New 2-hour Abilities

[Return1]

You already knew it wasn't gonna steal /ees/etc unless you were retarded.

Stealing Astral does nothing for you and is pretty fail defensively. You can either sleep an avatar or the avatar was instant summoned putting it in the aforementioned group.

Meikyo is a waste of the ability. Sorry but 3, likely unstacked, WSes on THF is a waste of a two hour. Meikyo is also a pretty lame mob two-hour for the most part.

Lets be serious here. The best offensive use of this ability is stealing Mighty Strikes/Hundred Fists, and the best defensive uses were stealing Manafont/Chainspell. This is how it was before, and this is how it is still.

[Pebe]

idk it still seems pretty good to me.

Can steal:
Mighty Strikes (this is huge)
Hundred Fists
Manafont(this usually causes the mob to continually cast so this could also be big)
Chainspell(same as above)
Perfect Dodge
Invincible
Soul Eater
Soul Voice
Azure Lore
Tabula Rasa
Trance

What can't be stolen:
Benediction (this one sucks)
Familiar (not really a big deal, not many beastmaster monsters in the game that actually even use this to worry about. usually the pet can be slept)
Eagle Eye Shot (this one can be painful, but easily avoidable if prepared)
Meikyo Sishui - its a shame this can't be stolen, but the only devastating mobs that come to mind that use this is the mantis in legion, AV, and ADL. The most dangerous of the 3 is probably adl because all the mantis tps moves can be stunned, and if you are doing AV non-zerg method your pld should be able to withstand 3 of his tp moves.
Call Wyvern - ... no one cars about this one XD
Mijin Gakure - this one is devastating
Astral Flow - for 99% of mobs that use this their are easy ways around this. (enfeebling the pet). The only things this effects are the few monster of insta-summon the avatars when this move goes off.
Wild Card + Overdrive - are their even anything that uses these besides the genkai fights?

So being able to disable Manafont, Chainspell, Mighty Strikes, Hundred fists and Blood Weapon is massive, as the majority of mobs that uses 2hrs use these 2hrs. There are not to many Ninja and RNG endgame NMs. The only ones that come to mind are Gulool Ja Ja and Medusa and I guess AV but he is everything. The other main 2hr most NMs get is meikyo Shisui and its a shame we can't disable it with thf's new 2hr but being able to disable 5 or the 6 main 2hrs that most NMs use is massive. The NM's suck too with their insta summon but they are few and far between.

[SpankWustler]

Given how the Development Bros roll, I'm willing to bet a stolen Mikey's Shih Tzu would just inflict the inability to gain TP without the 300 that activating the ability triggers. So not being able to steal Mikey's Shih Tzu, specifically, is probably something to be happy about.

Still, this new SP is pretty situational in the first place, though it is epic in some situations; I don't blame people for taking an occasion to complain over something minor.

[Mefuki]

I thought were we happy with these 3 Sps. Granted, it's situational but as long as it has a situation where it's useful, it has it's place. As a career BLU, I know a lot about being given things that don't even have one situational use. (How I wish I could convince the devs to adjust those spells..)

And, really, isn't/wasn't that really the problem we have/had with the RDM SP2 and the BST SP2 respectively? There's no place for them in the game as it stands so it's functionally useless. And that, I think, is what bothers people the most. What's the point of adding and spending dev time/testing on something so worthless? Something that no one will use outside of wanting to see the animation?

I think we have to remember that these abilities are going to have their timers cut in half and then meritable down to 30 minutes. My perdiction is that the SPs, both 1 and 2, are going to become a greater part of everyday playing as opposed to the "too good to use/save it for later" category of skills. (I realize that most of the SPs are already not seen that way but I find that people just tend to ignore them entirely and people will certainly feel encouraged to burn their SPs with lowered timers.) Therefore, I think that desiring all the SPs to be game breaking, given their new timers, might be a little skewed.

