The Problem with Red Mage . . .

[Nawesemo]

Me neither!!!! Other than the Q.Q'ing about gear rdm cant wear and irreversable me rdm hear me roar of the days past attitudes, rdm played well makes noise, rdm doing what a rdm shouldn't, yeah, your going to get sub par results.

[Daniel_Hatcher]

Me neither!!!! Other than the Q.Q'ing about gear rdm cant wear and irreversable me rdm hear me roar of the days past attitudes, rdm played well makes noise, rdm doing what a rdm shouldn't, yeah, your going to get sub par results.

Now your trolling is getting annoying and boring at the same time, bravo!

Can't you go elsewhere now.

[Tamarsamar]

*sigh*

Guys, Internet 101: don't feed the trolls.

I seriously would've expected you guys to know better than to keep feeding for two pages continuously.

As thread OP, may I beseech the mods to not lock this thread, but to remove all of Nawesemo's quite destructive posts from it?

[Nawesemo]

*sigh, net 102 never disagree with anyone because after the in group feels threatened, they'll all throw down the troll card.. sound about right? Rdm again is geared more towards a mage support Hybrid, Blu its opposite, like a Whm to a Blm, a Sch to a dnc.... And bottom line, yall want to do what what your opposite does better than you. We all make these trades. but me saying that is "zomg troooooolllll" he dont agree DELETE HIM!!!!! Lol. Brillliant.

[Nawesemo]

Meh, w/e floats your boat, trolling me won't change how s.e. designed rdm, its pretty clear to me at least, some accept their a duck, others wandering around babbling about how they hate the goose, and the swans get more attention....but in the end strive to be the best duck they can.... En spell up, throw together the best you can and go put in work, its still not going to get rdm into front line dd slots on anything meaningful, rdm has its place, you exploit its strengths, or ..... Yeah, hate the goose. Either way, better gear isn't going to make you happier, its just going to enrage you more over how its not good enough, ......love your rdm, be a rdm, stop wanting to be a swan. Or not, my attitude ..... Lol if you only knew.

[Nawesemo]

That's funny, considering aside from your edit, I'm the only one continuously writing about rdm.

[Demon6324236]

A very simple way to tell you how this would not break balance. RDM getting some of BLU's gear for melee does not change the fact RDM has no native Dual Wield, meaning for good damage it needs to be /DNC or /NIN. BLU on the other hand can get a ton of traits from spells set, now this includes Dual Wield(upto III, same level as /NIN), Attack Bonus, Accuracy Bonus, Store TP, Double Attack, Triple Attack, Zanshin, and with all of this to choose from if they wish, they can also go with /WAR, giving Berserk, a massive boost to attack. RDM even with BLU's melee gear would be weaker than a BLU in traits and subjob options. It would not be unbalancing because of this, RDM's melee would still be weaker a BLU's melee would still be more open and stronger if set for it.

You keep saying we want to super DD, no, I want to be closer to a BLU in terms of damage with a sword. Do I want to play BLU? No, does it mean I want to play BLU? No, they are completely different jobs, changing RDM to have better melee gear more on par with BLU does not mean RDM = BLU or that I want to play BLU instead. I simply look at my gear, look at my abilities, and wish to see mine grow closer to the job that is like RDM, a hybrid. You keep saying that it will break balance or that RDM would be to powerful, but the truth is, we would just be stronger than now, and weaker than a BLU focusing on melee.

You know why people are saying your a troll? Not because people disagree with you, and want you gone. Its because every time you post you say something that comes across as "I saw your words, but didn't actually understand them, so instead I will just tell you its unbalanced and would be terrible if this were done!" you keep saying the same BS that we apparently want, but we say we don't, like DDing better than a WAR, which unless I missed something and RDM's DD power is right behind a WAR's, giving RDM some of BLU's gear isn't going to magically put RDM past WAR and make RDM the best DD in the game.

