Storing Attachments

[Toadie-Odie]

If you're really looking to get a quick switch, practice knowing exactly where the absolutely necessary pieces of what you're trying to do are at.

[...]

If what you're doing doesn't allow down time to switch out a puppet, stick with the one that best fits the situation. If you're not doing this you're making it alot harder than it has to be.

All valid points that I won't argue with - I agree with you. As BST I craft/buy the jugs I need for the task at hand in advance. I approach PUP in a similar fashion and try to prepare the automaton in advance for what I think I need.

My intent here is to brainstorm the idea presented in this thread. I see it being potentially useful to both the experienced and newbie PUP player alike since I consider myself somewhere inbetween. There is nothing wrong with exploring the concept of any idea. I like the idea of increasing flexibilty of the job and its pet.

I also believe the points you have brought up to address the issue using the already existing mechanics is valuable information. Some of which I hadn't considered, like bringing out just a head and frame build in a crisis.

If these forums are intended to give feedback, generate ideas, provide suggestions and even share information to the devs and players alike, then we accomplish that just by discussing the plausiblity of ideas such as this one. Even if the idea isn't implemented in the end the thread isn't a waste: just participating here has caused me to look at and consider the job differently. The next time I play the job I will remember what has been said in these forums - not just this thread - and experiment with suggestions that my fellow players have made. This is how I learn to become a better player.

Therefore I try not to treat any idea presented as "stupid" but instead try to look at what the issue the idea is trying to address and run with it. How can you fix it as a player with what already exists? How might SE adjust it in future update? If it was adjusted how might this effect the way we play? What can we do as a community to make it more enjoyable as a whole?

All of this is valuable discussion - not just for the devs but for us as the player base.

But seriously, the proposed idea probably wouldnt even work as you think it will. You still have deactivate on a minute timer, so even if you did call out a new looking puppet you're stuck with it for that time period. Not to mention the puppet has to be kept at 100% hp the entire time, so I hope you get it out of range of any AoEs before its too late or you're burning a repair. So yeah, complicated.

BST has a base recast timer of 5 minutes. Whether you use Leave or the pet dies, you are still dependent on this timer before you can call another pet. A one minute recast with an instantly ready Activate if you can keep the pet's HP at 100% is far more flexible YET there are players that feel that PUP isn't as flexible as BST. Why? I think perhaps it's due to the trade off with the time it takes to rebuild the attachments if you are changing the frame and head. Therefore it's very likely that SE won't make any changes to this feature to PUP.

SMN on the other hand has even greater flexibilty in swapping of pets on demand. I don't know the full details of the job since my SMN is only lv30 so I can't go into that. The pet job with the least amount of flexibilty is DRG from what I've seen since its behavior is largely dependent upon the subjob you chose.

I get the impression that the OP would like to see PUP's pet mechanics to be somewhere closer to the flexibility of SMN. If I'm wrong please let me know.

[Cabalabob]

I get the impression that the OP would like to see PUP's pet mechanics to be somewhere closer to the flexibility of SMN. If I'm wrong please let me know.

SMN isn't that flexible, we get short pet recasts but we get 1min-45second recasts on one buff and one DD move then we do nothing cause our pets lack the strength to DD without just being a tp feed, and we cant afford to buff our pet dd abilities out side of blood pacts cause we need all our gear slots on perpetuation gear. On top of that all our pets are blm's except one who is a whm and sucks so never gets used, the only reasons to switch is to use a similar nuke of a different element which is hardly versatility if fighting the same monster, to use a buff which is not a helpful versatility seeing as PUP's get all their buffs in one place(whm frame) and to use different physical blood pacts, but we only have 2-3 good ones so not much versatility there.

In many ways pup is far more versatile than SMN, it may not be able to switch with the same ease but it gets far more benefits from doing so.

