moogle slips overflow

[Nawesemo]

Being able to hold 14 items to hold hundreds? It sounds so awful in comparison, they should do away with them.

Exactly, we're only spoiled if we don't know we're spoiled, some, are grateful though

I do love my moogles.

[Rosalie]

>.> I live and die by these slips. There's no way in hell I'd be able to get by without them anymore.

[Motenten]

With allowance for the extra two jobs, we can say that, for example, slip 10 needs to be able to hold 5 * 22 = 110 items.

Slip 4 needs to be able to hold 6 * 22 items (5 armor, 1 weapon, assuming the new jobs get their standard AF set), so 132 items altogether (though only 120 right now). Similar for relic: 5 armor + 1 accessory per job.

Since that requires an on/off bit for each item stored, we know we need at least 4 32-bit fields to store all the present items, and potentially an additional field for handling the new jobs' armor.

If you tried to store all the armor from all 13 slips in one item, it would need 52 to 65 32-bit fields. Somewhat excessive. Granted, some of them won't need the full expanse of that, but you still need room to expand (eg: can the new NeoLimbus gear be stored in ticket 2? will we be adding all the new Salvage gear to ticket 1 (which has to store both all the sets and all the component pieces, plus Nyzul, etc)?).

Most games of this type might describe item objects with maybe 20 fields at best (probably less), some of which will be reserved for things like item name, icon, status, stack size and so forth.

We also know things like, each piece of armor is limited to storing 5 unique pieces of information (not counting augments). That implies it's probably limited to 5 32-bit fields for 'general data'.

Similarly, it doesn't matter if you have a single ticket that lets you access different storage 'compartments'; you still have flag all those stored items individually, which means you're back at 5 fields per ticket type, and needing 60+ such fields.


In principal it seems like a fairly easy fix: just make an item with tons of storage data on it. In practice, not so much. That item has to be understood by, and tracked/stored/retrieved by, the underlying engine that's been programmed with the data structure design of everything in the game. Introducing something entirely new means not only having to adjust every function that such an object could go through or be manipulated by, but also the memory pressures of storing such objects. The easiest adjustment being to just expand the size of the base object, if you had to triple the size of the data structure, you pretty much just tripled the memory requirements for a huge chunk of the game for a fairly minimal benefit (most objects won't be using all that new empty space), and figuring out how to convert all -existing- objects to the new one, should such a changeover occur.


A different trick would depend on whether the game has the concept of 'inside'. In some other games, if you have a bag to put stuff in, the bag itself is an object, and 'contains' the other items put inside it. You can do fancy trickery by putting one object inside another, but not allowing the player to actually see inside. So, you have a 'global' ticket that holds the 13 individual tickets inside it, and use the flags on the global ticket to indicate which individual tickets are available.

I suspect that's not possible, though, due to the way inventory is managed in the game. The data on each of the sub-tickets would still need to be managed, which means the game has to be aware of them when moving things around, which means it probably runs up against the whole 80*2 item memory limit from the PS2.


.. I think there was some point to this post, but... whatever, just solidifying the probable basis for Okipuit's post.

[Kari]

IMO change slips to be job-specific.
I'd much rather hang on to slips for the jobs I play, and be able to easily manage my gear.

I play ~5 jobs and counting.
When I want to swap to DNC...

NOW:
Store everything related to current job. Cry as I hold on to unaugmented Relic +2
Take out DNC Artifact gear from one slip.
Take out DNC Relic gear from another slip.
Take out DNC Empyrean Accessories from another slip.
Take out DNC Empyrean +2 gear from another slip.
Take out Thaumas gear from another slip.

How it should be:
Take out all DNC gear with one slip.
Take out Thaumas gear with another slip.

There would be more slips, but the average player would be using less, and EVERYONE gets an easier time with the NPC.
Tons of other ideas floating around, one way or another, the Porter Moogle System could be done better.
I also hate that SE is afraid to rework anything.

[Komori]

How would that really be any better? Because then for people who store gear or play all jobs or most of them, they'd have to carry the same amount of up to 20 slips instead of 14?

I don't mind that I have to trade 4 slips to gear up a job, to me. Saying that "I'm tired of having to trade so many slips is so awful" is kind of lazy. Considering how much the slips save you in inventory, I'd rather have 80 slips take up one full bag of inventory than to have to try and make due without slips or without more to do things like accept loose abyssean and voidwatch specific gear, and unaugmented relic, and magian weapons.

[Godofgods]

Being able to hold 14 items to hold hundreds? It sounds so awful in comparison, they should do away with them.

I agree. Their might be quite a few slips, but considering the vast amount of equip they can store, your winning out ten-fold.

On a side note, your only going to get a slip if you have something you can store with it. And even if you only store a single piece for each slip you get, your inventory still equals out the same. Two pieces, you save room. 10-100 pieces, and still complaining? seriously?

[Godofgods]

I don't mind that I have to trade 4 slips to gear up a job, to me. Saying that "I'm tired of having to trade so many slips is so awful" is kind of lazy.

+10

I think ppl have just become too accustomed to the easy of play we are all used to now. Even the best things, like these slips, are being targeted...

[HimuraKenshyn]

Back in my day we had to log to a mule and d box gear both ways. The slips are the best thing they have I rather swap 4 slips then to gear 1 per job and gear set that number would be insane to think about hurts my head. The biggest pain I still have is the number of seals I have to carry to complete sets I am still working on ><;;

[Riggs]

I find it funny that people are prepared to come in here and say how great a system is that is clearly flawed. I want to keep my gear in my mog house where it belongs. The fact that this cannot happen is frankly not good enough, i, like everyone else pays to play this game its not a free mmorpg where you could expect some things to be slightly shoody but not in a game we pay for.

I don't care there is a memory issue, thats not my concern, my concern is that i PAY for this game so it bloody well better work right and if that means re-wright the entire code my answer is so what get on and do it. And as long as people keep coming in here posting crap like how lucky we are that SE are fiving us a half backed service then thats what they will continue to give us.

[Crimson_Slasher]

As a note to Motenten, Slip #8 stores all NQ empyreon armor as well as accessories. With 5 visible pieces and 3 accessories, that totals 8 items per job. 8x20=160. That fits within the 80+80 limits, though it DOES present a possible problem once the Adoulin jobs are added, raising the number needing to be held to 178. Wonder how they will resolve that little problem...