Do you really think that little of your player base?

[Theytak]

What's sad is that the reason SE doesn't clarify what they mean when they say something would "go against balance" or when they give some sort of nonsensical gibberish and pretend it's a logical reason they can't do something, it's not done because we wouldn't actually be able to understand their logic/reasoning anyway, but rather, it's done because we would understand it, and we would be able to quickly prove their logic faulty and/or entirely fallacious. I imagine the usual process goes something like this:

"Hey guys, the players say they want you to do [random incredibly helpful thing we've needed done for years]"
"Hmmm, as nice as that would be for them, we can't, because it would negatively impact [random completely arbitrary issue that a sudden change in would not actually negatively or positively impact the game in any way] because of [spaghetti code/ps2 limitations/some other silly reason], so we can't."
"Well, yea, but we can't tell them that, they'd know it's a load of horseshit in a second and riot on us..."
"Let's flip a coin. Heads, we tell them we're 'thinking about it, but it's not a very high priority,' tails we tell them 'While we understand why the players would like this, we feel that it would unbalance [some other random thing, completely unrelated to the actual issue, but related to the proposed change], and that's something we'd like to avoid.'"
*the coin is flipped*
"Looks like it's tails. Go ahead and give the reps our 'answer' so we can move on to something more important. Who's up for a Tetra Master Tourney?"

This is what Balance amounts to as it stands:

B - bullshit
A - aimed
L - largely
A - at
N - negating
C - constructive
E - endeavors

So... perfect...

[Luvbunny]

LOL totally agree with you on this. I mean granted they have been operating in a bare bones crew in the past few years, and you cannot do much with the little resource they have. I am at least glad they churned out these many updates in the past few years. I know it's hard to please everyone. When those abyssea haters complaint on how easy it is to get rewarded and suddenly everyone in the same level playing field, they gave us Voidwatch. These same people yet complaint again that it is random luck based, now not everyone is getting it, it is not fair blah blah blah. They revamped Walk of Echoes, still the same people complaint it is too accessible, and nobody but the japanese actually do this event. They gave us Legion which is like very old school, the same people complaint it is too hard. All the neo contents released, no one else touched it since you have to cheat to win them somehow, lol. Now we are back at Abyssea and Voidwatch again.

[FrankReynolds]

To put this in laymen terms:

If I walk into every single thread and say " You can't do that. It would mess up the game." and rarely, if ever offer any explanation as to why, other than "balance suckaz!" - Players will report me for adding nothing to the thread and generally trying to instigate a flame war. I will be temp banned.

Yet if a community rep / dev / ceo waltzes into the pup thread labeled "please add more spells to X frame" and says "hey guys! just wanted to let you know that we aren't adding a new ranged attack attachment because BaRaNcE!" (note that this info is not related to the discussion).

Somehow this is okay?...

That is the problem.

Not only are most of the posts only vaguely related to the topic of discussion, but they are almost always so vague that they cause massive amounts of unnecessary confusion and debate.

[Modoru]

Don't forget they're on vay-cay~

[Camiie]

Don't forget they're on vay-cay~

They must be on a constant vacation then because it's no different than when they're supposedly in the office.

[Caketime]

I didn't. Never. I said he has the definition of "game" wrong. If he enjoys doing this stuff, all power to him. And guess what, I actually enjoy it too, within reason. I did a lot of testing on a lot of things, and figuring this stuff out is fun to me, but that does not mean it's what this game is supposed to be.

How can you even say any of these things? This is not your game, you just play it. Like it or not, that's the way it is. The developers have always been vague about how things function, it's what they do. They're providing you with a service and you're asking for proprietary information that you have no right to.

I'm calling you a child because you're incoherent and you don't know how to argue. You say I'm contradicting myself but don't bring any arguments for it. You call me whining that I'm not getting every detail, when that was never what I said or wanted. You either have a reading comprehension disability, or you're just stubborn and don't know how to argue properly. I always assume the latter unless I have sufficient proof that the person I'm talking to is stupid enough to assume the former.

I'm guessing you wanted me to quote your posts in more detail and point out exactly where you're whining, but your posts are just so full of tears I don't know where to begin. They also contain a lot of condescending comments implying that others around you are either children or less intelligent than yourself, take a look if you don't believe me. Is that what makes you good at arguing, imagining that you're arguing with a child? Hmm.

