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Thread: To the devs!

  1. #71
    Player Ketaru's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
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    Windurst
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    215
    Character
    Ketaru
    World
    Siren
    Main Class
    RDM Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by ManaKing View Post
    As usual, the classier crowd shows up to tell me my opinion. Oh wait you missed again, that wasn't what I was thinking.

    Sorry you don't agree with me and you can't manage to have a decent conversation without berating another person. I'll just leave you to your social dysfunctions and unimaginative ranting. Your pictures and swearing make amazing statements.
    But it was certainly what you were saying.

    Because comments like "The people that actually play RDM want something awesome to do with all of their MAB as well" totally wasn't worded to undermine other posters here. Drop the finger wagging. You're hardly a saint.

    Quote Originally Posted by ManaKing
    NQ gets props for being legit and a classy gentleman. Yeah i get it. You want to nuke and I want to hit stuff. No reason a RDM can't use MAB for both since you can. Would be nice if both of those aspects received favorable attention
    Quote Originally Posted by saevel
    I never got that about the anti-melee-RDM crowd. None of us are diminishing the mage side, to the contrary many of the pro-melee-RDM's play the mage side just as much.
    For people who get all uppity thinking people misunderstand you, you are way off the mark here. Go back and try reading. It wasn't at all anti-melee anything. It was all talk about whether it was the right call to get the multi-crit WS that we got. Or would we have been better off with the magical WS. I say how about the option that covers more ground rather than more menu clutter for types of damage we're already capable of doing?
    (0)
    "NeED★RdM? PLeaSe sENd★teLL!"

  2. #72
    Player ManaKing's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
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    Character
    Iocus
    World
    Phoenix
    Main Class
    RDM Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Ketaru View Post
    Because comments like "The people that actually play RDM want something awesome to do with all of their MAB as well" totally wasn't worded to undermine other posters here. Drop the finger wagging. You're hardly a saint.
    Well I should think not. I doubt I've taken any time to try to substantiate a claim for being canonized. That would be a complete waste of time and would be self contradictory.

    GG admits he doesn't play RDM anymore. I have no interest in listening to his or anyone's opinion on RDM unless they are actually willing to play it. If you can't suffer through another ambiguous RDM phase then I don't really have any interest in listening to an opinion from someone that has already given up and is crying/trolling from the sidelines instead of playing the job that you should still love to play.

    I solo aby NMs for my other jobs all the time with my RDM. It is a delight to play RDM in it's current incarnation on lower level content because it takes a level of effort that I've always associated with this game. I take my RDM to Dynamis because it is fun and I'm in no rush to throw away content that I'll enjoy as a RDM for the efficiency of another job. No idea when I'll get something new to play as a RDM, might as well enjoy playing it in the meantime.

    The plain truth is that RDM doesn't do anything substantial in VW or any current content that came out in the last 2 level caps. I'm pretty tired of not having a legitimate role in a party through merits of my job. Enfeebles are broken and we are 2nd rate at everything else by design. Pretending that a staff on your back suddenly makes RDM viable again is a farce. The job isn't viable regardless of how hard any of us struggle to make it so.

    I'm really not sure if you're aware of it, but my only real purpose for being on these forums in to start enough discussions about things I'm concerned about that so that I can make sure we didn't at least attempt to give feedback. Getting transparency from the Devs has proven impossible and RDM at 99 looks as crappy as it did at any other point after the level cap was raised. In my opinion, they have failed to properly integrate this job into the current state of this game. The only way I get any answers is by poking at the devs as hard as I can to see if I get a response.

    Look at how many responses from devs there are on the board. Look who started those discussions. It shouldn't surprise you that Saevel and I, the horrible melee RDMs, have started the majority of those threads. I won't discount anyone else that participated in the discussions, because obviously participation is necessary to create discussions. But I see a common trend of people actually discussing things they are concerned over and then an irrational opposition coming in to start a turf war over the least viable job in the game.

    Why don't the supposed pro mage RDMs start discussions on things you want to see happen to RDM instead of walking into other people's discussions and intentionally starting fights?

    Do you just not have anything interesting to discuss? I'm sure you are capable of giving more than just constant criticism.

    I just want to know why the supposed 'melee RDMs' are the only ones that show a vested interest in starting discussions on the future of where this job is going. I know it's must be shocking to some, but I (and I'm sure Saevel as well) actually play RDM as a mage. I just so happen to be willing to melee when I can't kite anything because enfeebles are useless now. I adapted to what the game would allow and had no interest in continuing RDM in a direction I thought was foolish to begin with as it became less and less viable to do so.


