Arch Dynamis lords difficultly.

[MarkovChain]

~90% of the time it only splits once, meaning that if you have the fire power to kill the two clones you have 90%+ success rate, like us and our 6-man strat.

[Yinnyth]

100% of the time, ADL splits as many times as he pleases provided you give him enough time to do so. The reason he's only splitting once ~90% of the time for you isn't because it's written into his code that he can only split once 90% of the time. It's because ~90% of the time you either kill the real one first, or kill the fake one, then zerg the real one before he gets a chance to split. Under normal circumstances he seems to split almost instantly after you kill the fake, but if he happens to be stunned when the fake dies (as in your strategy of using shock squall when the first one is low), he appears to put off splitting again until a time requirement is met.

I'm not sure if it's just a language thing, but you seem to have serious difficulties with the concepts of "cause" and "effect".

[MarkovChain]

Your post doesn't make sense, there is no normal condition or abnormal condition for adl. You cannot control the moment it will split a second time because it is random meaning that at a given kill speed you only have a certain % chance of killing it. It nearly never splits while you (well "I") kill the second form and this is not due to shock squall ; you don't seem to know that it can start summoning for tripling while under shock squall effect.

You only post for the sake of arguing.

[Yinnyth]

You said he only splits once ~90% of the time. In our language, that implies that 90% of the time, no matter what you do, he will not split a second time on that fight, which is completely untrue and stands the chance of confusing someone unless someone corrects you.

Then you went even further by saying if you have enough firepower to kill both clones, you'll have a 90% win rate. In our language, that means that if you can do enough damage to kill both clones before PD wears off, you'll win 90% of the time, which again is untrue. If you do that damage slowly enough, he'll split. Again, if no one corrected you on this, someone might become very confused about how ADL works.

Finally, I'd like to know how you know that ADL can split before his stun wears off. How can you be certain that summoning his clones wasn't just the first thing he did immediately after stun wore off? From my experiences on pup, I couldn't find a chat filter which allows you to see when a debuff cast by a pet wears off. I could be wrong on that, I suppose, but all the same, I'd like to have that information if you have it.

[Monchat]

Finally, I'd like to know how you know that ADL can split before his stun wears off. How can you be certain that summoning his clones wasn't just the first thing he did immediately after stun wore off? From my experiences on pup, I couldn't find a chat filter which allows you to see when a debuff cast by a pet wears off. I could be wrong on that, I suppose, but all the same, I'd like to have that information if you have it.

what he meant is: ADL always split at ~50%, and 90% of the time, you will kill both clones before he splits a second time, given enough fire power. with our 6-man stratgy (4 DD) we are able to kill the second clone about 50% of the time, which makes the win rate ~75%.

When the first clone killed is fake, and we fail to kill the second ( this happens on 25% of our ADL), and we are not implosionned, each time we failed has been when adl was summoning and spliting while stunned, genrally leading to a triple tera slash/implosion/wipe. You definatly can tell. since shock squal is supposed to last ~20s.

[Yinnyth]

Stun's duration is chaotic at best. "It should be lasting 20 seconds, but it feels like he split earlier than that." is a far cry from proof that he can split while stunned. In order to prove something, you need to eliminate all other possibilities. Your claim still leaves room for human error and relies on an unverified statement that shock squall lasts ~20 seconds on ADL all the time.

Now if you had proof that shock squall never lasts under a certain amount of time, and you had a video of the fight with ADL splitting within that amount of time after shock squall, then yes, that would count as proof. But right now, it's conjecture.

Am I saying you're wrong about this? No. I accept that this might be a possibility because I don't have any proof to the contrary. But to me this is an extraordinary claim since I've never seen ADL split while stunned, and I've seen ADL split a lot more than I care to admit. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof. And if you don't have proof, it's best to use qualifier statements such as "I think" or "I believe" or "I don't have any proof to back this up, but this is how it seems to work" instead of just outright claiming your belief is fact.

Also, considering the trend of this thread and how much backpedaling he's done, you'd have a better understanding of the truth if you just automatically assume everything Pchan says is wrong. He spent about the first 10 or 20 pages claiming that ADL's first split is completely based on time. Now he's claiming ADL's triple split is based on Violent Rupture, that ADL doesn't split a second time 90% of the time, and that ADL can split while stunned. ALL of these are extraordinary claims. They ALL seem contrary to what other people observe. You need to bring proof, or you need to accept the possibility that you could be wrong.

