New 2-hour Abilities

[SNK]

I can honestly say that I'll never use this two hour on BST.

[Cljader1]

If you don't see the zerg benefit to being able to WS every 2 swings I can understand why you get moved out of the DD party. This is a solid 2 hour that not only increases DRKs damage output but carries a decent utility. The duration will probably be increased via merits and it will be even better.

That's not true, you don't know what SE is going to do with merits or if we will even get 2hr merits, SE make lots of promises that we have yet to see. What about drk being turned into a tp-tank, where the drk uses 2hr and is ordered to "melees only" to babysit the mobs tp while other dd's perform the zerg, like sam uses its 2hr and war uses its 2hr. Drks would be banned from uses any ws's during its 2hr and regulated to tp control. Against mobs like ADL drk wont be allowed to use any wss, out of fear of replenishing his TP, and losing a drain cycle. Linkshells will say drk 2hr "melee only" and if your not allowed to weaponskill than that not a zerg. If SE allows ws's to also tp-drain then linkshells and alliances could not do this.

[Theytak]

That's not true, you don't know what SE is going to do with merits or if we will even get 2hr merits, SE make lots of promises that we have yet to see. What about drk being turned into a tp-tank, where the drk uses 2hr and is ordered to "melees only" to babysit the mobs tp while other dd's perform the zerg, like sam uses its 2hr and war uses its 2hr. Drks would be banned from uses any ws's during its 2hr and regulated to tp control. Against mobs like ADL drk wont be allowed to use any wss, out of fear of replenishing his TP, and losing a drain cycle. Linkshells will say drk 2hr "melee only" and if your not allowed to weaponskill than that not a zerg. If SE allows ws's to also tp-drain then linkshells and alliances could not do this.

I thought it was pretty clear that you don't drain TP if you're at 300% TP. Did I misread that? No linkshell is going to say "drk melee only" unless the leaders are so inept that they don't realize how the drk throwing out a couple extra resolutions during the duration of the 2hour is going to both keep help kill shit faster. Besides, regain ticks are every 3 seconds, so regain alone won't be able to out pace this 2hour unless it's 100TP/tick, because you're still going to swing again before the next regain tick to shave off whatever the melees gave it after you WS'd. You're splitting hairs and bitching for the sake of bitching, and it's really quite insulting to the rest of us who didn't get one of the 2-3 useful abilities, and quite distracting to the thread as a whole.

[Raucent]

incorrect actually Abs-TP still works even at 300 TP. learned from helping ls on multiple Glavoid runs

[Demon6324236]

I thought it was pretty clear that you don't drain TP if you're at 300% TP. Did I misread that? No linkshell is going to say "drk melee only" unless the leaders are so inept that they don't realize how the drk throwing out a couple extra resolutions during the duration of the 2hour is going to both keep help kill shit faster. Besides, regain ticks are every 3 seconds, so regain alone won't be able to out pace this 2hour unless it's 100TP/tick, because you're still going to swing again before the next regain tick to shave off whatever the melees gave it after you WS'd. You're splitting hairs and bitching for the sake of bitching, and it's really quite insulting to the rest of us who didn't get one of the 2-3 useful abilities, and quite distracting to the thread as a whole.

Couldn't agree more. People would be stupid to tell a massive DD job to use a massive DD 2-hour, then not WS and cut their DD to shit for the sake of something that doesn't actually help after the 1st 5~10 seconds of the 2-hours duration because the DRK is at 300% TP...

incorrect actually Abs-TP still works even at 300 TP. learned from helping ls on multiple Glavoid runs

Thats absorb TP, not this 2-hour, however since I have not tested this on the Test Server, I cant say for sure, but ok, just make that 1 change then, and it will be perfectly fine!

[Cljader1]

I thought it was pretty clear that you don't drain TP if you're at 300% TP. Did I misread that? No linkshell is going to say "drk melee only" unless the leaders are so inept that they don't realize how the drk throwing out a couple extra resolutions during the duration of the 2hour is going to both keep help kill shit faster. Besides, regain ticks are every 3 seconds, so regain alone won't be able to out pace this 2hour unless it's 100TP/tick, because you're still going to swing again before the next regain tick to shave off whatever the melees gave it after you WS'd. You're splitting hairs and bitching for the sake of bitching, and it's really quite insulting to the rest of us who didn't get one of the 2-3 useful abilities, and quite distracting to the thread as a whole.

