Proc systems are so annoying. please do away with them forever

[Yarly]

I think you argue just for the sake of arguing at this point.

I agree with Karbuncle, why are you even posting here Alhahalnlm? Go back to your GE forums.

[Alhanelem]

I think you argue just for the sake of arguing at this point.

You think incorrectly. I state my opinion on a matter because I have one. It's not even intended to be an "argument," it's intended to be "discussion." But hey, go ahead, keep picking on me. If I support something, I'm going to say so. If I don't support something, I'm going to say so. I don't enjoy the arguing part and I don't do it just for the hell of it.

I agree with Karbuncle, why are you even posting here Alhahalnlm? Go back to your GE forums.

With such a useful, meaningful, carefully constructed post, one might ask you the same question. If you hate someone and don't want to see what they have to say, you have a blacklist. Use it. THe fact that you don't and proceed to comment and berate on someone tells me that you enjoy doing this sort of thing. I could be mistaken though. I'm not going to outright assume it.

Seriously. If the only thing you can add to a thread is a complaint about some other user posting, then just do yourself and everyone else around you a favor and just blacklist them and/or don't post it. It might not be as much fun, but at least then you don't contribute to the "crapping up" (as some people have put it) of the thread.

[darkhorror]

How about a proc system where every time you proc the mob gets stronger up to a point. The mob is easier to kill without proc's but drop rate is worse. With full proc the mob is a good bit tougher but gives better drops.

Or something like it gives you a couple options for objectives at the start of the fight. Something that gives a wide range of usefull jobs, but is something a little more interesting than just use certain ability. Where you work towards the objective through out the fight.

[Malamasala]

So you'd rather be told that you're useful for 30 seconds because they need you to use one weapon skill or job ability to proc, and not for anything else your job is really capable of? Know what I do on summoner in an abyssea LS event? use one sunburst or rock crusher and then just sit there and maybe throw one or two cures while the top three bandwagon jobs kill the NM- Any of several other jobs could have done the same thing. Hell, I could have done it on SCH too. Do they need my buffs? No. Do they want my BP Rages? No. All they want from me is the proc. I don't call that being useful, nor do I call it "promoting teamplay."

So? If this was the old days you'd only toss cures. It is a step in the right direction, even if SMN always needed a complete do-over.

[Ilax]

I like the PROC system when it come to NM, but for event like dynamis, its SUX, is reason #1 i never do dynamis anymore, i find that so retard that you have to torture a damn mob for 5 min long when you could have destroy it in 1 WS.

Let resume what Dynamis mean nowday... BST/DNC + THF/DNC Let hope SE learn about it and not turn salvage/nyzle the same way.

For VW trigger, you can thanks DEV they have trigger system, or i know a tons of JOB that ppl would never invite as they DMG output are useless.

[Alerith]

I demand Skillchain and Magic Burst procs.

"The fiend appears to be weak to high level skillchains" (Light/Dark)
"The fiend appears to be weak to mid level skillchains" (Level 2)
"The fiend appears to be weak to low level skillchains" (Level 1)
"The fiend appears to be weak to augmented elemental magic!" (Magic Burst)

Have fun you abyssea burned tools!

[LeaderofAtlantis]

They need to start putting more thought into their battle systems. Take a battle area like Qu'Bia Arena for example.

You have 2 tunnels that shoot off to the left or right of the main tunnel that gets you to the main arena. Have a creature in the main arena that has to be engaged first, but has -95-99% dmg taken at the start. After maybe 1% of its health is removed, it generates other creatures in these 2 smaller rooms that must be attacked in order to begin to reduce this amount. Give them high defense and they only appear for a short time, but as they take more damage with each appearance, you begin to lower the defense of the main boss.

Look, rip that idea apart, fine, but if you read 90% of the posts on these forums, it's all about "My job can't deal 9,999 dmg to X creature - why SE!?" or something like that, so giving us a twist (the proc system) on zerging is about all they feel like they can do to appease us, the player base.

[Alhanelem]

I demand Skillchain and Magic Burst procs.