    Quote Originally Posted by Ketaru View Post
    For people who get all uppity thinking people misunderstand you, you are way off the mark here. Go back and try reading. It wasn't at all anti-melee anything. It was all talk about whether it was the right call to get the multi-crit WS that we got. Or would we have been better off with the magical WS. I say how about the option that covers more ground rather than more menu clutter for types of damage we're already capable of doing?
    I did read. You said Cloudsplitter was trash. I said Cloudsplitter is trash on WAR/BST. I made a distinction and expressed my opinion. The peanut gallery came in and insulted the idea that I would want an elemental based WS and buffs that would make sense to me for how I see RDM. Saevel and I comment back and forth why we don't understand the hostility and you see it as Melee RDM banter, where as we see it as discussing RDM as a whole. If you don't see melee as an option for RDM then you won't understand it, but realize that I see melee as the most viable option RDM has right now. It is not the only option I would entertain. But SE would have to actually make alternatives attractive and they don't seem to have any interest in making a full time mage RDM attractive anymore.

    I will continue to comment that a multi-hit Crit WS, while attractive and useful, is still an obvious blanket adjustment to the job. In a game of comparisons, RDM will always come up short to other jobs so long as it is still playing by the same rules. RDM has a B in swords, so by comparison, it is always going to be inferior to the other sword users because we lack the attack power to drive a physical WS. Without a BLU to compare to, CDC on RDM is an amazing thing, but when the majority of the player base tells you that you shouldn't even touch a sword because you are a mage, then what is the point of even having the WS? We weren't included on Vorpal Blade, why should this be any different? The lack of consistency is troubling.

    RDM has strengths that we both agree upon. It has a large repertoire of mage gear and job traits that enhance our magic attack bonus. But it will never have the same spell execution as a BLM or even a SCH because we are stuck on Tier IV nukes. The obvious solution, for me, to get around that restriction is to channel that abundance of MAB into another vehicle for delivery. My best solution is an elemental WS that punches holes in mobs.

    Our other strength is that we are one of the toughest jobs in the game and can take more punishment that just about anyone besides a PLD. We already have reduced melee damage that is made up by hate-less enspell damage. We have the ability to stick on a mob and not draw as much hate as most jobs. We have the tools to be up front, we just have to be welcome there because we have something to offer.

    Why would I want a physical WS to be decent at, when I could have a broken elemental WS like Wildfire to flourish with?

    Why would I want to be 2nd rate at everything when I could have the best elemental WSs in the game? The reason RDM doesn't have good elemental WS isn't because they couldn't use them, it's because they were never given them to use.

    I have no intention of settling for mediocre on these boards because that might be the end of it for RDM. We should be good at something, but we aren't right now and that legitimately isn't our fault. We haven't gotten any specialized attention from the dev team and we are in really bad shape because of it. Blanket buffs like Almace/CDC and Tier ups are what got us here in the first place. Why should we want more of the same treatment? They haven't even fixed enfeebling and that is just the beginning of our problems.
    (3)
    Last edited by ManaKing; 01-18-2012 at 10:10 PM.
    I'm a RequieSCAT-MAN!

  3. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by ManaKing View Post
    Well I should think not. I doubt I've taken any time to try to substantiate a claim for being canonized.
    You get points for vocabulary.

    (0)

  4. #74
    Player Daniel_Hatcher's Avatar
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    Character
    Alvian
    World
    Phoenix
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    MNK Lv 12
    Quote Originally Posted by ManaKing View Post
    GG admits he doesn't play RDM anymore. I have no interest in listening to his or anyone's opinion on RDM unless they are actually willing to play it. If you can't suffer through another ambiguous RDM phase then I don't really have any interest in listening to an opinion from someone that has already given up and is crying/trolling from the sidelines instead of playing the job that you should still love to play.
    To be fair: RDM was my first job when I joined over 4+ years ago, and even when I joined when it was first released is the UK. I would class RDM as my main job, and favorite job at that. That being said, even I am doubting whether I'll be continuing playing it much longer. (I have most the gear I want, am capping my skills etc... but even I know that RDM adds nothing to the current endgame, and I'm only gimping my group by using it when I could use something that is better in the current content) Whether someone plays as the job has little relevance on their opinion of the job, in fact it could be argued as being more relevant as it means they find it no longer fun, or worthwhile to play as so something could potentially be wrong.

    RDM was never the greatest job to begin with, the only thing it had over other jobs was the ability to extend it's MP pool via Refresh and Convert, that and Enfeebles actually worked on quite a few things.

    Now these things are gone, RDM has shown it's age, and the fact it actually isn't all that.

    Basically my point being: Just because someone has stopped playing as a job, they leveled and played as it enough to give their opinion on where they think it needs improvement. (This doesn't include when they insult other posters, this or people that only leveled it to SJ or lower)
    (1)
    Last edited by Daniel_Hatcher; 01-18-2012 at 11:37 PM.

