Ok...let me level with you here SE...

[Frost]

If converted to "Arch Dynamis Lord Kills" the following would happen:

Teamwork, you'd have groups of people banding together to do this fight, and everyone involved benefits.

Umbral Marrow, since it's still needed for the ridiculous second trial, it's actually make it available for people to try. When you have hundreds of teams killing Arch Dynamis Lords, eventually "A Select Few" will be able to attain the supply needed to finish that trial.

Also needing recognition:

Time Limits, It hasnt' been brought up at all, I'm amazed. You can only be in Dynamis for two hours, once a day.

The pre-pop NMs needed to pop Arch Dynamis Lord need a considerable amount of man power and time to kill too.

In short these trials will NEVER be done "In a Week".


And the big thing that seems to be forgotten:

Some of use spent in upwards of Two years doing Dynamis:
>> Throwing money into the void, upwards of two years of Hourglasses at 1,000,000 Gil a pop.
>> Gathering 32-64 people together for the benefit of one person, and all the problems that come with that.
>> Trading ancient currencies.
>> The waits needed between trials.
>> Finding crafters for the requested weapons.
>> Setting up "lost runs" that were dedicated to killing attestation monsters, repeatedly because the drop wasn't guaranteed.
>> Setting up "lost runs" to farm the fragment NMs only to have them warp out on you. and having to set up another run to retry.

Then:
Subsequent trials where you need to Killshot countless monsters. Yes you lowered them. But some of us actually did it "The hard way" upwards of 9,000 monsters, +/- misses.

Then:
Kill your attestation monster 5 times.
Not so bad now cause you can pop multiples, but when I did it, that meant another 5 hourglasses at 500,000 Gil ea.

Then:
Kill your Fragment NM 10 times, which was reasonable.

20 Ubral Marrows seems a bit high to me. But 20 Arch Dynamis Lord kills seems Decent to Good. It benefits everyone helping and could be fun in the end.

[Dew]

The normal trials should have nothing to do with the stage2 ones. Having the same item for both is retarded. Stage 1 should be totally different from stage 2. Collecting lower amount of the same retarded to get items isn't any better. With the current requirements they posted, it will be select few for stage1 and that one guy for stage2.

[Creelo]

Choosing to spend the currency on a relic over selling that currency has the same effect as buying the currency. You're down a certain amount of currency and you have a relic. Opportunity cost and such.

Yes, I understand what you're saying; however, that still doesn't take away from the fact that not everyone buys their relic lol, I'll explain what I mean.

You can do Dynamis everyday, save the currency you get and effectively be "spending" your gil through opportunity cost as you're saying. This can easily get you a Relic if your patient enough. But not everyone does this; some people may go through other types of making gil: Cruor burning, Merc'in, Salvage -> Alexandrite selling, etc, in addition to doing daily Dynamis. When I refer to people who "buy" relics, it's generally these people that are simply really into making gil that I'm refering to, which I don't have a problem with.

The problem I have is when people say shit like...

What's a relic cost these days anyway? 150M+?

So 150M sounds reasonable but 550M doesn't?

Sure, I may have spent 150mil on a relic through opportunity cost, but does that mean I want to be spending an additional 400mil (20mil~ x20) or have the funds (or the drive x.x) to readily be able to do so after I put in what I feel is enough work?

No. Just because a relic may be worth 150mil~ in opportunity cost doesn't mean the player that owns it is busting at the seams with gil, ready to spend over twice as much as they did on the 75 weapon for the Stage 1 99 version.

What's the difference between 150mil and 550mil? 400mil (Derr), which could roughly translate into almost 3 more relics for my friends. :/

Fuck this, give me the Mythic Trial; at least I don't have to drag my friends to hell for all of it and can suffer in solitude as I take pictures on my own time of Sanraku's latest fetish.

[Mahoro]

If they lifted the once a day restriction on Dynamis, I could ALMOST see this as being possible. As it stands, this is going to be painstaking. The frequency of Dynamis Arch Boss events have tanked in my own LS because people use their time to farm currency/gil and lock themselves out when event time comes. Funny enough though, these are the same members who have all of a sudden expressed interest in Arch Boss events again, so I might use the opportunity to get members those last few Avesta Bangles/Oneiros Grips we needed. o-O

Also, people actually do want the glowy sword from ADL, even though drop rate is crappy. Then again, VW drop rate is crappy, although admittedly you can spam that.