"The fiend appears to be weak to high level skillchains" (Light/Dark)
"The fiend appears to be weak to mid level skillchains" (Level 2)
"The fiend appears to be weak to low level skillchains" (Level 1)
"The fiend appears to be weak to augmented elemental magic!" (Magic Burst)

Have fun you abyssea burned tools!

So wait, you want procs that require you to kill the mob faster, so that in essence you have *less* chance of proccing them than the already existing procs? great idea.

Also, just because someone "abyssea burned" doesn't mean they don't know what a skillcain or magic burst is. Many people who have done it have leveled up something from before abyssea even existed.

Fights should be fun and challenging because of the fight itself, not because of a generic system that forces us to act one way on all mobs that use it vs the way on all mobs that don't.

[Shadowsong]

I demand Skillchain and Magic Burst procs.
...Have fun you abyssea burned tools!

Like it doesn't take about 15 minutes to learn how to Skillchain. People really never needed 5 months of practice on Robber Crabs back in the day, we were just forced to do it lol

That said, I wouldn't mind SC and MB procs

edit: Poster above me hit a point. Mobs would have to have a little more survivability for these procs. Perhaps a weaker offensive/stronger defensive HNM, like Tiamat and shit was. Too much of this high offensive stuff makes zerging the real only option.

[Vold]

There are issues to solve that can be solved. It would be a mistake to abandon the proc system idea in general. Sure SE didn't get it perfect this first time around but how bout yo' ass develop a MMO and let us know how you do your first time with an idea. It needs to be refined so people aren't sitting on their ass waiting. Procs need to be on the fly and not so much a necessity. It would also be helpful if monsters weren't absolute murder so people could actually be at the front lines. Players can stop holding back and being bored.

No matter what you do with your game, ensure the people playing are not bored. If people are bored then you're doing something wrong. Ensure they aren't standing by waiting for a proc THEN you can do whatever you feel is necessary so that there is at least some possibility of losing, aka challenge. They used to be able to do this stuff. It was called "The Entire Game Before Abyssea"

My suggestion is to ensure monsters can withstand an assault by players for several minutes or longer to provide time for procs, procs not being an absolute sure thing and perhaps constantly changing every minute, and ultimately for procs to not be the be all end all decision maker for drops. Let procs give a small boost to drop rates. Something small enough that we don't feel crippled for not getting a proc. Players can choose whether to go after a proc or not. Let TH do it's thing, and let procs be that extra bonus chance at rewards that you happened to get while getting the kill. Procs should compliment TH. They shouldn't replace it. And they should compliment our gameplay overall, not dictate it.

And beyond that, design enough content to cover all of the jobs because it's fricking impossible to design one encounter where all 20 jobs are highly valued. Enough with gimmicks to get people to play nice. Design more Abyssea/sky/sea style content(and less of the event style, time restriction stuff) but this time put your foot down to cookie cutters and ensure all jobs get action. For example, Kirin 2.0 can only be engaged and killed by one of each of DRG WAR SCH DNC BLM PLD. Glavoid 2.0 requires NIN WHM MNK THF RDM BLU. Etc. Said 2.0 monsters would only drop gear useful for the jobs that can kill it. And subjob use would be heavily based on what you truly need and not so much all out zergfest. If you want TH and THF main isn't welcomed to a fight then someone subs THF. Common sense would dictate THF-less encounters get drop rate boosts anyway to match encounters that involve THF to balance it.

Point is the biggest drawback to MMORPGs ever has been imbalance among the jobs/classes. It's just not possible for them to be balanced due to human nature. There's too many of them and people never really want to play jobs as they are intended. So you have to let go of the ideals of epic battles of 18+ PCs vs a boss or more where balance exists and start designing content for smaller groups of players. It's simply the only way to go about it. Whether people are accepting of that truth is another story. Even after 15 years of MMORPGs people still hold hope for that perfect bliss because gamers and developers do not see eye to eye on what the definition of "usefulness" is. And it shows badly around these parks when every time a SE rep says that SE's intention for players is to do blank, the player reaction is, "ewww that sucks it gimps me, I want to play how I want to, not how you want me to" Hence why it's pretty much impossible to have balance in MMORPGs because Devs are more or less stuck to giving in to demands time from time to appease paying customers