Quote Originally Posted by saevel View Post
As someone with a fully blinged out BLU and RDM (melee and mage varieties) I'm able to compare then two because they both fill the exact same position. If you need pure damage you bring one of the specialist melees, if you need pure healing / support / crowd control then you bring one of those guys. RDM / BLU (melee varieties) are for when you need damage, support and crowd control. In this regard BLU stomps all over RDM, picks it up dusts it off then stomps all over it again. This is mostly due to SE showing BLU lots of love in both the damage and support departments while completely ignoring RDM.

Ex:
Melee BLU (has TA / DWIII natively thus can go /WAR for bergressor / DA / ABI) access to much better WS's and gear selection. Can self SC and use CA and / or Efflux to land 2~3K+ physical damage spells of whatever damage type is needed. Can self Haste / Refresh

Melee RDM (must go /NIN to contribute meaningful damage), limited access to WS's without Almace, limited and restrictive melee and WS gear options. Tons of self buff mitigate this penalty somewhat. Can nuke but bad time vs damage ratio.

Support BLU (while being /WAR) M.Fruit is a cheap cure IV, P.Embrace is a more expensive backup cure that buffs people's attack. White Wind is Curaga III~IV basically. WoP aoe Erase (BY FAR THE MOST IMPORTANT SUPPORT SPELL). Stun spam if needed (HB / SL / TS / WoR). And if all that wasn't enough, BOTH light and dark based aoe CC (Sheep / Flower). Can aoe Haste once per 10m with a 5m haste (longer if merits / gear permits), useful before fights or during NNI.

Support RDM (while being /NIN) Cure III~IV for cures, Regen II for HoT. No status healing and only ST CC's (bind / grav / sleep I / II). 5% More -def then BLU (if they even bother with FR) which is easier to use. Can Haste / Refresh others.

Support RDM (while /SCH) Cure III~IV for cheap cures, Regen II for HoT. Can remove the major status healing but no cheap aoe erase. Haste / Refresh as usual. Slightly better nuking thanks to DA, but still poor when compared to melee.

Seems kinda lop sided huh? Any situation where I could in theory bring a "Melee" RDM I would be better off bringing my BLU, and any situation where I would bring a "Mage" RDM I would be better off bringing my WHM, BLM or SCH. This has left literally zero positions for a RDM to actually exist in FFXI, all they do now is go around making video's while soloing some monster without TH that could better be killed with a group of 3~6 with TH.
This is not true, I know many groups bring RDM over WHM to legion(although I still bring both RDM and WHM to legion) due to RDM offering other aspect WHM doesn't have(CS stun/dia3/refresh2). Although SCH is not skippable due to more stuns and embrava.

BLU's versatility shines in lowman, where RDM shines in legion when versatile mage are needed in an ally and everything is zerged, and rely on cure/stun/def down heavily. Which job has the ability like RDM, that can CS stun when needed, assist cure/stun, refresh2 others, and dia3 everything.

In a standard legion ally setup, (assuming you still keep a WHM to cure instead of RDM)

DDx5 COR SCH x3 BRD PLD THF WHM SMN x4 RDM x1

P.S, some group use 6 SMN, 0 WHM, 1 RDM and 2 SCH instead.

You get 4 PD 1 CS so good protection on 5 NM total. You got dia3+refresh2 and 2 person curing DDs, plus 4 stunners total.
Change that RDM to SMN, you still get protection on 5 NM, but your dia3 down grade to dia2, no refresh 2 for WHM, 3 stunner instead of 4, and only 1 healer in ally(SCH need to focus on stun).

Change RDM to BLU, you get worse stun/def down, and can't cure outside of pt, you can't output melee dmg without PD also.
And BLM isn't used in legion except Hall of An.

Change RDM to 4th SCH, you still don't have dia3/refresh2, and no CS stun either.

Change RDM to 2nd COR or BRD, any 2nd+ COR or BRD doesn't offer much more after 1st unless you need extra reset chance. BRD can sing 3~4 songs and any song after 4th doesn't add much. Doing 4 COR rolls doesn't add a lot more dmg(After chaos/DA roll the only roll left is hunters/regain, which adds very little dmg if acc capped) to melees but it takes 2 more min to do 2 more rolls. As for reset, many groups don't rely on COR reset anymore either.

RDM can also do Impact(which is needed in Mul), although other mages can also cast it, they're often busy with their own task and RDM is the best role to do it. You also need ES for it on some NM, and RDM is the best one to do it since they're subbing BLM already.

Is it possible to "beat" legion with 0 RDM? Probably yes, but it's also possible to beat it with 0 SMN, or MNK x5 instead of Rag DD, or no SCH/BRD/COR at all. Not to mention I tend to use RDM roll in Mul on SCH since Mul mobs resists stun easily, and having RDM in pt helps.


The fact is, having a RDM in legion ally, brings much more to the table than no RDM. Change that RDM to any other job, it doesn't offer much more than having an RDM in ally. It just doesn't.

So there is your RDM's own thunder and room for jack of all trade mage. It's a versatile "mage" that shines in event like legion. Like how BLU is versatile "1h melee" that shines in lowman against EP/DC mobs. They're different, works differently, and shines in different area. You bring BLU to dyna/salvage/nyzul/Abby/old HNM and so on, when you only have 2~3 ppl in pt, and BLU can cover multiple roles when pt size so small. I don't understand why everyone is jealous(?) of BLU, when BLU can't even get into legion ally.

RDM doesn't need more melee ability, it should stay as a mage with unique aspect that you'd need in event such as legion. RDM also covers multiple aspect in ally, stun/cure/CS/dia3/refresh2/impact, and other debuff when PD is down, which works very well in legion. Not to mention 2nd wave ironclad in Mul and 1st wave sandworm in Muru is total dick to deal with without CS.