Shaper's Shawl - Why?

[Daniel_Hatcher]

No, it's one giant wall depicting why you're dead wrong. Feel free to post absolutely nothing again instead of even attempting to counter a single point I've made, though it would be hilarious to hear your reasoning for why gutting Matsya isn't just a massive time sink and why it's the most skill intensive thing in this game.

Too lazy to get Fishing up? Right, because it offers one item I'd ever want which is not worth in any way shape or form the amount of time it would take to obtain going from 0 Fishing. I could cap several of my crafts (I don't even want to touch on how ridiculous obtaining several of these capes is) in the time it would take to get anywhere near to obtaining Matsya myself. Opportunity costs strike again, continue posting more ignorant comments, please.

Why argue, let him get 1000+ Rare/Ex bait, and then get annoyed when 950 of that is wasted on the items and other fish, then of the remaining 50 only about 9 will be the fish. (exaggeration, but can happen)

As a Fisherman level 110, with all gear and rod I assure you the fish is a pain in the a*se to fish up.

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That is one giant wall stating that you are too lazy to get a craft up as your only argument. It's not that you can't level it, it's that you don't feel like it. Oh well, no rewards for you! HUR HUR HUR. Guess only the elite few will be getting this Relic of Crafting. =)

Just an FYI, Fishing is not a Craft it's under the tab, but it's not classed as a craft, also LOL at elite.....

[Kristal]

No, it's one giant wall depicting why you're dead wrong.

Unless SE changes their mind (and they probably won't), he's the one being right.

It's obvious there's nothing else to discuss.

We think you're pampered paupers; you think we're sisyphusian sycophants. Square's support said that the shaper's shawl stays in the piscian prison of mischievous matsyas, so either ride that rod for guts and glory, generate gaggels of gil or abstain from acquisition.

I hear RDM melee is all the rage now.

[Sotek]

Oh seriously? SE agrees so he must be right, how foolish of me.

I've put forward a suggestion I think is superior for all parties involved (Fishers and crafters). So far nobody has even attempted to counter it, unless you count "GPs are just a time sink" as a counter but I've already explained how bloody ridiculous that claim is considering how you do obtain it currently.

I could care less if SE ever changes their mind and implements anything close to what I've suggested, this item is retarded and its at the end of a list of a great many retarded design choices they've made over the years. If they were refusing to adjust Evoliths and I was making the case that the current system is completely broken and stupid, would I be wrong? As it is, they've listened to player concerns and have planned to revamp the whole system in the distant future. Just because they'll likely never do the same thing here doesn't make their initial decision any less pants-on-head retarded and by extension it doesn't make anyone who agrees with such tripe right.

If there is nothing left to discuss it's because players like Triffle will post paragraph upon paragraph of effectively nothing while I, for the last time, ask questions like:

How is it a worse alternative for Matsya to become a new source of income for Fishers and for crafters to obtain this cape through reasonable means?

But hey, I really shouldn't expect a response to that since it's obviously rhetorical. No one in their right mind would respond with:

That's a worse alternative to Fishers having an extremely low chance of obtaining this cape through Matsya, which effectively becomes worthless again after they've obtained the cape since very few people are going to buy Matsya for a 1% chance at getting this cape at a minimum of 600k a piece. Dedicated crafters should have an extremely hard to nonexistent chance to obtain this clearly crafting related item.

Which is apparently the right opinion.

[Triffle]

Already countered every argument you had and beat it. The only argument you have left is chronic laziness disorder.

Why argue, let him get 1000+ Rare/Ex bait, and then get annoyed when 950 of that is wasted on the items

You don't lose bait when you fish up items. Any fisherman knows that. Asking any real fisherman who actually has over 100 fishing, they can tell you that you're exaggerating by a huge amount. People usually average 1 Matsya/10-20 Dwarf Pugils, which is a drop in the ocean when doing Cave Cherax from 90-110 fishing.

Just FYI, the Fish doesn't become useless. Nice people can actually help out their friends and help them try to get a cape as well while skilling up. Assuming you have any friends.

[Sotek]

If you've countered every point I've made I'd love to see a quote by quote account of that, because as I see if you've failed to counter a single point I've made successfully. The fact that you don't, or can't acknowledge most of the points I've made just makes you seem like a complete moron or a troll.

Just FYI, the Fish doesn't become useless. Nice people can actually help out their friends and help them try to get a cape as well while skilling up. Assuming you have any friends.

Nope. That's still useless, or rather worthless. Matsya could have been a great source of income had the put something different on it, instead you get this cape, you get this cape for your friends and oh look, Matsya is about as worthwhile as it was before this update. There is no long term value in this thing since you yourself claimed people weren't buying these regularly. If you intend to sell them on as well then my initial point about opportunity costs rears its ugly head and you'll have to do some more hand waving, claim I'm just lazy and act like that counters my point.