Wrong! Drk keeps absorbing tp at 300%, once you reach 300% you cannot add more tp to yourself but your drained about stays the same. This also happens with abs-tp spell, drain 1, aspir 1, aspir2, once you hit the maximum capacity cap the drain will show as zero but it still drained and had the desired effect.

Moreover what are you talking about a FEW resolutions? Our 2hrs is only 30 secs, you blink and the buff is over with. You can only do one thing with it, zerg or tp-tank, and which would most linkshells and allainces choose? Almost everyone's 2hr is missed up, but however pup has one of the best new 2hrs. Having 6 new 2hrs added to one job is far better than have a 30 sec auto-attack tp drain.

[Cljader1]

Thats absorb TP, not this 2-hour, however since I have not tested this on the Test Server, I cant say for sure, but ok, just make that 1 change then, and it will be perfectly fine!

How do you not know this, especially if you play drk, it works the same with Blood Weapon too, if the dark knight is at its HP cap the drain will say zero but the desired effect is still there. You cannot drain beyond the cap, the only abilty and spell to do it is drain 2.

[Demon6324236]

How do you not know this, especially if you play drk, it works the same with Blood Weapon too, if the dark knight is at its HP cap the drain will say zero but the desired effect is still there. You cannot drain beyond the cap, the only abilty and spell to do it is drain 2.

Because I started playing DRK after BW became mostly worthless, as such I never used it really, and still don't, just been an ability in my list that I never use. As I said though, change that factor and tada, fixed. Also depending on how high the TP drain is depends on its use, I again, have not personally tested it so I have no idea. If the TP drain is say, as powerful as Ephemeron's or at least near it, your talking 60~90TP a hit, thats 1 hit to WS so long as the mob/NM has the TP to steal, in a zerg fight, it will. Even at 30TP/hit, thats 2 hits, at 20TP/hit thats about 3 hits. The math was given to you earlier on how many times you can hit...

Now, consider greatswords and scythes at haste cap: The average floored delay (80% reduction) for greatswords is around 91, while scythes are around 103. That means great swords will swing at a rate of around 1 attack round every 1.55 seconds, while scythes will be around 1.75 seconds. This means over 40 seconds (since the relic+2 2hour buff applies, currently) greatsword will have 25 attack rounds, while scythe will have 22. That's only rounds. That doesn't account for double/triple/quadruple attack, or misses. I'm not going to pretend to have any idea how much DA/TA/QA is on a typical drk zerg set, and just use a rough average of 25% DA since that seems to be fairly close for most jobs that aren't war or thf.

That would give greatsword 31 attacks and scythe 27, both before accuracy. Thus, even with scythe, you're still draining at rate between once every 1-2 seconds. With how potent the TP drain has been shown to be, and how mob AI works, there would need to be a significant amount of melees and/or regain present to negate that TP drain, and thus, essentially, this ability would give drk one of the strongest NM controlling abilities in the game. Why the hell are you complaining about it? You're going to get invited to zergs whether you have it or not. You're a fucking drk.

So say your using a GS like a good DRK. Thats about 31 attacks, now cut that down because of the WS delay, your still talking about doing between 8~10 Resolutions or so I think, within a 30 second period, how in any way is that bad? Not only that but depending on the amount of TP you do drain, you can still be locking down the mobs TP!

Stop arguing this ability is bad, its good, the only thing they could do with it to make it better is either A:Increase duration, or B:Apply to WSs. However I will tell you now, depending on the WS drain amount, that could never happen if its 20 TP a hit, for instance, look at Resolution! 5 hits possible, hit with all hits, normal WSTP is about 17~20ish depending, then TP drains, thats 20~100, so if you land at least 4 hits you have 100% instantly!

it's not our intention to allow for weapon skills to be used continuously without limitations

Seems this would likely be the case for DRK as well, even if this was in response to something for DNC, so sorry but that doesn't seem likely unless you want them to gimp the TP/hit amount, or at least on WSs. Just leave it how it is, its ok, messing with it will likely cause a nerf of some sort, such as duration, potency, effect, something will happen and it probably wont be good, some people like this, such as myself, and see its good, so please leave it how it is for now and see how it works out, if your ls starts to complain that you are committing the evil crime of WSing on a NM, then so be it to come back and bitch then, till then please just leave it alone and let the thread focus on BST's chowing down on their pets for some Stoneskin or RDM's getting 30 seconds to buff up with buffs that have what? +20% potency?

