

1. Go to your moghouse
2. Pick the button change job
3. Pick any job that isnt RDM
----> fixed for you

If you really think RDM will be adjusted in the melee department that way that it can compete with the top-dog Melees, you are delusional and frankly know nothing about balance. There is a reason why BLU can compete with them and RDM cant.
BLU has to sacrifice alot of its spellslots to get the traits it needs and to set the SJ it needs to come close to them, mostly by sacrificing alot of their self cure/debuff/buff capabilitys.
Do you really think RDM would get a free pass to top-tier melee dmg without it getting stomped somewhere? you would need to lock out half of RDMs spells for that to happen, or otherwise you are looking at a melee&tank that can keep himself alive just fine.
Grow up and think about it logically: the only way to fix RDM would be to focus on its backline capabilitys like buffing/debuffing/curing and fixing that. Because that is the only way to go for the Job without breaking it.

[Demon6324236]

1. Go to your moghouse
2. Pick the button change job
3. Pick any job that isnt RDM
----> fixed for you

Oh I see, I should play another job rather than asking for my job to be fixed.

If you really think RDM will be adjusted in the melee department that way that it can compete with the top-dog Melees, you are delusional and frankly know nothing about balance. There is a reason why BLU can compete with them and RDM cant.

Here we go with the top again, when in the hell did I ask for RDM to be a competitor with the top DDs in the game? Show me where I asked for that once! I want to see it. I have asked for us to fit in with lighter DDs better, not surpass them, but come close enough that our DD power is not seen as a waste of time or space, so we can actually use that side of the job. I really hate when people put words in my posts, and you just did, as I said, not asking for top, or near top, I just want to be less shit.

BLU has to sacrifice alot of its spellslots to get the traits it needs and to set the SJ it needs to come close to them, mostly by sacrificing alot of their self cure/debuff/buff capabilitys.
Do you really think RDM would get a free pass to top-tier melee dmg without it getting stomped somewhere? you would need to lock out half of RDMs spells for that to happen, or otherwise you are looking at a melee&tank that can keep himself alive just fine.

Even if you give RDM access to the same gear as BLU, BLU would be stronger because of those spells and traits, BLU has buff spells for offence as well as powerful enfeebling type spells as well as types of spells RDM has no access to natively at all, like quick stuns, or a cure with Attack bonus on it.

Grow up and think about it logically

I have, I also used sheets to determine the effect this would have on the jobs damage, and it would still be weaker than many other jobs, as I said before, I aim to be in a 3rd place position of Hybrid jobs, above mage jobs and below real Light DDs and Heavy DDs, where we belong, but are not at currently, we are to far behind right now, this gear would put us where we should be at, a slight bonus from a unique DW trait or Brave would go a long way as well.

the only way to fix RDM would be to focus on its backline capabilitys like buffing/debuffing/curing and fixing that. Because that is the only way to go for the Job without breaking it.

Boom, your normal statement that makes no sense because by doing that you do nothing but again, make us a slightly altered SCH, a worthless copy of another job. I explained this earlier this thread I think if you care to go read it, SCH has almost everything better in a full mage department than RDM does and if you enhance RDM to be the same you are doing nothing but making it a copy with some slight alterations. Out magic is fine besides needing some new unique spells in the places where we specialize, our melee has fallen behind, what sets RDM apart from any other job, we are the only mage with access to both sides of magic while having a melee side as well, flaw is that we fail to melee well enough to matter. Fix the melee part and we have a unique ability, ignore it and work on magic and we become nothing but an alternate SCH.

[Tassidaru]

BLU has to sacrifice alot of its spellslots to get the traits it needs and to set the SJ it needs to come close to them, mostly by sacrificing alot of their self cure/debuff/buff capabilitys.

Do you even play Blue mage? I mean really sit down, study it, solo shit, test it out? because at 99 i can set Auto refresh, Double Atk Atk bonus acc bonus DW 3 and skillchain bonus.. and with all that i have a ~cure 4, stun, low and high mp cost phydmg spells (including spells for self chain darkness, light and fragmentation) haste, AOE erase, refresh, and magical damage spells. add say /sch to that and im a powerful dd in "most" situations, and have very potent cures, or say i /war drop the DA and Atk bonus, allowing me to set magic dmg stoneskin, phalanx, regen, AOE sleep, Occulation. and my survivability raised dramatically. The think is most blue spells aren't really worth getting..only about 1/3 -1/2 of the total spell list is worth the effort. and now with good spells also setting good traits...i hope you get the idea. Blue mage's one major issue Blue magic attack, but i'm not going to try to explain it to you. Hopefully you will actually go do research before you make assumptions again.

