On Red Mage melee...

[Greatguardian]

(Nitpick: 4.65% defense down could technically beat 2x minuet given if there already enough defense down on the mob in the first place)

You're inverted. 4.65% defense down would only beat 2x Minuet if the monster had some extremely high Defense value (as in, significantly higer than anything that exists in the entire game, so practically never), or if cRatio became capped either way in which case they would be equal. The upgrade from Dia 2 to Dia 3 will never "beat" Minuets on EXP mobs.

[Aurara]

Shits situational

...this just isn't that situation

What? Are you really saying replace a DNC with 5/5 haste samba merits or COR buffs with a melee rdm? What is situational about that? oh right, NOTHING.

[Supersun]

You're inverted. 4.65% defense down would only beat 2x Minuet if the monster had some extremely high Defense value (as in, significantly higer than anything that exists in the entire game, so practically never), or if cRatio became capped either way in which case they would be equal. The upgrade from Dia 2 to Dia 3 will never "beat" Minuets on EXP mobs.

That's why I said it was a nitpick

Unless demons in dynamis xarcabard start becoming the new exp hot spot.

I've really never understood why even the toughest monsters in this game have pretty pathetic defenses. I mean we do have the means to hit decent pDifs on mobs that could have up to over 2k defense and this is assuming attack caps at 999
(jury is still technically out on that one unless something new has been found out).

(Whm+Rdm I still believe is a terrible combo. DD, DD, DD, Dnc, Rdm, Brd is where it's at imo)

[saevel]

Soo the counter argument to dia III is putting it on the healer? That is some seriousl lolz and just goes to show that you guys aren't even trying to think of a real situation and are instead just trolling.
Dia II 30MP, 27 with /SCH
Monster dies in 30s = 600 MP per 10 min (540 as /SCH).
Monster dies in 25s = 720 MP per 10 min (648 as /SCH).

You actually wanting to put that MP burden on a job who's already spamming cure / curagas on the three /WAR or Hasso DD's and who's also Hasting three people? The only sensible person to do that is the lazy BRD, although then your cutting out their healing as they don't have enough MP to keep that up.

And BTW, if your crazy enough to try to put it on the healing RDM,
45MP, 41 as /SCH, Dia III
30s per kill = 900MP per 10min, 820 as /SCH,
25s per kill = 1080MP per 10min, 984 as /SCH.

Yeah .....

[saevel]

But honestly this is getting boring. Every argument fronted was debated and defeated three to four years ago, then rehashed every year after that. It's become like religion, people will believe whatever it is they want to believe, then they'll selectively chose which arguments support their belief and disparage any counter-arguments that dispute their chose belief. It's why I for the most part stopped trying to convince people and instead just did it over and over again. Eventually the haters shut up as they had no ground to stand on.

[Aurara]

I kept buffs up at 75, as well as dia'd every single mob, suck less, get better gear, or better DDs.

[Greatguardian]

I kept buffs up at 75, as well as dia'd every single mob, suck less, get better gear, or better DDs.

Seriously, this. Keeping Dia up is hard? Really? That's the counterargument?

So what if it's using a lot of MP over time? Between Refresh, Ballads, and Evoker's if your party doesn't suck, you aren't exactly hurting on MP (3 + 3 + 3 + 2/tick gear at 75 is 1,832 MP recovered in 8 minutes 20 seconds). Oh yes, and Convert is an 8 minute 20 second ability, not 10 minute.

[Seriha]

It's not my fault you regularly put forth incorrect claims or misworded statements.

Hey, I'll give you "misworded" in this case, since I was thinking from the perspective I later elaborated and the 2x BRD thing was typically part of the optimum set up back in the day. Indulge me with incorrect claims, though. Apparently I have years of bull on Alla for you to pick from (ya know, obfuscating 'n all), so shouldn't take too long. And since I never claimed to be immune to mistakes, hey, maybe you might teach me something. That's your modus opperandi or someshit, right?

I have a pretty good idea what you'll find, though, and I strongly suspect it's been more of an opinion or even personal experience that's rubbed you the wrong way than any kind of statistical snafu, because I'm fairly sure you actually haven't played with me to garner an opinion there. So yeah, be mad I advocate RDM melee enhancements, that CoP was a poorly designed expansion for numerous reasons, that Empyreans don't just fall into the laps of anyone that logs, that myself and others aren't a fan of your little other-forum circlejerk, that people can share info without being demeaning idjits, that pinning and other solo exploits are bull, and so on. I'll tell you my biggest flaw, right here and right now.

I want FFXI to be better. Disagree with the hows and whys, sure, but that's the fact behind my opinions. Otherwise, I'm pretty curious about this grudge you've been building. Grudge might be a strong word, but I don't think you have a crush on me, either.

[saevel]

Seriously, this. Keeping Dia up is hard? Really? That's the counterargument?

So what if it's using a lot of MP over time? Between Refresh, Ballads, and Evoker's if your party doesn't suck, you aren't exactly hurting on MP (3 + 3 + 3 + 2/tick gear at 75 is 1,832 MP recovered in 8 minutes 20 seconds). Oh yes, and Convert is an 8 minute 20 second ability, not 10 minute.

Not hard, impossible due to MP constraints. The faster you kill the more expensive it gets. Your spamming Cure IV and keeping haste's up. You can jump up and down all you want and resort to the "your a gimp!!!01010101 orz" argument, but it's been done to death already and your just bull sh1ting.

[Neisan_Quetz]

Pchan already did the math on it and it wasn't impossible. Like heck I remember where it is though. Required full vert merits for Dia 3.