Question for Devs regarding cleave

[Waldrich]

We're waiting for a contrete answer.
we are hoping the answer isn't one of the various dig-up-past-posts to know what you want to know kind of answer.

[tyrantsyn]

I thought it was pretty clear, I've seen these cleave party shout's go on for days. And while I don't think of them as disruptive or annoying as much. They do pretty much show up constantly. I'm pretty sure tho if you decide to do a shout for a paid cleave party the GM's aren't going to come down on you with the band hammer. It's those guy's who have been literally shouting all day and all night there looking at.

[Alhanelem]

I was just returning to play after being offline for some time to focus on college when I noticed this:
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While I like that RMT are still tasting the fiery wrath of the banhammer, what concerns me is that the post seems somewhat vague. I have participated in non-RMT parties that power leveled people who paid us gil for compensation for our time so that we could afford to buy some better gear in the past. (In other words, no RMT involvement at all, we were just working to make our characters better by performing in game work for in game rewards, similar in concept to simply doing a quest.) However, it sounds like this post is saying that doing this in the future will cause non-RMT to be banned as well. So, I am asking for clarification on this from the development team/GMs. Does Square Enix intend to ban non-RMT players for requesting in game compensation for time and effort spent? I myself don't feel Fell Cleave party shouts to be any more disrupting than shouts to put together Voidwatch parties or any of the other random server banter. Heck, I would have thought that was the original purpose of shout (to put together groups, make known an offer for item/service, etc...) and that chat filters were added for a reason.

Thanks for your time, and clarification on this would be greatly appreciated.

(Banning for making use of shout to put together parties is silly in my opinion though...)

here's your clarification: they're banning people who shout to sell cleave parties for 500k (where the party is actually actively in progress and they have a bot/agent shouting in town for it). I've tried, and most of these shouters do not respond to anything other than "I'll buy." If you shout for this, you're likely putting your account at risk- but most likely its only aimed at the cleavers who have another character autonomously shouting around the clock.

I see cleave shouts all day long and i do consider it disruptive. Many of these people are RMT, as have been demonstrated by the few I've actually gotten to respond to tells and chat.

Does Square Enix intend to ban non-RMT players for requesting in game compensation for time and effort spent?

You would cleave anyway, inviting someone to leech isn't affecting your time and effort spent. I think the prices people charge for this are insane. You can level to 99 in a couple days with or without a cleave party, so why pay for something you can get for free?

[Kikorimo]

You would cleave anyway, inviting someone to leech isn't affecting your time and effort spent.

On the contrary, I cleave on occasion because people willingly pay gil for it. The only exception is if I'm after key items from boxes, and at that point I am not inviting random people.

but most likely its only aimed at the cleavers who have another character autonomously shouting around the clock.

Yes, it is likely, but at the same time they do not specify "around the clock," they simply make it sound like if you have a mule shouting while you cleave to pick up people, that it's "disrupting" and you "may" be banned for it. As it has already been pointed out, Square Enix does not exactly have a great track record with mass bannings hitting only guilty people.

so why pay for something you can get for free?

I often ask myself this also. I do not have an answer for it short of this; "people do pay for it because they are lazy."

[Alhanelem]

I often ask myself this also. I do not have an answer for it short of this; "people do pay for it because they are lazy."

I don't agree with this on the simple basis that it's already just as effortless to level up in a normal abyssea party, and if you just pick WAR as that job to power level, then you can just do it yourself. I also have to ask myself where the people that are so lazy they can't cleave themselves or join an abyssea party and go AFK get their gil to buy these services.

On many occasions i've seen a BLU or other job AoE burning in abyssea and i've asked to join them in order to get the KI boxes that they'd otherwise be just letting disappear. Most of the time, they happily agree, knowing that everything they aren't specifically after is just going to waste. I get lots of EXP and cruor in the process, and have never had to pay a single gil for it. When you're joining such a person's party, you're having basically zero impact on what they're doing or what they're getting out of it. Therefore, I see no reason to pay for it, nor a reason to charge for it.

Wish I knew where people got all this money to pay FC burns. I never had that much and if I ever will I definitely wouldn't spend it to EXP,

I don't really care how other people get their EXP, but i do think paying gil for it is silly and wonder just as much as you do where their gil is coming from if they're really that lazy.

Square Enix does not exactly have a great track record with mass bannings hitting only guilty people.

I disagree with this statement, but I don't want to open up another can of worms so I won't elaborate on it.

i think it's generally pretty obvious when it's RMT vs when it's not RMT, so I don't think any normal player has anything to worry about.

[Kikorimo]

I also have to ask myself where the people that are so lazy they can't cleave themselves or join an abyssea party and go AFK get their gil to buy these services.

Some of them make gil by mercing out drops from mobs or crafting, and would rather not spend time grinding exp when they can drop some gil on it and come back to level 99. Then all they have to do is work on skills/gear etc. I've known people who make gil easy enough with crafting or doing events that they can obtain high value items from to fund joining a cleave to level up while afk. When I said lazy I meant "lazy in regards to grinding exp", not "stupid and unable to make gil."

On many occasions i've seen a BLU or other job AoE burning in abyssea and i've asked to join them in order to get the KI boxes that they'd otherwise be just letting disappear.

Not saying this doesn't happen, but I know if I'm out cleaving for anything other than gil, it's for KIs, and I bring friends and linkshell members along to hold them all to pop mobs later, or sometimes while the cleave is still going. The last time I did a cleave that was for both gil and KI I even offered people an option. They could either bring some keys and help open boxes (and leech xp for free for doing so) OR they could just pay up front and afk (which 90% of them chose to do.) I myself do not pay for exp either, but I know lots of people who do.

but i do think paying gil for it is silly

I agree with this, but if someone wants to spend gil on it then I'll happily take it from them for doing this. Altana knows I can put it to better use than spending it on xp. (Like buying that new sword or armor piece I've been eyeballing for some time...)

[Calintzpso]

So...I saw like 8-9 keyboard smashed War's and Rdm's yesterday out in West Ronf while leveling my alt's Dragoon.

Either they already got shitcanned/starting over or they are preparing for said shitcanning...

Just thought I'd share.

[Kincard]

You can level to 99 in a couple days with or without a cleave party, so why pay for something you can get for free?

Opportunity cost? It isn't that hard to figure out why someone would want to pay for something they don't have to do on their own. You can get cleaved while you are at work/sleeping, come back and then do other stuff instead of leveling during your actual playtime.

If your LS is, for example, selling NNI drops for 5M a pop or whatever, it isn't that painful to separate with maybe 1.5M or whatever to cleave your character up from 30. Hell, even if I only just made money through Dynamis every day (~1.5M every time solo), I really wouldn't mind trading one of my runs once in a while to get another job to 99.

For the record, I've never paid to cleave up any of my jobs since I do prefer to xp them myself anyway, but it isn't that hard to see why people would prefer doing that instead.

[Alhanelem]

Opportunity cost? It isn't that hard to figure out why someone would want to pay for something they don't have to do on their own. You can get cleaved while you are at work/sleeping, come back and then do other stuff instead of leveling during your actual playtime.

You missed my point that while not every party will let you do this, it's completely possible to do what you describe in an ordinary abyssea party (especially if you're friends with someone in the party)

[Okipuit]

Greetings,

To clarify the situation -- normal players will not get in trouble for advertising power leveling services on their own. We will thoroughly investigate whether or not the users soliciting for the service are affiliated with RMT activity and take action against those that are. However, in the event players are supporting RMT activity and services, there is a possibility of being punished as well. Therefore, we ask users to be careful not to involve themselves in activity that is associated with RMT.