[Numquam]

I don't get why people want RDM to melee? I mean, it is just another backline job. If anything, I think they need to boost RUN's offensive capabilities more. Now that I think about it they should add Temper to RUN. THat would make more sense.

[Demon6324236]

I don't get why people want RDM to melee? I mean, it is just another backline job.

But its not, if you take away RDM's melee power you get a SCH who has Refresh instead of Sublimation, Enfeebling, weaker heals, weaker nukes, some self buffs, less unique party buffs(Phalanx II), and Convert. The sad part is RDM does not really even have all of that compared to SCH because SCH's best sub is RDM, meaning it takes away RDM's only unique party buff because of Accession, Convert, and all but 2 non-merit Enfeebling spells. So RDM's key differences in that case become... Refresh, weaker healing, weaker nukes, some self buffs, merit Enfeebling, Addle, Gravity II, and no JAs that really help its magic besides composure which is great but beaten on other players even with all +duration gear when you count in SCH's Perpetuance. In essence even if we sub SCH we gain a couple spells and their Arts but lack real stratagem use which means we are still weaker than SCH is just about every possible way.

Making us a back line job only would leave us as just a gimp version of SCH, and any attempt to make our magic side stronger is basically stepping on SCH's toes unless its via Enhancing or Enfeebling. Enfeebling is great except if its of any great use like Amnesia or such it will become impossible to land, look at the new NMs and Silence for example, it is possible to land Silence on them, I have done it, but even if you do, even with Elemental seal it lasts about 5~10 seconds and wears instantly, Amnesia would do the same, so the spell is gimped. Enhancing magic is either going to be not enough to invite the job or its going to do nothing but bring back buff cycling, we can not hit 500 Enhancing Magic skill and have full duration gear, the best we can do it 2 pieces of AF3+2 with duration Feet & Back, so we still are cycling it quite a bit.

I myself do not think that buffing our magic side is needed, I think we have exactly what we need for it, we have the best nuking gear, a good tier trait for it, best recast times, T4s, I think were going good on that, and healing, well you can cap Cure Potency with just 5 pieces of gear, 7 if you lack Iaso Head, and none of it includes your weapon, which effects the next part. Melee is in need of assistance, while we can cure well, and we can nuke well, our melee is very sub-par because we are left off of almost any gear of real use for it which drags us down a ton.

[Tassidaru]

That's the point, its NOT just another backline job...it never was. at 75, (when RDM still could use competitive dd gear) a good RDM could keep up with the light DDs like Thf and DNC, and if they put out real effort could (rather quickly at times) pull hate from plds. Hell, at 75 we were the only NM Soloist of any note. and not because we could kite...personally at 75 i face tanked/soloed all the base avatars and Ash Dragon. since then, we have slowly slid from a competitive light dd to the bottom of the dmg barrel.And SE has done basically nothing to stem this backslide... since lvl 80 SE has just about dropped support for DDRDM. but what really pisses me off is that SE refuses to at least decide what they want from RDM... like in gear, no Athos, no Thaumas, yet we can use Kudzu. this lackluster half-***ed gear selection is retarded. Either let us use light armor, or just strip Dagger and sword skill. Honestly I'd be happy either way.

[Rooj]

Most of these people just want to melee on the RDM for attention (*cough* ^ *cough*). I guarantee you if RDM melee were to get considerably buffed, these people would stop playing RDM and go play PUP or some other job that people don't want in their party.
Though honestly it's always like this in every game with the jack of all trades classes, the people that play them don't appreciate all of the parts of their class and therefore claim to be underpowered, never understanding the reason their class doesn't get 'fixed' is because gameplay balance is determined by 'pros' (AKA the people who are actually good [the best] at the game). People knew what they were getting into when they decided to play a jack of all trades class (never being the best at anything), yet you continually see posts asking for RDM to be "as good at melee as a WAR or MNK" or "as good at nuking as a BLM."

It's astounding. Really.

[Demon6324236]

Most of these people just want to melee on the RDM for attention (*cough* ^ *cough*). I guarantee you if RDM melee were to get considerably buffed, these people would stop playing RDM and go play PUP or some other job that people don't want in their party.

You don't know me or my personality or why I play the job, I play RDM because I like the job, I have put a lot of work into the job, and I can show you all of that work if you really want me to.

yet you continually see posts asking for RDM to be "as good at melee as a WAR or MNK" or "as good at nuking as a BLM."

Show me one post where anyone has ever asked that, in the entirety of this forum.

It's astounding. Really.

How ignorant people are in their posts? I agree, it is astounding.

[Rooj]

You don't know me or my personality or why I play the job

Yes, it's hard to know anything about someone who has over 3,000 posts. Good grief.