FFXI fixed!

[Ragmar]

Another troll another day.

#1 Click Ragmar
#2 Add to Ignore List
#3 ???
#4 Profit!

Coming from someone who promotes RDM melee I don't mind a bit. I wouldn't want you to hurt yourself and all.

[Trisscar]

Coming from someone who promotes RDM melee I don't mind a bit. I wouldn't want you to hurt yourself and all.

Okay, let's turn this troll thread into something actually productive... What is wrong about melee Red Mage? How is it any more wrong than melee White Mage?

[Ragmar]

You're asking for a challenge, yet when someone points out methods for you to have the very challenge you seek, that person doesn't understand it? As I said, this game is as easy or hard as the player wishes to make it. The variable difficulty you're seeking is right in front of you, use it if you so desire.

And again you are missing the point. There is no challenge in abyssea without cruor buffs ... You would get one shotted left and right with all possible job buffs because the mobs damage output is designed around a WAR having 3000 HP not 1600. Somehow I fear myself and others could repeat this same point a thousand times and you would still fail to understand it. This might be a viable option if you recieved the HP from cruor buffs without getting the +50 to stats that also come with cruor buffs but you can't it's not an option. I guess you could argue using PD in abyssea to avoid getting one shotted but thats part of what I'd love to see SE go away from. I don't want to have to PD/Embrava/Zerg everything in game. I want challenges that require teamwork and players who know their jobs role in a party/alliance/setting. I want to fail if someone makes critical mistakes or atleast for it to be very hard to recover. Even at 75 with HNMs if a holding party messed up they would lose claim. I saw many a 10-12 man Faf go very badly from casting on darters. I'm not saying take anything away from easy mode players Id just like to see slightly better rewards for players who challenge themselves by not using Embrava/PD/Zerg/Temp items/non job buffs.

[Connavarr]

And again you are missing the point. There is no challenge in abyssea without cruor buffs ... You would get one shotted left and right with all possible job buffs because the mobs damage output is designed around a WAR having 3000 HP not 1600. Somehow I fear myself and others could repeat this same point a thousand times and you would still fail to understand it. This might be a viable option if you recieved the HP from cruor buffs without getting the +50 to stats that also come with cruor buffs but you can't it's not an option. I guess you could argue using PD in abyssea to avoid getting one shotted but thats part of what I'd love to see SE go away from. I don't want to have to PD/Embrava/Zerg everything in game. I want challenges that require teamwork and players who know their jobs role in a party/alliance/setting. I want to fail if someone makes critical mistakes or atleast for it to be very hard to recover. Even at 75 with HNMs if a holding party messed up they would lose claim. I saw many a 10-12 man Faf go very badly from casting on darters. I'm not saying take anything away from easy mode players Id just like to see slightly better rewards for players who challenge themselves by not using Embrava/PD/Zerg/Temp items/non job buffs.

Oh, really? It can't be done eh? I take it you haven't seen the vids of a melee RDM soloing Azdaja without any cruor buffs or atmas used. Try again.

Also, you need to realize it is the playerbase, not SE, that chooses to use the "easy button", the whole "optimal" set-up or don't bother. It is a fact that the players can beat Abyssea NM's without cruor buffs and atmas. It is a fact that the playerbase can achieve floor 100 clears in Neo-Nyzul without 4x pimped DD's and 2x SCH's for Embrava. It is a fact that the playerbase can beat VW NM's without atmacites/cruor buffs. It is also a fact that the playerbase CHOOSES to use these things, not for a challenge, but to increase the odds of winning. Or, ya know, we hit the "easy button" in order to quickly obtain the gear we desire.

You want a challenge? Stop hitting the easy button that's built in to damn near every event this game has. Stop using optimal set-ups for everything and you'll have the challenge you're after. It may take you longer to get 5/5 Nyzul gear, but you can in fact do it. Don't bitch to me about a lack of difficulty when it is the playerbase that are the ones using the button in the first place.

In regards to the rewards, what Trisscar said.

[Ragmar]

Okay, let's turn this troll thread into something actually productive... What is wrong about melee Red Mage? How is it any more wrong than melee White Mage?

I mean really if you have to ask ...

[Ragmar]

Oh, really? It can't be done eh? I take it you haven't seen the vids of a melee RDM soloing Azdaja without any cruor buffs or atmas used. Try again.

Also, you need to realize it is the playerbase, not SE, that chooses to use the "easy button", the whole "optimal" set-up or don't bother. It is a fact that the players can beat Abyssea NM's without cruor buffs and atmas. It is a fact that the playerbase can achieve floor 100 clears in Neo-Nyzul without 4x pimped DD's and 2x SCH's for Embrava. It is a fact that the playerbase can beat VW NM's without atmacites/cruor buffs. It is also a fact that the playerbase CHOOSES to use these things, not for a challenge, but to increase the odds of winning. Or, ya know, we hit the "easy button" in order to quickly obtain the gear we desire.