  5. #75
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    I don't see why it matters if someone says they don't use Rdm anymore because of the state of it. I certainly couldn't fault them. Aside from voidwatch procs, messing around with old content and Relic+2 trials I can't fault anyone for not using Rdm. I still do because I like the job too much, but once again, only because I'm doing the above + magian trials, since I have no interest in leveling Blm. If I did I probably wouldn't use Rdm much/at all either.
    (2)

  6. #76
    Player ManaKing's Avatar
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    Character
    Iocus
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    Phoenix
    Main Class
    RDM Lv 99
    It's funny NQ, because you're one of the few people I legitimately respect on these forums. It's pretty obvious to me that you still play RDM because you still have an air of realism about the job. The reason I don't listen to most of the people on these forums that will straight disagree with me is they have lost that and moved on to something else, usually elitist banter.
    (1)
    I'm a RequieSCAT-MAN!

  7. #77
    Player Psxpert2011's Avatar
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    Character
    Psxpert
    World
    Sylph
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    MNK Lv 99
    Dear Devs,

    I'll chat to you on the XIV forums, tata! Keep up the good work, never mind ffXI =P

    Your truely,
    PSX
    (0)
    "With the POWER of Taru...!"

    @@@~'~~~;SYLPH WORLD;~~~,~@@@

  8. #78
    Player TRiPP's Avatar
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    Aug 2011
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    Character
    Tripphacker
    World
    Phoenix
    Main Class
    RDM Lv 99
    My bad for the rant the other day, or week or what have you. I generally work overnights so I wrote that all with no sleep.

    However!

    This just seems like a civil war that needs to be squashed. We can't seem to come up with a simple agreement as to what Red Mage actually needs, we've got one side that squabbles over mage, other that squabbles over melee, others that squabble over enhancing, enfeebling and what have you. We need to find a ground in which we can all stand on and agree. Otherwise, I don't see this job going anywhere. All I've read so far is "OH BUT MELEE NEEDS THIS" or "MAGIC SIDE NEEDS THIS." Choose a common ground and work with it. I understand completely that Red Mage does have potential to be this or this but the Devs are hindering us currently. Which is fine, some make it work others can't/don't. So let's choose a common ground.

    Deep down, I know that the mages want to melee, but their inventory is properly filled with things for other jobs. So I can see that inventory can become an issue to the situation of fixing it. That or they don't pull enough in their linkshell to be able to grab people to allow them to net themselves an Almace. Or not treated importantly enough. lolrdm.

    I understand that it's almost the same for the melee side of Red Mage. However there's more to the mix than just inventory. More than likely it's the feeling of being tossed in the back like some sort of unwanted or unneeded trash. "Why come as Red Mage when you can come as another job?" Or even being stuck as a Pink Mage. (Mind you that I PVP as Red Mage. Melee style.) Granted I know that, that's not the smartest way to play or what have you, but I play the job how I damn well want just like the rest of you. Cause, that's just how I roll'.

    Point being; find a common ground and stomp the devs out with it. That's all there is to it. If we can't figure out as a community what we want. Then Red Mage shall forever be stuck in Limbo in because we sure as hell don't know what we want as a community.

    Again, find a common ground.
    Find a common ground.
    I'm restating it because I'm sure some of you will end up stating "OH BUT I WANT MELEE" or "I WANT MAGIC." or what have you. Simple as that find a common ground that we can all agree upon that needs to be fixed or added.

    I'm heading to bed, I've got work in several hours.
    Night you crazy kids.
    (0)
    BRD/RNG paving the way since lolrdm can't have lolcurev because lolwhm/drg would cry itself to sleep each night.

  9. #79
    Player ManaKing's Avatar
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    Character
    Iocus
    World
    Phoenix
    Main Class
    RDM Lv 99
    Oh we have common ground. All RDMs on this forum believe the job needs legit buffs badly. We just don't ever get any info from the devs so we fight like demons to pass the time until they show up and grace us with their presences. Seriously, Jobs broke, fix it. That's the common ground. Until they actually show any interest in doing anything for us, it is all any of us actually care about. Currently we have no time line and no specifics to quell all of this uncertainty.

    The bickering will continue until the job is fixed.
    (2)
    I'm a RequieSCAT-MAN!

  10. #80
    Player Mageoholic's Avatar
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    Id wager SE ignores RDM because every time a discussion comes up it devolves into a dick waving contest about melee. Guess what our melee is pretty decent at the moment, it isn't the best but there are a bunch of jobs who aren't the best, and some of those jobs can only melee. So suck it up.

    To the Devs:

    You gotta do something here its been about 8 years since you gave us any real attention.
    (0)
    There is no min only max. Or something like that.

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