[dev1101] Please add "Don't get the drop X times, get key item for drop" EVERYWHERE!!

[Alhanelem]

I read the thread in it's entirety. You guys want guaranteed rewards for your efforts. I understand the desire. It will, though, kill the game much faster. It will happen if such systems become commonplace in XI.

No, you don't really get it. This is just a protection system for the small number of people who take far beyond the average number of tries at something before getting anything out of it. For most people this system has no effect, as they will get the drop in the average amount of time or sooner.

No drop rate should be so bad that we have people saying they went 0/400 NM kills / event runs. There is a threshold crossed where it's not worth the effort unless you're insane or on some kind of drug.

This system creates a happy medium where you can still get the drop fast if you get lucky, but there is a reasonable calculated limit on how unlucky you can get.
And if something like this isn't provided, then they need to give a serious reexamination to drop rates, because it's just silly how many times I hear about some people doing the same voidwatch run or same dynamis. OOOOh old dynamis, how I love thee. We got one dancer relic legs the day they were added to the game. I didn't get the drop, and 50 beaucadine runs and 1000s of monster kills later, I never saw another one, while at the same time a friends LS was seeing them drop left and right. I never did get them before empyrean armor came out. Apparently ~200 hours of my time wasn't enough for one single item out of thousands in the game.

You can only be opposed to this if you're one of the people that has some super rare drop and you don't want to see anyone else get it, at least not any more easily than you did.

[Karbuncle]

You can only be opposed to this if you're one of the people that has some super rare drop and you don't want to see anyone else get it, at least not any more easily than you did.

^^^^^^^^^^^^

There is absolutely zero conceivable reason to oppose a system that's only meaning would be keeping people from going well over double the expected drop rate of any given item.

This system isn't in place to hand people Items, If we assume the Drop rate on the Bodies are 1%, Me, and I know people like me, are well over 0/200 On a Single enemy, which is well past double the expected average amount of time.

Theres no reason for this! There needs to be a ceiling. Adding a ceiling that will only effect 1~5% of the people doing Voidwatch. Its not going to make bodies rain, its going to keep people from going INSANE trying to get something. Giving people a goal to reach before you get your item Isn't going to make people quit the game any more than going 0/440 On something.

People have been getting their items, and not getting their items, since the game began. The game still dwindles, but its probably dwindling faster now than it ever has before, Perhaps thats a hint people don't enjoy having drop rates divided by 18 and no progression in their events.

[Sfchakan]

No, you don't really get it..

No, you!

Really, all I'm seeing is a wall of dense. I've explained my argument multiple times. It's a VALID point. You're spouting the same stuff over and over, then assuming that someone is only opposed to your silly suggestion because they want to be jerks. I gave a great alternative: return to shared loot pools. You continue to go back to defending your idea. "NO, YOU ARE WRONG AND I AM RIGHT!!! EVERYTHING MUST BE EASY AS PIE AND HANDED TO ME! COME ON, SE!"

But, yeah, be butthurt because I once went 1/1 on O Kotes (but ignore my 1/42 on Leaping/Bounding Boots). Obviously I'm out to protect my eliteness or something. I can draw a picture of you in a full set of whatever gear you want, would that make you feel better?

I type "you guys want guaranteed rewards for your efforts..." and yet I don't get it and must be some mean old jerk trying to lord my Empress Hairpin over you? Dude, you've got problems. You're asking for GUARANTEED REWARDS for killing something X times. THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT YOU ARE ASKING FOR. Stop being so defensive of your poorly thought-out idea and be open to better options.

Also, I would love to see legitimate proof that someone went 0/400 on anything. Karbuncle? Not someone whose numbers I would trust.

[Zinato]

Really, all I'm seeing is a wall of dense. I've explained my argument multiple times. It's a VALID point. You're spouting the same stuff over and over, then assuming that someone is only opposed to your silly suggestion because they want to be jerks. I gave a great alternative: return to shared loot pools. You continue to go back to defending your idea. "NO, YOU ARE WRONG AND I AM RIGHT!!! EVERYTHING MUST BE EASY AS PIE AND HANDED TO ME! COME ON, SE!"

Also, I would love to see legitimate proof that someone went 0/400 on anything. Karbuncle? Not someone whose numbers I would trust.

Kinggalka went 0/400 and I know its at least over 200 as I was there for at least that many of them. That aside, I fail to see how 1/200 is a worse system or a less valid suggestion then Shared loot. I assure you with near 100% certainty shared pool would result in many more bodies dropping then this would. While that does prove better for players, would that not do exactly what you wish to prevent? Players getting gear and getting bored?

I find it hard to believe any player needs only x1 r/x item from VW. With each battle taking 5 minutes x 200 is 1000 minutes cut that into hours and you get ~16.5 hours. That's of nonstop VW excluding any wait times. Including Shout time I'd guess roughly ~24 hours minimum time per piece. Being realistic each player should need minimum 2-3 pieces. Did I mention that's 600 stones you have to save or find time to get money to purchase, and assuming people have 0 to do in the game other then VW. Now, the tricky part. While it's fine and dandy that a player willing to play 24 hours gets a body the same is not true for players who play much less then that 2-7hrs a day I'd say is average. Now, players who play all day will always run out of things to do that's the nature of playing all day. Those playing 2-7 would take ~3-12 days per piece of armor. At 2-3 pieces needed ~6-36 straight days total. (I'm doing my best to use the low end of the scale, many players need many more) Again, this assumes that is all players log in for, and doesn't include any progression needed.

What am I getting at? We should be getting content fast enough to balance this. Step back for a moment and look at what we have but, exclude drop rates. In one year Dec 11 (post aby) - Dec 12 we have received 56 5-10 minute fights, and 2 easily broken caps. That's about it everything else is a tweak, or revamp. (Dynamis is the same content for the same goals just more available now, and new merits/level ups is simply leveling 4 hours to get 90-99 and another 4 per WS, or just do VW for that EXP.) Those drop rates are to buy time for a lacking system, it's nothing short of sad to see how little there is.

As a final note, the balance between players who play 16 hours a day and those playing 2 has always been an issue for developers of MMOs. This is often what forces arbitrary wait times such as those for dynamis and limbus, as well as 24 hour spawns. They put them in place so that even a player only playing once a week wont fall behind those that play all day every day. They did something like this to EXP in XIV and that was one of the most criticised aspects of XIV. This problem can never fully be fixed. And, a balance must be found between adding new content, keeping it from being to quick or to slow for both demographics. To sum everything up I think the underlying issue is lack of content, the drop rates and the need to protect them is a direct result of this. (Also, a promised drop after 200 is fair only reason I see them avoiding it is in fear of revealing the true drop rates of items, since this would be based on drop rate x2-3 or whatever.)

[Sfchakan]

...

Wow, another level-headed player enters the thread. Thanks for the solid response! I agree completely that the true underlying issue is lack of content. SE kind of shot themselves in the foot with some of the post-75 gear they've released: they made all of the usual 75 cap endgame events obselete for gear/chracter advancement! This has destroyed/devauled a lot of content and now SE is in a bad predicament for XI. We do need more content to keep everyone happy, and only getting things like VW or Nyzul Uncharted is not going to please some of their playerbase.

I don't want to see SE in the same boat on XI as they are in XIV. They release new content once every 3 months and the playerbase is done with it in 2-4 weeks. Then people leave for 2 months to wait it out and save money. I think a token-based system would lead to more people cancelling their subscriptions or disappearing for 2 months at a time. "I checked this out, got the drops I wanted, and now I'll see you in May!"