BST Native Dual-Wield~

[Ramaza]

I've searched the forums and never seen it suggested, but why can't BST have its own native dual wield? It seems like most of the one-handed DDs these days (BLU, NIN, THF, DNC) get dual-wield, but BST gets none unless they sub /DNC or /NIN. Letting us have our own native dual-wield could open up more SJ options and let us sub more damaging SJs like /WAR and at least try to compete with other hard hitting melee in party situations. Not only that but we could dual wield -PDT axes as /WHM or /SCH for solo if we needed to sub those and not /DNC.

[Caketime]

This would be a fun addition, but that's the problem. We're not allowed to have too much fun, at least some of our gameplay has to be frustrating. At least we're not relying on Charm roulette to stay alive at all times anymore, now our biggest annoyances are jug space and no native DW. I like this suggestion, but every non-BST will hate it forever and pre-emptively cry nerf.

[Ramaza]

This would be a fun addition, but that's the problem. We're not allowed to have too much fun, at least some of our gameplay has to be frustrating. At least we're not relying on Charm roulette to stay alive at all times anymore, now our biggest annoyances are jug space and no native DW. I like this suggestion, but every non-BST will hate it forever and pre-emptively cry nerf.

Said no happy, no fun no merriment lol. At this point though I can't imagine why any other job would cry foul because BST got it's own native dual-wield traits. It only makes sense at this point. I mean common now, do they really expect people to still being using board and axe outside the most niche of situations :x? At least with a native dual-wield trait we could better compete with other jobs for damage. I don't even mind the annoyance of tons upon tons of jugs if we could just get our own dual-wield without /NIN or /DNC.

[Louispv]

Because SE gave us fencer. They never test anything in this game or play it themselves, so they have no idea that fencer is absolutely worthless even for it's intended purpose, but it's there.

[Ramaza]

Because SE gave us fencer. They never test anything in this game or play it themselves, so they have no idea that fencer is absolutely worthless even for it's intended purpose, but it's there.

Real talk, making it not work with dual wield is one of the dumbest moves they've made by far. I don't see Fencer being that game breaking or unbalanced for BST if it actually worked with dual wield, or ACTUALLY GIVING US the dual wield trait.

[Raborn]

I actually find Fencer quite useful, however at its current Tier on BST its practically worthless (No its still better than nothing!), now if SE would increase BST's Fencer = or greater than that of WAR's, I would gladly take Fencer over Dual Wield any day!

Hey Devs! Can we get a Fencer trait increase to that of WARs?

Seeing as our primary weapon is a SINGLE HANDED WEAPON?

And how about an Accuracy and Attack bonus to Fencer too?
Up to +15 at the 5th tier?

[Zagen]

Getting native DW would be incredibly overpowered for the job, even at DW 1 I'd consider it going into the overpowered realm. The only time I could see it being of benefit without making BST over powered is in VW where /WAR would be appealing because BST wouldn't get DD buffs.

I would gladly take Fencer over Dual Wield any day!

The only time Fencer would ever pull ahead for BST (even at WAR's current Tier V) is when you're not /NIN or /DNC and are able to melee. In the current FFXI world I can think of 2 situations where that would apply; "for fun" and if you're soloing Armed Gears as BST/SCH. You just give up too much to make Fencer work over Dual Wield.

[Ramaza]

Getting native DW would be incredibly overpowered for the job, even at DW 1 I'd consider it going into the overpowered realm. The only time I could see it being of benefit without making BST over powered is in VW where /WAR would be appealing because BST wouldn't get DD buffs.


The only time Fencer would ever pull ahead for BST (even at WAR's current Tier V) is when you're not /NIN or /DNC and are able to melee. In the current FFXI world I can think of 2 situations where that would apply; "for fun" and if you're soloing Armed Gears as BST/SCH. You just give up too much to make Fencer work over Dual Wield.

As someone who regularly parses I beg to differ. The Ruinator WS is quite literally the only way we can keep up these days. DW1 certainly isn't going to overpower anyone, neither will DW2 or 3 on its own; the delay of one-handed axes will make sure of that. The real strength of being able to have dual wield on our own will come from being able to sub WAR and still Dual wield. In doing this we'll at least have a leg up in trying to compete in damage with other jobs, since outside of Killer Instinct/Traits/Food BST has no native way to boost their own damage.

Not to mention the benefits of being able to dual wield PDT axes and /Mage if you have to. The benefits outweigh any possible negatives.

[Zagen]

As someone who regularly parses I beg to differ. The Ruinator WS is quite literally the only way we can keep up these days. DW1 certainly isn't going to overpower anyone, neither will DW2 or 3 on its own; the delay of one-handed axes will make sure of that. The real strength of being able to have dual wield on our own will come from being able to sub WAR and still Dual wield. In doing this we'll at least have a leg up in trying to compete in damage with other jobs, since outside of Killer Instinct/Traits/Food BST has no native way to boost their own damage.

Not to mention the benefits of being able to dual wield PDT axes and /Mage if you have to. The benefits outweigh any possible negatives.

Math > Parse. If your parses have you keeping up with DDs (I'm assuming that's what you're talking about) then 1 of 4 things is happening:
1) Those DD suck
2) Different buffs
3) Lag
4) Human error

Ruinator is amazing but it isn't going to bridge the gap with DDs.

DW 1 allows BST to go BST/nonNINorDNC while maximizing it's pet's stats via double axes. Essentially beneficial for the sit back and watch solos. Like I implied weak enough but still boarders into the overpowered realm as it removes restriction of weapon limitation from dropping /NIN or /DNC.

DW2-3 gives us the same as /NIN and /DNC for TP gain. However when you throw in an extra 10% Double Attack the TP gain surpasses /NIN and /DNC (should be obvious I'm just pointing it out not assuming you don't get that). Combine that with 25% Attack and it grants us even faster ability to destroy a monster without penalty.

Despite the delay on Axes DW2+ > Single Wield for TP and overall damage.

I get the idea you want to try and keep up with the DD classes but BST is not a DD. Trying to break into that realm would make BST overpowered and lead to nerfs in other areas that BST currently excels.

[Ramaza]

I actually find Fencer quite useful, however at its current Tier on BST its practically worthless (No its still better than nothing!), now if SE would increase BST's Fencer = or greater than that of WAR's, I would gladly take Fencer over Dual Wield any day!

Hey Devs! Can we get a Fencer trait increase to that of WARs?

Seeing as our primary weapon is a SINGLE HANDED WEAPON?

And how about an Accuracy and Attack bonus to Fencer too?
Up to +15 at the 5th tier?

The amount of Fencer that WAR has is just as equally useless >.>. Matching our Fencer trait level with WAR's isn't going to magically make it better-even dual wielding on WAR is a better option than single wielding, and Ragnarok/Ukkon is better than that.

We need native dual wield on this job. Not more Fencer.