Seriously, VW loot system..come on.

[Frost]

I think I am asking for trouble so, I simply ask this where do you put the line? I don't want to battle on something off topic, so I'll keep my opinion to myself. I am curious to hear what specifically you mean, if you are willing to share, if not I understand. Any job will do just a comparison around where the line is drawn.

I didn't/won't try to argue perle/pink/teal or those without macros are good.

It's completely off topic. But I will draw your line for you, in this one post and say no more.

When dealing with strangers, the "basic" gear for any job should signify a level of competence for the task they need to accomplish, and show they're a good choice among all available candidates.

You've been shot, unfortunate, but there's a couple people around offering you help:
A stranger in a swimsuit offering to take you to the hospital on the handlebars of their bike. They assure you they're fast.
A man visiting from japan, who might be offering his help as a doctor, or asking if you need one, but you can't quite understand him.
A paramedic in uniform, with a portable 'crash kit', and an ambulance.

Now unless the paramedic was the one that shot you, I think your choice is obvious.

[Kristal]

Even something as simple as the ability to convert an EX item into a Heavy Metal Plate or pouch of Heavy Metal Plates (for the really awesome EX items) would go a very long way.

This wouldn't be a drastic change at all, since rewards would remain individual and the items themselves would remain horrifyingly rare, but it would make a White Mage's second Toci's Harness while a broloved bro is still 0/159 a much less depressing sight.

Yeah, that's one of the better solutions I've seen.

People keep hammering that they want to add the drops to the loot pool, but utterly fail to do the math and logistics involved.
1% droprate on 18 people equals 16.5% shared droprate, so SE would have to nerf droprate just to keep people from obtaining everything in a single week.

And then there's the treasure pool limitations... if you allow 18 people dumping everything (including the kitchen sink) in it, chances are that that precious Toci's Harness is assigned to a random person anyway, if not outright lost to the void due to the logjam preventing anyone from lotting in the first place.

Point systems similar to einherjar to buy Toci's Harness wouldn't work either, because then people would simple spam the most economic NM for it and get everything that way. Specific NM points might work better, but even then you would only be able to buy Ocelomeh Harness, not the +1 or Toci's...

[Frost]

Yeah, that's one of the better solutions I've seen.

People keep hammering that they want to add the drops to the loot pool, but utterly fail to do the math and logistics involved.
1% droprate on 18 people equals 16.5% shared droprate, so SE would have to nerf droprate just to keep people from obtaining everything in a single week.

And then there's the treasure pool limitations... if you allow 18 people dumping everything (including the kitchen sink) in it, chances are that that precious Toci's Harness is assigned to a random person anyway, if not outright lost to the void due to the logjam preventing anyone from lotting in the first place.

Point systems similar to einherjar to buy Toci's Harness wouldn't work either, because then people would simple spam the most economic NM for it and get everything that way. Specific NM points might work better, but even then you would only be able to buy Ocelomeh Harness, not the +1 or Toci's...

First a mild correction, there's a hierarchy to items, Rare/Ex items don't get forced out of the pool. But there would be a similar issue with junk getting forced into peoples' inventories and items getting lost from getting forcibly filled. Luckily though, you'd still have 5 min to pass/drop junk before it's lost.

Also I think there's a mild inaccuracy in the logic. You see, the 1% drop rate items are coveted right? So at least for a pickup group, the desired item would be sought after by people going to the run. In essence, the 1% drop rate remains, and is only altered in the event one person gets the item multiple times in a row. If it was a linkshell run I could see your math being relevant, but ironically, it's in favor of the spirit of the game isn't it? Working as a group to improve your odds?

So it is a win-win in either case, I.E. it only comes into play when there's excess, or when you're deliberately trying to help someone that's unfortunate.

[Kristal]

First a mild correction, there's a hierarchy to items, Rare/Ex items don't get forced out of the pool. But there would be a similar issue with junk getting forced into peoples' inventories and items getting lost from getting forcibly filled. Luckily though, you'd still have 5 min to pass/drop junk before it's lost.