[Godofgods]

That is one giant wall stating that you are too lazy to get a craft up as your only argument. It's not that you can't level it, it's that you don't feel like it. Oh well, no rewards for you! HUR HUR HUR. Guess only the elite few will be getting this Relic of Crafting. =)

That is incredibly insulting. Iv had my real crafts capped for some time before the update. And aside form the new 100-110 on my WW, all the rest are capped again. Thats 590 skills gained. And your gonna call ppl like me lazy because I don't like fishing?

Aside form that, it only serves to dievate from the origional topic of this thread. That being how illogical it is for the only synthesis+ equip to come from something that doest rely on synthesis.

As a fisher, you like it only because your in a spot to grab it, so screw everyone else (and logic while you're at it) A synthesis+ equip should be obatined through some for of synthsis or their guild (Shocking logic, i know..).

Guild Points would have been a better option then fishing.

You whine about how it doesn't come from a Synthesis craft. This actually makes perfect sense to do. Something that useful, were it to come from a synthesis craft, would definitely have to be in the range of level 100 to 110. If it wasn't, everyone and their mules could get it easily.

If it indeed were to come from level 100-110, which craft would get it? Last I checked each player can only have one Synthesis craft over 70. If for example it were to come from cloth craft, everyone who leveled other skills would get shafted. Logically it should be put into a craft that all players can level, no matter what levels they have in other crafts.

You do realize that each craft has its own guild to buy things from right? (judging by that comment, I'm guessing not) And you do also realize that different guilds can carry the same item/key item right? Simple example is the Key item Sheeting. Bought with GP from EITHER the smithing guild or the goldsmithing guild. Which means there is no reason why they couldn't add the sharper's shawl to each guild at the highest level. By doing that, then real crafters can actually craft to get the crafting item. (wow... such immense logic is overwhleming...) And if SE wants it to be hard/long time to obtain, just set it at a super high GP price.

[Daniel_Hatcher]

Already countered every argument you had and beat it. The only argument you have left is chronic laziness disorder.



You don't lose bait when you fish up items. Any fisherman knows that. Asking any real fisherman who actually has over 100 fishing, they can tell you that you're exaggerating by a huge amount. People usually average 1 Matsya/10-20 Dwarf Pugils, which is a drop in the ocean when doing Cave Cherax from 90-110 fishing.

Just FYI, the Fish doesn't become useless. Nice people can actually help out their friends and help them try to get a cape as well while skilling up. Assuming you have any friends.

I was assuming you didn't fish items up, AKA bot (PS. Love that you ignored the other fish the bait catches which is the worse one). :|

And.... I did state exaggeration, do read the post.

Assuming you do Cherax to 110, I didn't (Armored Pisces > Hakuryu long before this time sink was added to make it even more annoying.)

We'll see if you do this time sink for your "friends" while making no profit when it comes down to it, it's easy to say you'll do something it's more if you follow up.

[Triffle]

How does adding it to the highest levels of each crafting guild help you level all levels? The cape is designed to be used at any level. If you can only get it at veteran it defeats the purpose. Also just FYI, pretty sure the only thing the Pugils target are items, monsters and cobalt jellyfish.

Of the three only monsters and the jellyfish make you lose bait and you don't fish as many up assuming you use the rings and apron. So yes, you are exaggerating by a lot. Ask anyone who actually does fish them up.

I've also explained before why it makes sense for fishing to have the item, feel free to read it again instead of taking 2 paragraphs from multiple posts.

I'll also continue to claim you are lazy until you decide to actually level your fishing skill. Currently all you are doing is whining about something you don't even try to attempt. Nice 14 fishing skill there. Then again lazy people will be lazy. This isn't the first time a group will whine about something because they refuse to do it to get the rewards.

[Daniel_Hatcher]

I've also explained before why it makes sense for fishing to have the item, feel free to read it again instead of taking 2 paragraphs from multiple posts.

And I'm afraid you're talking out your backside where it's concerned.... It makes no sense, and it never will.

PS. Forgot Line Breaks which are NOT rare... But you actually wouldn't know seeing as how you're not 110 fishing, I however am.

[Sotek]

How does adding it to the highest levels of each crafting guild help you level all levels? The cape is designed to be used at any level. If you can only get it at veteran it defeats the purpose.

It shouldn't be Veteran crafting skill to obtain, I'd put it ~60 where skill up naturally declines and with a high Guild Points cost it still wouldn't be easy to obtain. Though even if it was a Veteran item it would help with subcrafts and 110 which is by far the worst thing in the game at the moment. Getting it before 60 would actually be bad since in most cases crafts are profitable 1-60.

I've also explained before why it makes sense for fishing to have the item, feel free to read it again instead of taking 2 paragraphs from multiple posts.

I shot holes in literally all your arguments there and then all you follow up with "HURHUR U LAZY". Arguments don't work like that, you either have to counter my points proper or you're just talking out your ass. Still waiting on that quote by quote retake of you countering all my points, but at this point I find it more likely that you couldn't even identify a point I've made to attempt to counter it.

I'll also continue to claim you are lazy until you decide to actually level your fishing skill. Currently all you are doing is whining about something you don't even try to attempt.

Once again, opportunity costs. Such a simple point that you continually fail to grasp.