[dev1107] Sange Update - Why?

[vixin]

again i wont agree with your comment "hes 100% correct"? what is that bs? and its not that wish is right or wrong its he bashes people gives them a 2-4 paragraph how hes elite and they are "noobs" then closes it off saying "your wrong, wrong wrong". If you want to get yrou message across just say it dont bash or troll simple as that. To save you the trouble dont post no one cares/ wantes to be treated like your our father "i keep repeating myself" maybe you should quit while yoru ahead if people are refusing to listen no?

[Karbuncle]

again i wont agree with your comment "hes 100% correct"? what is that bs?

Then you deny the truth. Its not really hard to see. He's not arguing you can't go have fun with it. Math Doesn't have a formula for determining fun(Maybe). So he's only arguing it sucks. Which it does, and now, You're backpedaling that you only use it for fun. So neither of your ideals clash at this point.

You just seem to be arguing for attention then?

and its not that wish is right or wrong its he bashes people gives them a 2-4 paragraph how hes elite and they are "noobs" then closes it off saying "your wrong, wrong wrong".

First off, Welcome to the Internet

Second off, Knowing how to play your job or Middle-School Level Math is not being Elite. Its called Basic human intelligence. Get some?

THird off, It is about "Right and Wrong". There are two options when playing a job, The right way, or the wrong way. Throwing on NIN Is the wrong way. You can do it for shits and giggles until you're blue in the face, Wish is only here to stop other NINs from getting the impression Throwing might be useful. It simply is not. In its current state. It could be in the future, But right now there is no uses for it.

His arguments mean nothing more, or nothing less. Simply throwing sucks. He's not saying you can't have fun and do it, He's just saying it offers nothing beneficial to the job. If you do it for fun, you should already understand this, Because if you thought it was useful, you wouldn't be doing it for fun, you'd be doing it because its useful. Or both. But you acknowledge you only do it for fun, Which acknowledges you know its not useful. So again, You and Wish's ideal should not conflict at this point.

Whats there to argue?

If you want to get yrou message across just say it dont bash or troll simple as that.

You called him Stupid.

To save you the trouble dont post no one cares/ wantes to be treated like your our father "i keep repeating myself" maybe you should quit while yoru ahead if people are refusing to listen no?

I don't quit when it comes to defending something i'm right about, No matter how thick-headed or idiotic my opponent may be, This applies to all my arguments, not you directly, So don't get the idea I'm specifically calling you thick-headed/idiotic. When I feel the conversation has run its course, I'll stop replying, thats about the worst I'll do.

Oh, and P.S, You obviously care a great deal considering by the tone of your posts, you're getting flustered and angry at our responses, meaning we're impacting you in a negative way, which means you care enough for you to let our responses get in your head. Try not to be too embarrass. Its only natural for people to get angry over time. Anger is after all a natural emotion every one of us experiences in our life.

But it only makes you look foolish if you deny this. Also, I'll be a dad whenever I want. don't make me get the belt on you for back-talking.

[vixin]

you think way to much for this game tbh lol

[Karbuncle]

you think way to much for this game tbh lol

Am i too understand that at this point in time, You're saying "Applying Things you learned in Middle School to a Video game is on too high an intellectual plain for me, As such, You are taking this game entirely too seriously by doing such"?

Its what I'm seeing. Then again, I'm not even sure if its proper english, Which i won't fault you on, as english may not be your first language and thats understandable. Though, at this point, You seem to be out of valid responses and will just continue to make 1-liners and desperately attempt for some sentence that will save-face on your part.

Don't do that, Belt time.

[vixin]

usually wish give me more of a figth worth joking about but yours make me feel liek you want to assert your sexxual agression on me. sorry but yeah ill just end it on that note your no fun lol

[Karbuncle]

usually wish give me more of a figth worth joking about but yours make me feel liek you want to assert your sexxual agression on me. sorry but yeah ill just end it on that note your no fun lol

So what you're saying is, You told us to get our point across without trolling, Which no one here has done, and in turn, You are now just admitting that you're only screwing with Wish to get responses out of him, which in itself is the definition of trolling?

As well as calling him stupid, you seem to have no idea what you want out of this argument, and are contradicting yourself with every post.