Rare/ex items do and will get pushed out of the pool, but only by similar items. Mundane items like logs will not, but they will still clog player inventories preventing you from lotting. If there are more then 10 ex items, the first one is auto-dropped. Many such items have been lost to the quirks of the pool already, and they will do so in the future.
Voidwatch would make that situation even more likely with a potential 60 items dropping at the same time.

Also I think there's a mild inaccuracy in the logic. You see, the 1% drop rate items are coveted right? So at least for a pickup group, the desired item would be sought after by people going to the run. In essence, the 1% drop rate remains, and is only altered in the event one person gets the item multiple times in a row. If it was a linkshell run I could see your math being relevant, but ironically, it's in favor of the spirit of the game isn't it? Working as a group to improve your odds?

The only inaccuracy is that the droprate is actually slightly higher, due to the chance of multiple 1% items dropping.
If your example was the norm, noone would object to the current system since anyone that has the desired items wouldn't bother going to fight the NM. And just because an item might drop to someone that actually wants it, doesn't do away with the fact that it's still dropping. It might also have dropped to someone else, which means anyone wanting the item gets the droprate of the group of people not wanting the drop. Some people might just be joining for the heavy metal.

[Doombringer]

gonna have to agree with frost here.

if i'm doing it with randoms, it means i want the thing. so the thing would not get thrown into the community pool. if i were in a situation where i would throw the thing into the pool, i just wouldn't go with the randoms.

if i'm going with my linkshell, then it hardly matters. i'll just go cuz that's what the linkshell is doing. if i get some thing i want, super good. if i get some thing i don't want, or i already have.. is it really so terrible that i might toss it to a ls-mate?
like "oh no, that nin who's tanking the apademaks for my almace while his own kannagi is still lvl 85 might get whatever the thing is sooner because i got it and don't need it"
sounds like quid pro quo to me. i'd love the opportunity to pass off some rare body piece i'll never use. it's better than putting it in my storage with all my other trophies... hell, i'd prolly do that for a stranger. (assuming i was already there and the thing dropped.. dunno why i would go out there for a stranger)


also, i take issue with this notion that a high droprate is a terrible thing. people talk about how there "will be" no content if we can donate rare/ex voidwatch drops.. i submit, that forcing the same fight to be repeated 300 times, is not the same as having 300 times as much content. yah... think about that one..

[Frost]

OK fine let me put it this way since it's a question that doesn't seem to get asked very often...

What's wrong with getting something in under 20 fights?

Have we seriously gotten to the point in FFXI where people are actually saying a 5% drop rate is "too much"?

[Tamoa]

Chances that you get more than 10 ra/ex item in loot pool after one single fight, is next to non-existant. And if there's 2 Toci's Harness (yearightlol) and 8 Aliyat Chakrams in the pool already, and you've got a chakram that you don't want aswell - you know, just don't add it to the pool?

[Neisan_Quetz]

Aha, aha, ahahahaha

Please, do call me when you get 60 rare r/e from a single VW run... ever... If you're lucky you might see 20 of the common r/e drop...

[Nynja]

Requesting an Ochain or Aegis Paladin is not unreasonable. Considering how few good Paladins there are, the ones that are at least 'decent' have one or the other. The Good ones have both generally. Requesting one specifically shows not only YOUR GROUP, current members and future ones, that you're taking this seriously, but it sends a signal to the PALADINS that YOU are taking it seriously, upping the chances of getting a good one.

I have an aegis and my pld sucks...

[FrankReynolds]

I don't remember anyone requesting that all loot be added to the pool at once. Why would the guy who got an extra toci's be so lame as to not announce that he was about to add it to the pool, and make sure that the pool was sufficiently cleared first? And if he did, how would that be any more frustrating than if he had just dropped the item on the ground?