I know. I don't intend to sue them for fraud or anything. This is a request for them to loosen up a bit about the details. We're not bitching because we feel entitled. We're asking because it would make playing the game a more enjoyable experience. Kids are usually not aware of the difference between the two things, so I don't blame you for confusing them.

You can't always get what you want~
You can't always get what you want~
No you can't always get what you want~
But if you try sometime, you just might find
You'll get what you need~

[Arcon]

How can you even say any of these things? This is not your game, you just play it. Like it or not, that's the way it is. The developers have always been vague about how things function, it's what they do. They're providing you with a service and you're asking for proprietary information that you have no right to.

My reply to this is in my last paragraph that you quoted. Consult that for further reference.

I'm guessing you wanted me to quote your posts in more detail and point out exactly where you're whining, but your posts are just so full of tears I don't know where to begin.

At least you know when to concede.

They also contain a lot of condescending comments implying that others around you are either children or less intelligent than yourself, take a look if you don't believe me. Is that what makes you good at arguing, imagining that you're arguing with a child? Hmm.

Duh. I never disputed that I was condescending towards you. I'm like that towards snotty brats. Your random and overly zealous use of memes (even in your username) and shameful attempts at trolling suggest that you're either mentally challenged or a child, because no one else actually thinks that's funny. As I said in the quoted section, I'd hate to assume the first, so out of politeness I assume the latter.

You can't always get what you want~
You can't always get what you want~
No you can't always get what you want~
But if you try sometime, you just might find
You'll get what you need~

Exactly.

[Demon6324236]

You can't always get what you want~
You can't always get what you want~
No you can't always get what you want~
But if you try sometime, you just might find
You'll get what you need~

What do we want? GEO/RNF to use Emp/Relic weapons.
What do we need? The reason why balance prevents this.
This may not be the exact topic here but it an example, we know what we want, but we need a reason why, or else it seems like complete and utter BS to us, and we just assume the devs are to lazy or foolish to be able to implement what we are asking for. More than 75% of the time when we are told no about something we want, our reason is balance, we need a real honest to god answer to set our minds at rest however.

[FrankReynolds]

How can you even say any of these things? This is not your game, you just play it. Like it or not, that's the way it is. The developers have always been vague about how things function, it's what they do. They're providing you with a service and you're asking for proprietary information that you have no right to.

You can't always get what you want~
You can't always get what you want~
No you can't always get what you want~
But if you try sometime, you just might find
You'll get what you need~

Did you really just break out in song during an argument to prove that your not a child? Never mind, don't answer that.

This is not proprietary information that we are asking for. No one is asking for game code so that they can go build a test server. We'r asking about things that have to do with game play. If I ask EA why I can't throw a 110 MPH curve ball in their latest baseball game, their gonna say "Because that's a stupid fast curve ball and no one will be able to hit it. That would be crazy." They aren't going to go "Because if we did that it would affect the hot dog vendors in the stands. Balance! herpaderp.".

When we ask why dnc isn't on mandau, we get "We would have to make it weaker for all the jobs.".

That explanation is intentionally vague and suggests that there really is no reason, so they made one up. If it wasn't BS, they would have said "We would have to make it weaker for all the jobs because x x x ."


And knock it off with the "They don't have to tell you anything" stuff. They opened a forum and asked for input. They are getting free QA testers and massive amounts of feedback. They can answer a few questions.

[Caketime]

Duh. I never disputed that I was condescending towards you. I'm like that towards snotty brats. Your random and overly zealous use of memes (even in your username) and shameful attempts at trolling suggest that you're either mentally challenged or a child, because no one else actually thinks that's funny. As I said in the quoted section, I'd hate to assume the first, so out of politeness I assume the latter.

So what if I am mentally challenged? You want to fight about it? If that were indeed the case, what would you have accomplished by pointing it out other than being an incredible asshole? You never know who you're talking to on the internet, I could very well be a mental patient, an obnoxious college student, or even your mother.

That aside, the point still stands that the developers don't have to tell you anything about how the game works. Request, beg, demand, whine all you like it's all the same. At the end of the day they're going to troll both of us harder than ever before over the next year, and we're both going to like it. I might even venture to sy that the entire community is mental in some way, as we continue to play this game in spite of many completely ridiculous things that transpire. Now finish up your sandwich and scoot off to bed, you've got School in the morning.