Battle Balance Adjustment: Cure Potency

[Daniel_Hatcher]

After looking into various possibilities such a MND and healing magic skill itself, we decided to go with adjustments to healing magic skill after considering the benefits this would give to jobs that possess this skill. MND affects cure potency more than in the past and the effect will remain as it is.

And I think this was the best way to do this, that way it only really benefits jobs with Skill, while others can raise it via Light Arts they then don't get Cure IV.

I'm fine with the rest of the post too.

[saevel]

Then your statement's point was nonsensical, has nothing to do with actual healing, and is just about making an unimportant number larger. Might as well be talking a White Mage into spamming Cure VI because it cures more.

It doesn't matter an ounce if you can heal 44 more HP on a spell because you have 20% more cure potency gear when the guy also has two more spells on separate recast timers (not to mention that one heals for over one hundred HP more so that throws out the flawed big numbers argument). It doesn't matter if you have 20% more cure potency if half his spells are more MP efficient even after that extra potency is taken into account.

Being technically right about a useless number is pointless if the spirit of the argument is lost. In this case the spirit is that regardless of gear limitations BLU can push higher cure amounts in a shorter period of time then Red Mage can. Cure IV might be able to cure 44 more points then some Blue Mage spell you are comparing it too, but that's just a pointless number in a vacuum away from actually doing healing work.

If I wanted to go after a pointless technicality that is so meaningless by the way, I could have and I'd still be right. A Blue Mage can sub Scholar, get 370 skill by popping Light Arts and push (with the same stats I mentioned earlier) a Magic Fruit for 650 HP, a win over the superiority stat boosted Red Mage's 618 Cure IV in the example. For the example I figured that I'd consider having another cure on a timer would be more valuable then having some meaningless number on a cure that was already more MP efficient, which is why I didn't bring this up.

I hope this brings some enlightenment. Blue Mage is the #2 healer currently. I don't want people to have misconceptions about this.

It's ok, his entire argument is just a personal attack on me. Namely that I used a quick and dirty cure set as an example and not the best available. It was done to demonstrate the scaling of Cure IV vs Magic Fruit (your really should only use Embrace if you need a 2nd powerful cure and fruits timer isn't up). You used a weak 90 MND, as Fruit is just Cure V, if you keep stacking that value higher the cure power shoots up. 550~600 fruits are not unheard of, for 72MP.

What makes BLU the second best healer in the game isn't a single high spell, but being able to cast not one, but three powerful cure spells back to back while also possessing Erasega, something not even WHM gets frequent access to. A BLU/WHM can go Embrace -> Fruit -> Cure IV on a single target or three separate targets. They can also easily remove slowga / bindga / graviga, something that frustrates all WHM's due to Erase's annoying recast timer. They have potent aoe stoneskin that doesn't require Accession to use, along with a 400~600 aoe Cure (White Wind). Inside Abyssea I hit 980~1K+ on W.Wind.

As I've said in the past, its the dirty little secret that BLU's everywhere try to hide. They don't want to be labeled a healing job even though their the second best at it. They don't want to be forced to go /WHM and be responsible for curing people and removing status ailments. That happened to RDM and BLU's have absolutely no desire to see it happen to them. They don't want to cast Haste x 3~4 along with spreading Fruits and Embraces around the party. To be yelled at if they so much as try to melee the monster, to have the WAR's and MNK's tell them to get in the back and cure cause their not a melee. Right now they are in danger of that happening, if anyone where to ever figure out that a BLU/WHM can ~now~ do everything a RDM/WHM could at 75 (role wise) and better. Don't have enough WHM's to cover your melee party, stick a BLU/WHM in it, they can do the job "good enough".

Now for all the hate mail and death threats to begin.

[Neisan_Quetz]

There's a reason that hasn't happened. I'll let you figure out why.

[Nightfyre]

I hope this brings some enlightenment. Blue Mage is the #2 healer currently. I don't want people to have misconceptions about this.

I even stated previously that it's currently the second best healer. There is no argument relevant to what you're posting.

As for Saevel, arguments that conveniently pick and choose evidence should be noted as doing so. If you have a problem with it, support your arguments more carefully in the future. Fewer fallacies in favor of actual evidence would help too. The fact of the matter is that BLU is not getting balanced by this update, it's being left in the dust. Nowhere have I asked for Magic Fruit to even stay competitive with Cure 4 post-update, I just want it to be given a small boost to accomodate our increased HP.

[Mageoholic]

It's ok, his entire argument is just a personal attack on me.

I don't think you are as popular as you think you are.

As for BLU healing, when their nuking damage balances out around SCH and RDM, then they can heal as effectively as a SCH or RDM until then, suck it up buttercup.

[saevel]

I even stated previously that it's currently the second best healer. There is no argument relevant to what you're posting.

