Ideas to improve Neo Nyzul

[Dazusu]

Might as well add the "get TE from boss" idea to this thread. Even a 5 minute TE from each boss would help out a bit but not make the event a pushover which seems to be their concern.

I think a "chance of 5 min TE from boss" would be a better proposal, they like RNG ;-)

[Greatguardian]

Might as well add the "get TE from boss" idea to this thread. Even a 5 minute TE from each boss would help out a bit but not make the event a pushover which seems to be their concern.

+1.

A lot of the ideas suggested in the various Neo Nyzul threads would make the event way too easy, to be frank. A 45 minute time limit off the bat would be absolutely ridiculous, and you'd go from "No one can hit 100" to "Everyone with half a brain can hit 100 even with a couple mules".

Likewise, anything that allows saving is broken from the get-go. It is absolutely not hard to hit floor 50 in one no-boss run even with a party of full aurore mules. Getting to 100 becomes the only floor worth shooting for for anyone, a sure sign that the event is, again, way too easy.

This event is only slightly harder than it should be, in my opinion. It is too hard/random, but at the same time applying huge, major, premise-changing adjustments to it will make it far too easy to be any fun.

Ideally, 100 should be consistently reachable by a solid, high-end group 60-80% of the time. The event should scale in such a way that low-tier groups, or disorganized groups will have to content themselves with floors 20 and 40 the majority of the time. The idea is to make the event hard enough that high-end players have a use for all those 0.5-1%~ efficiency increases they've been grinding out for years, and are unable to just leave bot/afk-mules laying around, while not too hard that even an ideal group can consistently fail the majority of the time due to jump luck.

Frankly, if you and your group aren't as good as the top-tier, you shouldn't be hitting Floors 80-100. For anyone still wearing a single piece of Aurore or Perle, even floor 20-40 items can be an upgrade. There is no point in getting better if everyone is good enough. There is no point in success when everyone gets a medal. If you want a medal, and you're unable to get one, improve yourself and your group until you can.

5 minute TEs on boss floors will potentially make it easier for top-tier groups to hit floor 100 without making things piss-easy for low-tier groups (I mean, if you spend more than 5 minutes on the boss then you're losing net time).

Secondary objectives per-floor was something I mentioned in the other thread and I think would work out fairly well. Assign a small pool of player buffs (Regen+Refresh, Regain, 30 second TE, All Stats+) as the potential rewards for completing a secondary objective, but inform the player which reward coincides with which objective at the Rune. That way players are able to make the tactical decision whether or not to pursue any particular secondary objective on a per-floor basis.

Example text from the Rune would look like:
"Welcome to floor 47. Primary Objective: Kill specified enemy. Secondary Objective: Avoid detection. Secondary Reward: Regain."

In regards to temp items: A 2-minute lobby area for temps would be ideal, similar to the Legion lobby. This way, players will be able to get their temps without cutting into the event's primary time limit - allowing for more strategic use of items.

This is all minor stuff, because that's all the event really needs - Minor changes. Tweaks. The devs implemented this on the test server with cheat codes enabled, and thus we were unable to give them proper feedback on event difficulty. I get that they want this event to be hard. I want it to be hard, too. But I don't want it to be impossible, or improbable enough to be considered impossible.

Luck in general is fine. Luck makes things interesting, dynamic, unique. But 1% odds are stupid. The players are sick of them. It's not fun any more. It was never really fun to begin with.

[FrankReynolds]

Ideally, 100 should be consistently reachable by a solid, high-end group 60-80% of the time. The event should scale in such a way that low-tier groups, or disorganized groups will have to content themselves with floors 20 and 40 the majority of the time. The idea is to make the event hard enough that high-end players have a use for all those 0.5-1%~ efficiency increases they've been grinding out for years, and are unable to just leave bot/afk-mules laying around, while not too hard that even an ideal group can consistently fail the majority of the time due to jump luck.

Frankly, if you and your group aren't as good as the top-tier, you shouldn't be hitting Floors 80-100. For anyone still wearing a single piece of Aurore or Perle, even floor 20-40 items can be an upgrade. There is no point in getting better if everyone is good enough. There is no point in success when everyone gets a medal. If you want a medal, and you're unable to get one, improve yourself and your group until you can.

