On Red Mage melee...

[cidbahamut]

Well it is a rather effective way to pass the time on your lunch break.

[Swords]

Then again those major endgame soloer's were really just a small select few of highly skilled and exceptionally well equipped RDM's, and really should not have been used as a scale for gauging the job for the majority of RDM's out there. But at the same time, most every job in the game has gotten buffed to the point they can do what those RDM's did and do it even better, while RDM has more or less stagnated.

[Rayik]

Then again those major endgame soloer's were really just a small select few of highly skilled and exceptionally well equipped RDM's, and really should not have been used as a scale for gauging the job for the majority of RDM's out there. But at the same time, most every job in the game has gotten buffed to the point they can do what those RDM's did and do it even better, while RDM has more or less stagnated.

Exactly this. SE got scared and declared the Exceptions suddenly as the Rule. Just because one player got crazy good at the job, ALL of us are paying the price.

[saevel]

Exactly this. SE got scared and declared the Exceptions suddenly as the Rule. Just because one player got crazy good at the job, ALL of us are paying the price.

Basically yeah, but remember this was the "old SE" we're talking about, the ones that failed in making 14. The newer guys seem to be slowly lightening up and actually wanting to fix RDM into something other then a haste / refresh / cure IV(V) bot.

[cidbahamut]

Exactly this. SE got scared and declared the Exceptions suddenly as the Rule. Just because one player got crazy good at the job, ALL of us are paying the price.

Well that's because every player has the potential to reach that level of proficiency, and then the rest of the game unravels as an army of Red Mages conquers every challenge in the game with ease. It's a valid concern regarding the game balance, even if the scenario I laid out above was always extremely unlikely(or even somewhat inaccurate).

[Swords]

Well that's because every player has the potential to reach that level of proficiency, and then the rest of the game unravels as an army of Red Mages conquers every challenge in the game with ease. It's a valid concern regarding the game balance, even if the scenario I laid out above was always extremely unlikely(or even somewhat inaccurate).

Aye, SE's fears are definitely valid in this aspect. Oh lord could you imagine how bad it would be if the gil-sellers were capable of this solobility back when they ran rampant. No one could get anything done unless they happen to just get lucky, because the gil-sellers would be crowding all the spawns.

[Rayik]

Well that's because every player has the potential to reach that level of proficiency, and then the rest of the game unravels as an army of Red Mages conquers every challenge in the game with ease. It's a valid concern regarding the game balance, even if the scenario I laid out above was always extremely unlikely(or even somewhat inaccurate).

Right, except for the part where the game has changed, although RDM has not. Mobs are now immune to the very enfeeble's that were exploited. NM's have ridiculous amounts of regain, rage sooner, etc. The nerf-bat has been swung and it was a grand slam; when was the last time you ever heard of a RDM soloing any significant NM since then? RDM's have a hard enough time staying alive outside of trash xp mobs these days.

Ninjas and Dancers, on the other hand, can solo all day and night with no worries. So really, it's not 2005 anymore. It'd be nice if SE maybe took their boot of RDM's neck a little bit.

[cidbahamut]

Right, except for the part where the game has changed, although RDM has not. Mobs are now immune to the very enfeeble's that were exploited. NM's have ridiculous amounts of regain, rage sooner, etc. The nerf-bat has been swung and it was a grand slam; when was the last time you ever heard of a RDM soloing any significant NM since then? RDM's have a hard enough time staying alive outside of trash xp mobs these days.

Does the guy who soloed Yaanei count? There's a fairly sizable list of NMs in Abyssea beyond that, although what all constitutes "significant" in Abyssea is up for debate.

[Swords]

Nah it wasn't one person, others went out and attempted what Avesta did. Some tried and failed while others succeeded, and some even came up with better methods, but the fact remains you only had maybe 5-10 people per server capable of doing this out of maybe the 15000 RDMs out there.

[saevel]

RDM can't solo some of the DNC / NIN solo's or even MNK due to evasion being too low. Most of those guys solo is just stacking massive evasion / counter and letting the NM whiff at you all day long.