On to the point of saving attatchments, I'm fine with the idea, but there would need to be a cooldown period to stop it being overpowered, same way BLU has a 1 min cooldown period on resetting spells. But having this cooldown would defeat the point of having saved sets for each frame. I mean it would be nice if you're just the forgetful sort who doesn't remember how you set up your pup the last time or just don't like swapping every time you switch puppet. But from a battle stand point it would need to be balanced to the point where it's a useless change.

[Toadie-Odie]

Well that's good to know about SMN.

I do agree that if a save build option was implemented there would need to be a balance of some kind. Maybe like a seperate job ability that could activate a saved build with a fixed timer seperate from the Activation timer would work.

[Gwodien]

On to the point of saving attatchments, I'm fine with the idea, but there would need to be a cooldown period to stop it being overpowered, same way BLU has a 1 min cooldown period on resetting spells.But having this cooldown would defeat the point of having saved sets for each frame. I mean it would be nice if you're just the forgetful sort who doesn't remember how you set up your pup the last time or just don't like swapping every time you switch puppet. But from a battle stand point it would need to be balanced to the point where it's a useless change.

Nailed it. copy it exactly as blu has it and make it almost purely utility, a non-combat ability maybe?
or if activate/dues ex is ready for use, and you used a saved attachment layout, it sets both to a 1 min cool down, or ads an overload like debuff that prevents the pet from acting for 1 min while it re calibrates itself and rewrites its programming to handle the sudden changes to its attachments/frames?

[Toadie-Odie]

The recalibration idea sounds like a workable feature I could deal with.

[Zagen]

Nailed it. copy it exactly as blu has it and make it almost purely utility, a non-combat ability maybe?

It already works like BLU... When you call your puppet it is setup exactly as you left it last time, just like how a BLU's spells are stored when they change back to BLU. Not only does it work like BLU's spell sets our current functionality under certain conditions (Activate/Dues timers and your speed at switching attachments/frames) can be faster than BLU.

Essentially making this change would lead to the recalibration idea which then further gimps PUP not helps it.

[Gwodien]

Essentially making this change would lead to the recalibration idea which then further gimps PUP not helps it.

pup doesnt need more help. it needs limitations. blu cant Freely change spells in field without a set back, and that far from gimps that job. why not just get rid of the activate cooldown entirely? its basically gimping the job.

yes, im being a little troll. but come on, think about what your asking for. why not give every job a free full heal every 1 min. because that is basically what your asking for here. it takes time and effort to switch the attachments and frames, making it hard to instantly deactivate the pet, change parts and activate it to heal you, yes, it can be done now as it is. but not without risk of not being able to pull it off fast enough in emergency situations.

[Zagen]

pup doesnt need more help. it needs limitations. blu cant Freely change spells in field without a set back, and that far from gimps that job. why not just get rid of the activate cooldown entirely? its basically gimping the job.

yes, im being a little troll. but come on, think about what your asking for. why not give every job a free full heal every 1 min. because that is basically what your asking for here. it takes time and effort to switch the attachments and frames, making it hard to instantly deactivate the pet, change parts and activate it to heal you, yes, it can be done now as it is. but not without risk of not being able to pull it off fast enough in emergency situations.

Maybe you should read what I said and not what you interpreted.

I never said I wanted anything, I actually stated that a change such as the OP's suggestion would lead to a restriction similar to the idea you presented (recalibration), and that would actually weaken PUP.

Honestly I don't want this change or any change to how attachments/frames work because it will mean a gimp of some sort. I'm quite happy with how setting up attachments/frames currently work.

You talk about BLU not having a setback have you actually played BLU? The moment you change a spell you can't cast any BLU spells for 1 minute.

[Absinthe]

Anything devs...?

[Horadrim]

They should just give us a second Automaton and divide Activate into two abilities: Activate I and Activate II.

The abilities would share a cooldown, and Deus Ex Automata would only revive the last Auto used. Then we can have two load outs preset up and switch between them easier. Or have one, and a have a second we can equip while the main automaton is fighting.