You really are attempting desperately to save face. I think the my paragraph about you getting angry has sent you into an "I ain't even mad" Meme spiral where now you're going to crack jokes and act like you weren't really serious this entire time.

Honestly, I'm a little amazed, I haven't seen this level of denial in months. I expected you maybe to say something like "Yah I'm angry what of it". but this? I find it Ironic you said a few posts back Wish lost his credibility when you... you just murdered yours in cold blood.

and sexual frustration, really? Is that the best you could come up with? I bet you got that from me saying I'll get the belt on you. When you think of your father spanking you you go straight to Sexuality? Hmmm... That's pretty bad.

[Bulrogg]

Even when we concede to the argument, which I know I have, and only state that some ninjas choose to use it, it has to be known when we use it so we can be called wrong.

Even when we just post to make a suggestion for an adjustment, a new ability idea, or to simply ask Rep/Dev questions we're told to to stop cause we're wrong.

So here goes: We're wrong for playing a game for enjoyment. And we're wrong for asking for adjustments and improvements to aspects of the game that not everyone agrees with.

Now, what else will it take to get them to shut up about it and let us try to get a good conversation going on in hopes reps/devs can chime in and perhaps enlighten us as to what their plans/thoughts are? Or will it just revert to the "Don't waste your time". No matter where we try and hold a conversation it always gets trashed up with Naruto RP insults and bickering.

There have been some pretty neat ideas over the ninja forum, but for the most part I see them getting trashed by the same individuals. Why? Because they don't want the job to change except for maybe one direction? Well if I may take a page out if their book: If you want more damage try leveling a real DD job. NIN should remain a jack of all trades type job and be able to take on many roles in the game, except of course healer. I still can't believe someone asked for a healing -jutsu, silly Leaf village and their medical ninjas. (That's how you do a Naruto dig; bazinga)

--and on that note: Good night forum.square-enix.com; stay classy.

[Darwena]

This thread really start to go nowhere...
We can resume this:

-Sange is the less efficient of Ninja merits.
-Shurikens cost a lot to make and stack of 12 are not efficient.
-Math proved than best shuriken with best setup cannot be more efficient then melee with basic cheap gear.
-Some people want some attention.
-People who play game for fun will play WHM/WAR to be DD aren't useless but just less effiecient.

[Kincard]

I think you guys are looking at Sange all wrong. I don't get why people think Sange is meant as a mid-combat tool. Ever since Sange came out I've only ever thought of it as a combat opener to get a damage spike to start with. The min 5-minute timer has always made me think of it as such. Back at 75 cap I had did a few solos by opening with Sange and I thought it worked decently well.

Don't get me wrong, I think Sange is still garbage in it's current form, but under ideal conditions I'm getting that if Sange tosses 6 shurikens at once with full Ni shadows up, that would be a 1260-damage throw with capped pDIF. This is assuming Manji shurikens, IE actually achievable in-game right now...though I'd like to see a NIN cap pDIF on throwing on anything worth a damn, even with all the decent RA gear we have access to. (Though if current info are to be believed, Koga +2's augment adds a whopping +100 ratk during Sange assuming full merits)

I think if they remove the San procs in VW like they said they will (Otherwise I'll stick with NTE, thanks...), and adding cheaper shurikens that stack way higher, I don't think they would need to add something as absurd as a 500-damage shuriken like Kaerin is suggesting. Even then though, I've never thought of it as a "oh shit I just lost hate, time to Sange" ability, but rather a "They're about to pop the NM, use sange as part of my prep and open with a big throw."

That being said, if they want to make it the former I would not complain at all...having the throwing sweet spot be melee range would suggest otherwise to me. Also if you use it the way I've always thought of using it you can basically ignore the free period of throws since after you Sange you just play melee NIN like normal, no?

[wish12oz]

I think you guys are looking at Sange all wrong. I don't get why people think Sange is meant as a mid-combat tool. Ever since Sange came out I've only ever thought of it as a combat opener to get a damage spike to start with. The min 5-minute timer has always made me think of it as such. Back at 75 cap I had did a few solos by opening with Sange and I thought it worked decently well.

Can you provide the math for sange being better in this case vs just engaging, provoking and attacking?
Because I'm pretty sure I already did it, and even if I didn't I can tell you the outcome, even with the "relic shuriken" it wont be worth using.