[Cljader1]

Stop arguing this ability is bad, its good, the only thing they could do with it to make it better is either A:Increase duration, or B:Apply to WSs. However I will tell you now, depending on the WS drain amount, that could never happen if its 20 TP a hit, for instance, look at Resolution! 5 hits possible, hit with all hits, normal WSTP is about 17~20ish depending, then TP drains, thats 20~100, so if you land at least 4 hits you have 100% instantly!

Seems this would likely be the case for DRK as well, even if this was in response to something for DNC, so sorry but that doesn't seem likely unless you want them to gimp the TP/hit amount, or at least on WSs. Just leave it how it is, its ok, messing with it will likely cause a nerf of some sort, such as duration, potency, effect, something will happen and it probably wont be good, some people like this, such as myself, and see its good, so please leave it how it is for now and see how it works out, if your ls starts to complain that you are committing the evil crime of WSing on a NM, then so be it to come back and bitch then, till then please just leave it alone and let the thread focus on BST's chowing down on their pets for some Stoneskin or RDM's getting 30 seconds to buff up with buffs that have what? +20% potency?

That's what Im getting at, it needs a longer duration or effect ws, drks have the shortest 2hrs in the game. I agree with some of this I definitely dont want a fantastic nerf, but you know how things go around here, jobs get pigeon-holed very easily, and I can see this one from a mile away. Last thing I don't want to see is people shouting in port jueno for drk tp-tanks, and not wanting them to ws, you invite a drk you invite the ZERG bottomline. Ill be happy with a longer duration, 55tp seems to be the cap on a single attack, however you can drain, 3tp, 16tp, 30tp etc. So 55tp appears to be the cap, and you have to fight a mob with a considerable large regain to hit that cap. I would like SE too add duration or en-tp ws effect to it and NOT take anything away. But right now drks would probably be happy if SE simply just address us.

[Theytak]

Wrong! Drk keeps absorbing tp at 300%, once you reach 300% you cannot add more tp to yourself but your drained about stays the same. This also happens with abs-tp spell, drain 1, aspir 1, aspir2, once you hit the maximum capacity cap the drain will show as zero but it still drained and had the desired effect.

Moreover what are you talking about a FEW resolutions? Our 2hrs is only 30 secs, you blink and the buff is over with. You can only do one thing with it, zerg or tp-tank, and which would most linkshells and allainces choose? Almost everyone's 2hr is missed up, but however pup has one of the best new 2hrs. Having 6 new 2hrs added to one job is far better than have a 30 sec auto-attack tp drain.

If you account for whatever xhit build a good drk zerg set up would have, and the absurd amount of TP you're getting from this 2hour, you're basically going to have upwards of a 2-3 hit going on. Even accounting for WS delay, you should have absolutely no problem getting off 8-10 ws unless you're absolutely terrible at high haste meleeing.

Also, don't bring pup into this. We didn't get 6 new anything, we got 6 clones of already existing 2hours that were intentionally weakened so that they're not as strong as the player version.

That's what Im getting at, it needs a longer duration or effect ws, drks have the shortest 2hrs in the game. I agree with some of this I definitely dont want a fantastic nerf, but you know how things go around here, jobs get pigeon-holed very easily, and I can see this one from a mile away. Last thing I don't want to see is people shouting in port jueno for drk tp-tanks, and not wanting them to ws, you invite a drk you invite the ZERG bottomline. Ill be happy with a longer duration, 55tp seems to be the cap on a single attack, however you can drain, 3tp, 16tp, 30tp etc. So 55tp appears to be the cap, and you have to fight a mob with a considerable large regain to hit that cap. I would like SE too add duration or en-tp ws effect to it and NOT take anything away. But right now drks would probably be happy if SE simply just address us.

Iiiiiiii'm pretty sure Rng actually has the shortest 2hour in the game, since 1 single hit lasts a lot less than 30 seconds.