You want a challenge? Stop hitting the easy button that's built in to damn near every event this game has. Stop using optimal set-ups for everything and you'll have the challenge you're after. It may take you longer to get 5/5 Nyzul gear, but you can in fact do it. Don't bitch to me about a lack of difficulty when it is the playerbase that are the ones using the button in the first place.

In regards to the rewards, what Trisscar said.

You fail to understand why RDM can solo like that. If you think other jobs have that level of utility you are highly mistaken. WAR flat cant mitigate damage like that RDM. NIN can't either. Learn a little about RDM solo before you use it as a crutch to bolster your defense. Imma bet you are still on the lower tiers of VW if you think you are going to beat, lets say Bismark, without atmacite and temp items. Hell even with a lot of people still fail really hard on some VW NMs they arent all the joke nation T4's are.

[Trisscar]

I mean really if you have to ask ...

Yeah, I do have to ask. I don't have Red Mage leveled to 99 and I know practically nothing about it. So educate me.

[Arcon]

Okay, let's turn this troll thread into something actually productive... What is wrong about melee Red Mage? How is it any more wrong than melee White Mage?

They're both right, unless they wanna melee during a tough fight an alliance. Then they're both wrong. As long as they don't fuck up other peoples' plans, people can do whatever they want.

[Demon6324236]

And again you are missing the point. There is no challenge in abyssea without cruor buffs ... You would get one shotted left and right with all possible job buffs because the mobs damage output is designed around a WAR having 3000 HP not 1600.

Bullshit. There is a great RDM on Odin who has soloed many Abyssea NMs without cruor buffs or atma, this is a RDM soloing. Your telling me you think partys of people couldn't kill them because of this? Just a few examples are him soloing Hedjedjet that way, and Azdaja. If he can kill these, which are some of the harder NMs in Abyssea, solo, without cruor buffs or atma, then just how hard would it be with a proper party?

Your 1st post said...

Perhaps lock 2 hours and non job buffs (atma/atmacite/temp items) to set the highest level removing the PD/Zerg which has become the only real end game strategy. This would perhaps bring back tanking, an aspect of the game that has become holding adds while others zerged.

Are you talking about new content that would be this way? Or some setting that just removed the ability to gain a bonus from these effects? If its the latter than

simply choose not to use Atma's/Cruor buffs/Temps/Atmacites for VW/Abyssea. Do Neo=nyzul without a SCH for Embrava.

And with that, you have exactly what you asked for, because you now do not have those. If things are so easy then make it harder on yourself. If you had a difficulty setting then it would be no different at all, you would still have the choice, use buffs, make things easier, or leave them out of the picture, and you can try to fight without them, and make it harder as you wish.

The idea of having better rewards is stupid, that just makes it sound like you want to have some "pro" gear so you can show it off and gloat about it. Rewards should be equal, if you simply want the game harder, so be it, you have the ability to make it harder, rewards should not be different because you choose to do so. You want the game to be more fun for those of which want it harder, thats exactly what you can do, but if its only for fun then the rewards should not make much difference in the end, your enjoyment is what should matter, thus it is what you should get.

As for this argument...

I said this in a previous post, and I'll say it again: There is a HUGE difference between hard content where you need to be an exceptional player to succeed, and purposefully gimping yourself to make content 'artificially' harder for you.

Not really, thats exactly what the OP made the idea sound like for the "hardcore" difficulty, that cruor buffs, atma, atmacite, Abyssite, and temp items, would be unavailable to the player. This simply means, don't use them, and ta da, you got what you asked for. As I said and pointed out earlier this post, people can solo Abyssea NMs, thats not to bad. People have soloed VWNMs as well, such as the Bastok T4, is it a T6 Jeuno? No, but thats where your lovely idea to come up with new strats comes in, work it, improvise! People solo what is talked about being uber hard in these threads without buffs, the simple thing is if people are soloing this, you can do it with a party and probably win if you get a good strat for it, but no one tries, because no one really wants it. You want them to weaken the NMs as well I suppose? Well that doesn't help because then your getting weaker NMs, and it becomes easier.



Short version:People solo what is supposedly to hard for a party to kill without super buffs, suck it up, you can have hard mode all you want already, its right there, just stop acting like it isn't an option.

[Ragmar]

Fine I'll entertain you. RDM lacks DD gear even though it can hit a 25-26% haste build (great for stun recast though). The plain and simple fact is the best RDM or WHM melee would lose a parse to a Perle WAR SAM or DRK in any parse all other things similar. So if you give a spot to a RDM (even an excal or almace) with all the best gear available for a melee build you would have still been better off bringing that 5/5 resolution WAR in perle and a swift belt. I've seen the best geared Melee RDMs try on NMs like Bot Rex or Ig Alima and they couldnt break 5% in the parse. It'd be like bringing a WAR/WHM with refresh atma's to abyssea as a main healer. Sure with the right atma/gear you might keep someone alive spamming cure 4's but its obviously not a good idea. RDM melee might not make you lose a fight but its certainly not going to help you win either. WHM has even less practical EG usage but this should be really obvious.