Maybe we're thinking with a "2 hour" mind set, so to speak, as opposed to the SPs becoming part of our repertoire with our other job abilities. Not all of our job abilities are useful all the time and that's fine. So long as they serve at least one function, as long as there's a situation where you'd say to yourself, "You know what'd be good here...?" then that's sufficient.

(That said, I understand THFs wanting something really special given that they're constantly told, essentially, "You have TH so NO.")

[Arcon]

I'm sadly starting to agree here. Astral Flow seemed like one of the BIG 2hr's you'd bring a THF to steal, just in case things are taking a turn for the worst.

Astral Flow was never going to be stolen, because it's instant in all cases. I am a bit surprised about Meikyo Shusui though, I always assumed it was an actual buff and worked like the player version. I guess SAM is a bit special, and not for the first time either, if you look at Meditate. Kind of a bummer, but I'll live. I still love it.

[Calatilla]

You already knew it wasn't gonna steal /ees/etc unless you were retarded.

Stealing Astral does nothing for you and is pretty fail defensively. You can either sleep an avatar or the avatar was instant summoned putting it in the aforementioned group.

Meikyo is a waste of the ability. Sorry but 3, likely unstacked, WSes on THF is a waste of a two hour. Meikyo is also a pretty lame mob two-hour for the most part.

Lets be serious here. The best offensive use of this ability is stealing Mighty Strikes/Hundred Fists, and the best defensive uses were stealing Manafont/Chainspell. This is how it was before, and this is how it is still.

I never liked the SP to begin with, and that was before they confirmed it was worse than originally thought. Mighty strikes is nice yea but they could have just given us 100% triple attack for 30seconds. Hundred Fists isnt all that good anyway, a properly buffed THF (yea i know, wtf is that) can hit just as fast anyway.

Manafont isn't even dangerous, it doesn't send the mob into a crazed spell cast frenzie, that's what chainspell is, but if you're in Legion wouldn't you have sch/blm`s to stun lock it down anyway?

SE refuse to improve on THF by stating everything is overpowered because it has the ultimate job trait, Treasure Hunter. I just wanted something that benefited the THF, and I don't see how this does that.

Since this ability is useless on all but 4 2hr abilities, they should put 30 seconds of Amnesia added effect onto it. But I guess that will be too over powered as well.

[ManaKing]

If it's an instant SP, THF should just put that ability on cooldown. It's not rocket science. Make the ability not crap so people can use it without looking at what other people have and crying.

What if the mob has access to multiple SPs? OMG! so difficult! Either flip a coin or give the ability a priority list. I personally opt for flip a coin.

If someone wants to argue that this improvement would make it too good or unbalanced, then make the cool down for the stolen ability 5 minutes. Still not convinced? You probably don't play THF or this game for that matter.

ALSO....
RDM STILL SUCKS. WE HAVEN'T FORGOTTEN. FIX IT BY GIVING US THE FIRST SP ABILITY BUT WITH THE IMPROVEMENTS WE ASKED FOR AND ADD THE ENFEEBLING ONE ON TO SABOTEUR.

[Arcon]

If it's an instant SP, THF should just put that ability on cooldown. It's not rocket science.

I have no idea what you mean by that. Using it preemptively to prevent a mob from using their SP ability?

What if the mob has access to multiple SPs? OMG! so difficult! Either flip a coin or give the ability a priority list. I personally opt for flip a coin.

I have even less of an idea what you mean by this. Flip a coin for what? Are you suggesting to change the entire ability from stealing an SP ability to preventing one? I wouldn't mind that either, but it would result in an entirely different ability. I have no idea how you got to this from where we are now.

[Pebe]

When I said manafont makes the mob casts more i meant that when manafont is activated I think a lower spell recast timer is given to mob so they cast more often. Although I haven't paid much attention lately so idk, but I think this is how it works.

[Mirage]

Spells have individual recast timers, but mob combat scripts also have an "x spells per y time" thing in them, which usually leads to something like 30 second pause at least between spell casts. During manafont, this is lowered to a lot less, possibly removed entirely, but the mob still can't cast the same spell back to back.