[Daniel]

I'll be honest, 20 Umbral marrow doesn't sound reasonable for anyone I know never mind most relic holders. Do you know how many LS there are out there that can do Arch Dynamis lord at all never mind consistently? I don't know a single one... Too make matters worse, we need the same item as for the Stage two trial...

thanks allot SE, that's just wonderful, now not only do I have to compete for an impossibly hard item with 18-50 other people, I also have to compete with what ever psycho wants to get the afterglow effect...

[Vold]

I just don't understand why relics can't be "earn a crap ton of exp in x zone" or "kill Dynamis Lord 20 times" instead of this Arch Dynamis Lord non sense. Everyone's busy being dedicated to bargaining a compromise for ADL but I say screw that noise. Relic trials have a pattern up to level 95 involving Dynamis. Instead of doing the next logical trial of taking on the DL himself, they skip him for the Arch version. What the eff.

Did we learn NOTHING with augments and the playerbase? We WANT to work for our rewards. We WANT crap not handed to us on a silver platter. What we do NOT want is to never be able to achieve our frickin' goals. Make us do 200,000 exp in Xarc. Make us do 20 DLs. Make us do SOMETHING that is feasible with work. The days of little reward for our invested time is over. Accept it, or risk getting left behind by your customers for greener pastures. It really is that. damn. simple.

And I'm sorry for anyone who does not understand that and wants to applaud such content design decisions. But the fact is when a game reaches a certain point in it's life span, namely when the dev company cuts support for their flagship MMO to try to make a new MMO the new flagship MMO or customers beat you to the punch and start looking elsewhere for their dollars, you have to change your strategy up to maintain current customers. This is not maintaining customers. This is giving the middle finger to them. You might not intend for it to happen, but that's exactly what it is in our view.

We are an aging playerbase. We don't have what it takes anymore to be doing what we did years ago. We want to work for stuff. We just don't want it to be nigh impossible. There are already a select few who owns these weapons, relics, mythics AND Empyreans. Compared to the entire population yes it's a select few. We already paid our dues and then some. We really don't need to have level 99 trials on any ultimate weapons to be the most devastating trials ever. Not even Empyrean after the lv95 trials. I can see that regret with the fairly minor lv99 trial of x60 items. This was understood some time ago when, for example, relic weapon trails to start were seriously dialed the hell back from what they were originally. So, what up? Did you forget those trials? 2,000 kills? What's changed since then?

Ah well, I hope the JP are fussing a storm because I know this deal is in their hands.

[Insaniac]

^
Screw ADL. Screw PW. They should never be involved in this trial.

18 man content means people who don't get it done in the first wave will NEVER get it done. This is a monumental failure in the "understanding how your game works" department. It really is like they don't have a single person in the office that plays the game.

[FrankReynolds]

Ah well, I hope the JP are fussing a storm because I know this deal is in their hands.

When I looked this morning, there was a lot of !!! and deleted posts. Google translate made a big jumble of the words, but several people are calling out ito / tanaka etc. and telling them to go do the trials themselves every day after work, and then come back and tell people that they are reasonable trials.

They basically say the same things as here: the time investment is unbelievable, SE is out of touch with the fact that the players all have jobs / kids now, the gil investment is retarded, it will take years to complete, sharing the same item for both quests is retarded.... all the same stuff, only with lots of angry squiggles and a lot more likes on their posts.

[Babekeke]

This could be fixed by adding the drops to more mobs. Make umbral marrow 100% from ADL with a chance for a 2nd, and a lower chance (~25%) for all other popped NMs in dynamis to drop it. Same with Mulcibar's Scoria, with a chance for the T4s to drop it.

[SpankWustler]

This isn't really here or there, but it just occurred to me that "Mulcibar's Scoria" sounds like some horrible disease that makes people poop out their pancreases. If a new disease appears in the first poor soul to attempt the afterglow trial, maybe it can be named Mulcibar's Scoria?

Anyway, this made me wonder what the words actually mean. Scoria is a wierd-looking volcanic rock. The only English results that Google provided me for "Mulcibar" other than some FFXI-related stuff were snippets of erotic fan-fiction. Some of it was Harry Potterian in origin, and some based on something else less immediately recognizable.

I hope the development team finds this information useful!