[Nawesemo]

Fair enough, I do think rdm melees fine, can do enough dmg with what is at their disposal, and that using blu as a notch to reach, or as comparison is just not good enough reason to add to an otherwise very adaptable job. The good things blu does have are seriously countered by their limited spell selection, seting them etc..... Rdm suffers none of that. We disagree. Np there. The gap was never there though. Rdm gear adding to a Rdms survivablity , damage in my opinion would put rdm on hhe Omg solo level they once had, and I think, yall just want it back.

[Ophannus]

To an extent, RDM's DD potential is still good compared to other mages. I think that's where SE is content with leaving RDM for damage dealing.

Mage melee hierarchy
BLU(Thaumas, A- skill, native DW3 and Triple Attack,self haste,Almace)
RDM(Almace,20% DA from Temper,self haste, enspells,gain-str, dia III)
BRD(Twashtar/Mandau, Hecatomb gear,evisceration/exenterator,augmented sky gear,marches,)
WHM(Mjollnir, decent haste gear,auspice,hexa strike,boost-str, dia II)
BLM(Only putting them above SCH and SMN cuz they can use daggers and evisceration)
SMN(Avatar Favors can give good melee bonuses, Shattersoul is great)
SCH(Self SC with their spells, Firestorm, Shattersoul)

So when it comes to mages, RDM is one of the best meleers, it's just that when you compare us to dedicated melees, we're terrible, which makes sense cuz we can also cure, debuff and nuke whereas melees specialize in melee.

Actually BRD could potentially out damage RDM in pure melee just because of gear selection(They can evisceration/exenterator with hecatomb/genbu/seiryu gear and gets plenty of other haste gear and DW from Kirin's Osode) and give themselves close to capped magic haste too.

[ManaKing]

Wow you guys are still on this and you a beating a guy up for 2 pages because he makes the point 'that just because BLU has something doesn't mean that RDM should have it too'.

Well guess what, he's right. BLU isn't RDM, nor does it play like RDM. Duh. You guys even said that. You're comparing apples to oranges and saying that because oranges prevent scurvy, so should apples. Well too bad, they don't. If you want RDM to play like BLU, gear like BLU, or get favored like BLU, THEN TOO BAD. IT'S NOT BLU. IT'S RDM.

BLU has an awesome bag of tricks that is pretty consistently described as over powered for a 1 Hander. It is significantly stronger than almost every other 1 Hander. RDM is pretty well balanced for a 1 Hander. 1 Handers are in a bad spot as a generalization. That is the problem. If they ever buff 1 Handers, they will have to nerf BLU.

RDM has a bag of tricks too. But instead of enjoying the more recent improvements over gear for WS and TP, you point at BLU and get jealous. STOP IT. It's sad and makes you looks foolish. RDM has spells to enhance it's potential. If you want RDM to be better and actually be a RDM then it needs more enhancing magic. I'm much happier to have Temper than BLU gear. You don't hear BLU talking about not having Temper or an Excalibur. And if you do, then they are idiots, because those are aren't their toys.

Lusting for gear, when gear can change all the time is foolish. Temper is here to stay. Gains are here to stay. BLU gets some new spells constantly and gear. Have fun changing things out all the time and not being able to use all of your spells. No thanks, that's not my character and I have no interest in playing that job.

You can TP in almost 50% double attack. Almost no one else can do that. WARs aren't crying that they don't get temper, because it wouldn't make any sense for them to have magic. Appreciate what you have. Diversity. If you want to be a damage specialist, don't play the generalist.

I'm still of the opinion that our Melee is fine for a 1 Hander. 1 Hander damage isn't ok, but that is a different subject. Our gear is good, not the best, because we aren't the best and our gear is the reason we aren't. It makes sense. Our Sore Spot is our lack of new magic, nuking potency, and job traits/abilities. If you want to tell me that we should get new gear that adds a small amount of triple attack to Temper, then I'm all for it. But crying over a Thaumas Coat is not something I'll shed tears for. Please compare RDM at 85~90 VS lvl 99. Appreciate it.