Where is my Phoenix Down?!

[Coldbrand]

Not humanly possible. Unless you're aware of a player with each relic mythic and empyrean.

[Zyeriis]

This game can't be won - cause there is no ending. Phoenix Downs would not gimp the system.

...what the hell are you talking about? Win, as in events/battles? I did not say the words "complete the game". I'm really lost as to what you are talking about. If you won the game...then there also would be no point in continuing to play? ::baffled face:: *scratches head* Phoenix downs would remove the ability to fail (a battlefield, a fight against a NM, etc.). If they were expensive, then they wouldn't serve much use especially not the use the OP wanted. No point in adding something essentially useless to the game.

[Tsukino_Kaji]

Not humanly possible. Unless you're aware of a player with each relic mythic and empyrean.

They will exist soon enough.

[Coldbrand]

They will exist soon enough.

Strongly doubtful, even if relics become easy enough to obtain that someone might accumulate each of them, the mythics are still incredibly, incredibly time consuming.

Phoenix downs do NOT remove the ability to fail, especially in the event that they were rare/ex. Oh and here's an idea, most really good items already put you on a cooldown for their usage, heaven forbid SE did that for them too, you know, kind of like my original post which stated that SE should work out the details in that regard?

If they remove the ability to fail, please, complete my mental exercise I presented for you and demonstrate how they'd present the ability to defeat Absolute Virtue during the 75 cap era.

[Zyeriis]

Strongly doubtful, even if relics become easy enough to obtain that someone might accumulate each of them, the mythics are still incredibly, incredibly time consuming.

Phoenix downs do NOT remove the ability to fail, especially in the event that they were rare/ex. Oh and here's an idea, most really good items already put you on a cooldown for their usage, heaven forbid SE did that for them too, you know, kind of like my original post which stated that SE should work out the details in that regard?

In the end, you still want an extra life. That doesn't change.

[Tsukino_Kaji]

In the end, you still want an extra life.

I think the replacement is needed already.

[Coldbrand]

In the end, you still want an extra life. That doesn't change.

My Spider-Sense is tingling! It tells me...that's the whole point of this thread!

[Zyeriis]

Actually let me rephrase before I go to sleep.

Doing it that way, would completely nullify your argument regarding adding "complexity" to the game and making new "harder" enemies with it, wouldn't be possible. You are changing your stance on the matter to avoid being wrong (and it going to fail either way0. If they were expensive, then they would not serve the very purpose you want to adamantly defend: using them a lot in battle. Which as you said, is a staple of all the single player final fantasy games. Making them rare/ex also nullifies this staple and your argument. If they were cheap, and non rare-ex they would be overpowered and stupid. If they were cheap and rare/ex, they'd still only be one use things, which is different from what you were arguing. If they were expensive and non rare/ex, they would still be overpowered but they would only be usable by people who are already decked out, making them relatively useless.

Anyway, going to sleep, it's 5:30 am....sun's gonna be up soon...

[Coldbrand]

How does having them be rare/ex nullify their staple status? As soon as they appear in the game that condition has been met.

I'm not moving any goalposts. I want them in. I want alternatives to casters with raise. I want stabilizing wars mid-boss fight like in all the other games in the franchise. I've been against them being stackable to 99 which you put in my mouth in the first place.

Haven't changed on any of these stances.

Sorry you haven't played the other FF games, but as anyone who has can attest, a lot of those boss fights were WAY more intense than your average NM or even CS boss fight, and one excuse to present harder fights would be making it so that you could get up the healer once per battle and thus not be dead the second they go down. There's no need for quotations about any of those concepts which are hardly theoretical since they exist in the rest of the franchise and have done so for more than a decade.

Their being expensive is someone else's argument, which I am against. That'd make them pointless like the majority of the other items alchemist produce simply from the standpoint that they're too costly to be used regularly.

Anyhow, I'm not too concerned since SE seems to be on my side of things as is evidenced by almost all new content providing players with temp. items freely which make the game function more like a traditional FF. (Besieged, Campaign, Abyssea)

[Zyeriis]

How does having them be rare/ex nullify their staple status? As soon as they appear in the game that condition has been met.

I'm not moving any goalposts. I want them in. I want alternatives to casters with raise. I want stabilizing wars mid-boss fight like in all the other games in the franchise. I've been against them being stackable to 99 which you put in my mouth in the first place.

Haven't changed on any of these stances.

Sorry you haven't played the other FF games, but as anyone who has can attest, a lot of those boss fights were WAY more intense than your average NM or even CS boss fight, and one excuse to present harder fights would be making it so that you could get up the healer once per battle and thus not be dead the second they go down. There's no need for quotations about any of those concepts which are hardly theoretical since they exist in the rest of the franchise and have done so for more than a decade.

Their being expensive is someone else's argument, which I am against. That'd make them pointless like the majority of the other items alchemist produce simply from the standpoint that they're too costly to be used regularly.

Anyhow, I'm not too concerned since SE seems to be on my side of things as is evidenced by almost all new content providing players with temp. items freely which make the game function more like a traditional FF. (Besieged, Campaign, Abyssea)

ts;dr (like tl;dr but worse)