As for Saevel, arguments that conveniently pick and choose evidence should be noted as doing so. If you have a problem with it, support your arguments more carefully in the future. Fewer fallacies in favor of actual evidence would help too. The fact of the matter is that BLU is not getting balanced by this update, it's being left in the dust. Nowhere have I asked for Magic Fruit to even stay competitive with Cure 4 post-update, I just want it to be given a small boost to accomodate our increased HP.

Umm what ... the entire first half of your paragraph is just BS. I didn't pick and choose a damn thing and you know it.

And yes you did ask for Fruit to be "updated" to compete with Cure V. Asking for BLU heals to use native Blue magic skill would immediately have the effect of capping their cure power at the soft cap of Cure V. That cap is far beyond the cap of Cure IV.

Right ~now~ Fruit and better then Cure IV, not to mention embrace.

Now for some fun, since everyone likes to just "hit cure potency cap" without thinking about the gear involved, lets get real.

RDM
Weapon: Galenus, Cure Pot +10% (can be off handed as /DNC or /NIN)
Body: Nefer Kalasiris (Cure +10%). This is a multi-million gil item from the AH, the full version is from Akvan and I'm something like 0/100 on it. I know someone who went 1/196. Assuming +15% is complete BS.
Hands / Feet: Serpentes: Cure Pot +5%
Legs: Praeco Slacks Cure Pot +4%
Back: Oretanio's Cape: Cure Pot +4%

Total: Cure +33%
If you really going the distance you can toss in the additional +14% from Magian Staff (+47).

Blu:
Weapon: Galenus +10%
Hands / Feet: Serpentes Cure +5%
Legs: Praeco Slacks Cure Pot +4%
Back: Oretanio's Cape: Cure Pot +4%

Total: Cure +23%. If anyone insists on forcing the RDM to use a staff then the BLU must sword+shield with an augmented genbus Cure Pot +5% for 28% total.

@33% RDM Cure IV is 530 HP, @47 its 586, Capping Healing skill @368 gives
@33% Cure IV is 537, @47 its 593. We've hit the soft cap long long time ago.

@23% BLU Fruit is 590, @28 it's 614. I used 120MND and 90VIT for this @150 healing skill. The BLU is just touching the soft cap. Additional MND can still be used. Embrace scales the same as fruit but has 110 higher base cure power, this gives it ~130 high cured value.

Without having to get anything difficult the BLU shoots past the RDM in cure power even though it's got less cure potency. Fruit / Embrace are Cure V and scale as Cure V would. Thus with only 150 skill, 120 MND and minimal cure potency (23%) a BLU/WHM can out cure a RDM ~and~ still use their damage spells, Almace and CDC. Take away the /WHM and you get 550 fruits @23% cure pot which is ridiculous when you consider the BLU is now /WAR or /DNC with all the power that entails.

So please tell me how BLU isn't curb stomping RDM in the party support / main healing department.

[Aleste]

RDM
Weapon: Galenus, Cure Pot +10% (can be off handed as /DNC or /NIN)
Body: Nefer Kalasiris (Cure +10%). This is a multi-million gil item from the AH, the full version is from Akvan and I'm something like 0/100 on it. I know someone who went 1/196. Assuming +15% is complete BS.
Hands / Feet: Serpentes: Cure Pot +5%
Legs: Praeco Slacks Cure Pot +4%
Back: Oretanio's Cape: Cure Pot +4%

Total: Cure +33%
If you really going the distance you can toss in the additional +14% from Magian Staff (+47).

I've no intention of getting into this argument, however I'd like to point out that RDM can also wear fylgia torque+1 (3%) roundel (5%) and augmented zenith pumps (4%)... tefnut too.

[Daniel_Hatcher]

I've no intention of getting into this argument, however I'd like to point out that RDM can also wear fylgia torque+1 (3%) roundel (5%) and augmented zenith pumps (4%)... tefnut too.

Isn't the point that BLU gets more HP for less "Cure" potency+ gear?

That said, I couldn't care less they already said no to BLU that should be the end of it.

[saevel]

I've no intention of getting into this argument, however I'd like to point out that RDM can also wear fylgia torque+1 (3%) roundel (5%) and augmented zenith pumps (4%)... tefnut too.

I know we can, we can also wear Akvan's body. Seeing as roundel is ridiculously expensive along with fylgia +1, and those augmented zenith pumps are only +3%. The RDM in this example was already at 47% with the BLU at 28%, the BLU was winning.

Here I'll state it again, just for clarity.

Without having to get anything difficult the BLU shoots past the RDM in cure power even though it's got less cure potency.

[Neisan_Quetz]

Why the fuck are we comparing 33% cure potency? In before gil is hard to make.