Or just learn to enjoy being called out by every intelligent player on the forums. I get the feeling that might be the choice he's going with.

[Trisscar]

the Fiat Lux fight was a prefect example of how a balanced Dynamis Lord fight can work.

Except no one can do Fiat Lux, it's impossible to get access.

[MarkovChain]

But to me this is an extraordinary claim since I've never seen ADL split while stunned, and I've seen ADL split a lot more than I care to admit. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof. And if you don't have proof, it's best to use qualifier statements such as "I think" or "I believe" or "I don't have any proof to back this up, but this is how it seems to work" instead of just outright claiming your belief is fact.

Also, considering the trend of this thread and how much backpedaling he's done, you'd have a better understanding of the truth if you just automatically assume everything Pchan says is wrong. He spent about the first 10 or 20 pages claiming that ADL's first split is completely based on time. Now he's claiming ADL's triple split is based on Violent Rupture, that ADL doesn't split a second time 90% of the time, and that ADL can split while stunned. ALL of these are extraordinary claims. They ALL seem contrary to what other people observe. You need to bring proof, or you need to accept the possibility that you could be wrong.

Or just learn to enjoy being called out by every intelligent player on the forums. I get the feeling that might be the choice he's going with.

So after the entire mass of idiots, including you, were jumping at my throat for claiming I could 6-man ADL, wich I proved with 3 videos, you still split nonsense trying to belittle me ? Everyhting we claim about ADL is correct and you are wrong because you don't actually kill it. Shock squall has a fixed duration, tiered to full/half/quarter etc because this is FFXI, you don't have to prove it. Unresisted shock squall on ADL can last that much and ADL can cast and split while stunned, otherwise you would see all the gimps killing it in ally destroying it before it even has a chance to split (tp burn until 60% > schockquall > unleash all WS would instantly kill it). I've killed maybe 80 ADL at this time I know what I'm saying.

[Rezeak]

Everyhting we claim about ADL is correct

about that...

More good info on ADL (aka not one from BG nor its unverified wiki). The first clone appears exactly after 30 sec into (pop time -> sumonning time)

Yea you were right about 6 pple can kill it but alot of other stuff you were wrong at as well it's a shame you can't argue reasonably or people might acully respect you imo.

I don't believe the 90% it'll split once since my ls has killed it's 50:50 imo.

On shocksquall it's really useful to deal w/ the tp moves after a split aga but the duration is more random than alway 20 secs infact it's RARE for you to get a 20 sec duration(infact i don't think i've ever seen it last that long and i have capped summing magic skill) prolly added by SE cause 2 SMN could stun lock ADL if the 20 sec thing was reliable.

Honesly tho a big help to ADL is stunning overall O.Smash is easily stunnable and good timing of shock squall can stop a 3-4 X tera slash wipe.

[Yinnyth]

So after the entire mass of idiots, including you, were jumping at my throat for claiming I could 6-man ADL, wich I proved with 3 videos, you still split nonsense trying to belittle me ?

I'm sorry, I don't seem to remember that. Could you please find the quote of me saying that you can't 6-man ADL? The thing I took exception to was your ridiculous claim:

the fight which implies that a minimum of 6 real DDs (aka level 90+ empy monks with soulvoice ma/ma/min&haste) should bring ADL to ~zero% before it splits leaving you with pale copies of maybe 1% HP.

I never said that it's impossible for 6 people to kill ADL. That's about the only believable thing you've said on this entire thread. I'm attacking you for almost EVERYTHING else you've said on this thread.

Shock squall has a fixed duration, tiered to full/half/quarter etc

So it's possible then... and bear with me on this one here... it's possible that he HALF RESISTED THE STUN, so STUN WORE OFF BEFORE YOU EXPECTED IT TO? That might explain the whole... you know... splitting within 20 seconds of using shock squall in a way which doesn't require him to behave unlike any other enemy in the game which are incapable of beginning a summoning animation until the effect of stun, terror, sleep, or petrify wears off.

I already said it's possible you're right. But common sense is against you on this which means that if you want to claim this as absolute truth, you need to bring proof to the table. You can start by bringing proof that shock squall is a set duration of stun. I don't play smn myself, so this wouldn't be something I would notice. I also don't see this information listed on any of my trusted sources.