This is why they need a point system, and not a bunch of lottery crap. Making it so hard that XYZ pieces of gear are required in order to ever be good enough to reach floor 100 makes it so that people who haven't got XYZ are automatically excluded.

People who have gear that allows them to perform 2.37% better should be getting through content 2.37% faster. They shouldn't be getting to do content that people who perform 2.37% worse can't do at all.

[Greatguardian]

This is why they need a point system, and not a bunch of lottery crap. Making it so hard that XYZ pieces of gear are required in order to ever be good enough to reach floor 100 makes it so that people who haven't got XYZ are automatically excluded.

People who have gear that allows them to perform 2.37% better should be getting through content 2.37% faster. They shouldn't be getting to do content that people who perform 2.37% worse can't do at all.

They're not excluded. They're just reaping less powerful rewards. Floor 100 doesn't need to be the goal for everybody. Likewise, though, it should be the goal for somebody which is the problem the event faces as is. It's poorly... balanced.

I have no real fundamental issues with content requiring "the best" to complete, though. If I'm not good enough to do something, I get better until I am. Where's the challenge otherwise?

[Scribble]

Floor 100 doesn't need to be the goal for everybody. Likewise, though, it should be the goal for somebody which is the problem the event faces as is. It's poorly... balanced.

I have no real fundamental issues with content requiring "the best" to complete, though. If I'm not good enough to do something, I get better until I am. Where's the challenge otherwise?

I'm 102.4% sure that people entering Neo Nyzul are going in to attempt to clear the content. Maybe if the top tier gear were drops from any boss or found in chests on any level you'd have people who didn't care, but I think most everyone enters to clear it.

I agree with your statement about content requiring 'the best' or at least a strong, organized group to do well. The word 'challenge' however, doesn't quite fit an event where being lucky in terms of which type of floor you get, which mob type is required for that floor and the luck you have with moving up ??? levels.

Remove the luck if you want Neo NI to be skill-based or vice versa. An average group could get lucky enough to advance to floor 80 while a geared, 'skilled' and coordinated group could get shafted by floor types and the RNG of lamping for ???.

Somewhat related: I can't help but get the feeling that SE doesn't really grasp the concept of 'progression'.

[Ravenmore]

They're not excluded. They're just reaping less powerful rewards. Floor 100 doesn't need to be the goal for everybody. Likewise, though, it should be the goal for somebody which is the problem the event faces as is. It's poorly... balanced.

I have no real fundamental issues with content requiring "the best" to complete, though. If I'm not good enough to do something, I get better until I am. Where's the challenge otherwise?

Thats all well and good but at this point in the games life you can't push content that only offers 1 to 2% gain for a 100% more effort. It would be one thing if the 60, 80, and 100 gear far better then what we already have but its simply not.

[Dreamin]

They're not excluded. They're just reaping less powerful rewards. Floor 100 doesn't need to be the goal for everybody. Likewise, though, it should be the goal for somebody which is the problem the event faces as is. It's poorly... balanced.

I have no real fundamental issues with content requiring "the best" to complete, though. If I'm not good enough to do something, I get better until I am. Where's the challenge otherwise?

I wouldn't have any problem with your statement here if not for the fact that WITHOUT the use for 3rd party tools, those ppl that reported they were able to reach floor 100 would not have made it. So by making the game a lot easier by using tools, what 'Challenge' is there really? It also put a big question mark next to your claim of being 'BEST'. Is the group still the 'best' if they are only able to archive something through the use of tools? Show me someone that reached 100 without the use of any 3rd party tools and I'll STFU.

[FrankReynolds]

They're not excluded. They're just reaping less powerful rewards. Floor 100 doesn't need to be the goal for everybody. Likewise, though, it should be the goal for somebody which is the problem the event faces as is. It's poorly... balanced.

I have no real fundamental issues with content requiring "the best" to complete, though. If I'm not good enough to do something, I get better until I am. Where's the challenge otherwise?

So basically: Just don't do the event until you have built your R/E/M and gotten all the VW/Abyssea stuff for your job.

[Kimble]

Any event that requires you to hack (fillmode, clipper, speed hacking) is just poor content over all.

[Greatguardian]

Pfft,

http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Regain_Feather