WHM Have NO Natural Refresh Capability, WHY?

[Ryozen]

WHM can get 6MP/tick refresh from gear alone (7 if you want to carry around Pachira fruit or poison potions).

inb4 "but I want to run around naked!"

And to answer the question you ask in the thread title: Because it's a non-issue.

[Charismatic]

And to answer the question you ask in the thread title: Because it's a non-issue.

Yep. That's pretty much the gist of it. We don't have any natural refresh because we don't need any. Wouldn't matter if we had one unless it stacked with refresh and/or sublimation anyway because RDM and SCH are still the best subs if you take away their refresh abilities.

Light Arts + Strategems + Dispel (with dark arts and a stategem use, if you REALLY need a dispel) | Fast Cast + debuffs like Gravity + Convert + Dispel

So basically... without sacrificing anything, we get refresh abilities anyway. I mean, you could refuse to count subjobs, but why would you? They play into balance issues as well.

[Flyinghippress]

WHM are NOT supposed to be a DD job, so how do they get TP? Whats more, unless you have ACTUALLY leveled your club skill, how are you going to hit the mob and GET TP? The theory behind that being a great way to get MP back is flawed, severely, which is why I left it out completely. You can not get MP back if your club skill is not leveled, you need a decent club to begin with and the best healing boost weapons are staves. Which you ALSO need to skill up if you want to be able to effectively use Spirit Taker.

A good WHM in Abyssea will have club skill leveled to proc Blue!! with Hexa Strike so this argument doesn't really hold up.

I personally never have an MP issue as WHM/RDM inside or outside of Abyssea. I used to always just /SCH before cap rose and I do still think it's a good sub but I just prefer the mindless casting of Refresh and not having to worry about a sublimation being dispelled (used to happen to me a lot).

Edit: And my best guess to answer your question is that up until the game got turned into Easy-mode there was still a need to keep people taking time to level up. Longer they take to level up the longer they play, the more money they make. The more you have to rest the more time it takes. Having a RDM or BRD in the party was always standard to make sure resting time was lowered. This forced some sense of teamwork (SE's premise for FFXI) essentially rewarding you for doing what they wanted you to do.

[Rya]

WHM are NOT supposed to be a DD job, so how do they get TP? Whats more, unless you have ACTUALLY leveled your club skill, how are you going to hit the mob and GET TP? The theory behind that being a great way to get MP back is flawed, severely, which is why I left it out completely. You can not get MP back if your club skill is not leveled, you need a decent club to begin with and the best healing boost weapons are staves. Which you ALSO need to skill up if you want to be able to effectively use Spirit Taker.

I know this isn't what you want to hear, but I think SE gave us Boon/Dagan ... to encourage us to get creative and open-minded. You can't melee everything, but BLM&DRK can't aspir everything. When you -CAN- take full advantage of these WS's, the returns on them are gamebreakingly good! We're talking filling your MP bar way more often than a RDM can convert, inside or outside Abyssea.

Don't get me wrong, I think it would be spiffy to see a "Panaloon Mastery" trait that gave us the Orison-Pantaloons-style cash back rewards on qualifying MP purchases (Converts x% of "Cure" amount to MP) or something.

But, you should at least try killaging before you write it off as useless or irrelevant or whatever. It's really fun and efficient, if you can adapt your playstyle.

[Tsukino_Kaji]

They should instead give WHM auto regein at 50 just to spite everyone else.

[Simian]

Wolfe - we can agree to disagree on the fact that WHM needs natural refresh, but if you are talking about "natural" as in a Job Trait, then only SMN, PLD and BLU have that. RDM gets theirs from spells and gear just like WHM's. SMN did not even get Auto Refresh 2 until level 90 and that is only 2mp/tic. SCH gets their's from a Job Ability that has a timer unlike Job Traits which are always active. RDM is the same with Convert. So in essence, it is not a natural ability. If MP Conserve was adjusted to proc more often with greater reliability, I think you might find that to be better. Or just allow WHM's to perform self Devotion, which for me is 325+mp which is slightly less than a third of my normal overall MP pool.

[Lancil]

I don't see why whms need an auto-refresh. Higher tier cures make the mp gained from the trait almost unnoticeable. If anything, whms should get conserve mp, but that would just be redundant due to the ability to sub sch. In the long run while spamming cures you'll notice that you have a larger mp pool with conserve mp than without it; and if you are idle waiting for those few tics of mp why not rest. It's not like kneeling down will kill you. In roughly one second you can be up curing your tank without any setbacks.

[Momohko]

* Bard: Mages Ballad (Does not even use MP naturally and they have a form of Refresh)
* Bard: Mages Ballad II (I understand, support job, fine. But they still have Refresh)
* Bard: Mages Ballad III (Really?)

The reason we have ballad is because brds are SUPPORT jobs we have the ballad for YOU whms -.- if whms would stop running away from me when i ballad them or if they would stop being so close to the damn melee yea their refresh rate wouldn't be an issue(not saying you do this but you rly wouldn't believe the ammount of mages who run from ballad or the melee who feel they need ballad with their 10 mp pool -.-). Aside from being brd for over 6 years now I am also whm and I don't run into much mp problems, while yes it would be nice to have some sort of refresh native to whm I don't feel it is a NEED. To me it would mean I would not have to be as careful when playing whm lol. I have seen a galka whm with decent gear nothing amazing have no problem with healing while I have been with plenty of hume taru or mithra whm who have the hardest time keeping people healed and keeping mp up so another thing to consider is player skill~

[Upitupi]

They should instead give WHM auto regein at 50 just to spite everyone else.

I really like this idea. So out of left field, but still has a certain logic to it. White Mage has access to 5 weapon skills that give MP returns; 3 of which are self targeting, so you wouldn't need to even be in range, just engaged.
Now, the 2 weapon skills we would be most likely to use, Spirit Taker and Mystic Boon, does require us to get within melee range; I don't see it being any more a problem then running in to reapply buffs.
While I'm of the opinion that White Mage is not in need of "a natural form a refresh;" that's what we have sub jobs for, auto-regain sure would be a interesting option to a problem that doesn't exist.

[Khajit]

Whm doesn't need the refresh and even if they did need it we could *gasp* just get help from a job that actually can refresh in a game based on teamwork.
Plus there's the actual refresh gear i notice alot of people don't bother getting even though half that amount a year ago was enough to incite a blood frenzied fight among every mage in sight over the drops.